Chimaera Posted March 16, 2023 Share Posted March 16, 2023 I love the chairs Alexandr. Very sleek and modern while still retaining the handmade elegance. Finally got back to the forge and tried my new anvil- it’s amazing! The metal moves so much more easily, and it’s actually flat! Started a piece of cable and Made a couple leaves, a little blacksmith neck knife, and a bar of twist mokume. I haven’t done mokume in a while so I seriously misjudged my initial welding temp and ended up with about 1/3 of the original stack. The rest is scattered individual quarters. I need to figure out how to clean and reuse them. This is my first time trying to make a rectangular piece of mokume. It definitely wanted to delaminate. I got it under control, but I ended up with a number of cracks. I don’t know if maybe I didn’t anneal it often enough? Anyway was a fun experiment, and hopefully I can make some necklaces or possibly a ring out of it. I think soon I will build a new mokume clamp and try it in the gas forge (this was in the anthracite forge, which gets hot but is very hard to control). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted March 16, 2023 Share Posted March 16, 2023 14 hours ago, alexandr said: HI ! Thanks! Google translate could not translate this phrase. Scrolls seem to be your trademark or specialty And you didn't have a scroll on the chairs, LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexandr Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 21 hours ago, arkie said: Scrolls seem to be your trademark or specialty And you didn't have a scroll on the chairs, LOL scroll свиток, спираль, перечень, манускрипт, список, завиток I am trying to understand. does not work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George N. M. Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 I think in this sense it would mean "spiral" or "coil". Many of your designs have a curled end in them, particularly what I call a "shepard's crook" which looks like a script written U. In fact, when I see that shape I think of it as an "Alexandr scroll." English is a funny and peculiar language (and I'm sure Russian and othe languages are the same) where one word can mean many things depending on context. And I agree with the evaluations of your chairs. If we didn't live so far apart my wife, Madelynn, would probably be ordering things from you on a regular basis. Keep on doing what you are doing. You are an inspiration to all of us. George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chimaera Posted March 17, 2023 Share Posted March 17, 2023 The curl or spiral is a blacksmith scroll. While they are beautiful and you create them very well, it is nice to see some of your work that is more sleek. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 Chimaera, thanks for posting the scroll picture to help Alexandr with the translation. I just read his not understanding scroll through the translation...getting to the party a bit late tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexandr Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 Guys, thanks! Realized. In Russian it is volute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George N. M. Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 Volute is kind of an obscure word in English but it does mean the same thing. A spiral spring in a watch is a volute spring. G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 Volute comes from the Latin “voluta”, which in turn comes from the verb that means “to turn”. It’s the same root from which we get “revolve”. Another common English useage is in architecture, to indicate the scrolls in the Ionic, Corinthian, and Composite orders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anvil Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 I think a volute has an ever changing radius, at least thats how I think of it,,, like a sea shell. A spiral on the other hand has a constant radius. There are 3 types of spiral stairs in the building codes(UBC? and all are based on a constant radius, or there used to be,, a sweep, a winder and a spiral. There are no specs for a volute. It's always a trip with the inspectors when getting one approved. Always best done before you start the job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott NC Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 "ever changing radius" I always thought that was an involute curve... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George N. M. Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 I think it has to do with how many dimensions you are dealing with. An involute curve that has effectively 2 dimensions is a 360 degree circle. In 3 dimensions it is like a coil spring. A volute with a changing radius would be a spiral like we have seen illustrated. A 3 dimensional volute would make a cone shape like grape tendrils or a coil pot that tapers in or out. (I beleve John made a yarn bowl like that.) "By hammer and hand all arts do stand." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 14 hours ago, alexandr said: Guys, thanks! Realized. In Russian it is volute. Great! Glad we got "scroll" figured out...volute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 The problem is that these same words often mean different things in different situations. 3 hours ago, anvil said: I think a volute has an ever changing radius, at least thats how I think of it,,, like a sea shell. Mathematically, a spiral is a curve that progressively increases or decreases in distance from either a single point or from an axis. That is to say, it can be either a flat spiral on a two-dimensional plane or a conical spiral in three-dimensional space. Note that because the distance from the center is always changing, the radius is never constant. 3 hours ago, anvil said: A spiral on the other hand has a constant radius. Mathematically speaking, that is a kind of helix. A helix is defined as a three-dimensional curve whose tangent is at a constant angle to a fixed line/axis. If the distance from the axis (the radius) is constant, the outside of the helix lies on a cylinder. If the radius varies, the helix forms a cone. In other words, mathematically speaking, three-dimensional spirals are conical helices, cylindrical helices are not spirals, and flat spirals are not helices. Where things get complicated is when you move away from mathematical definitions and into common usage. Mathematically speaking, a spiral staircase is not a true spiral, but a helix! The same applies to corkscrews, which are similarly helical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 Now, "volute" is simply a flat spiral, especially in architecture. "Involute" (and the related "evolute") is a mathematical term referring to a curve formed by a relationship to another curve. That is to say, "involute" is not the opposite of "volute". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexandr Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 Day off, and as usual at work. 2 final touches. Fireplace set in the dressing room and hallway to the bath. Wrought iron beams in the living room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 1 hour ago, George N. M. said: a cone shape like grape tendrils or a coil pot that tapers in or out. (I beleve John made a yarn bowl like that.) I have made a number of yarn bowls from flat bar (either straight or tapered) that curved out from the center of the bottom and then up the side. Mathematically speaking, these were neither spiral nor helical, although the bottoms were spiral and the sides were helical. I think it's entirely appropriate to call them "spiral" in the commonly understood sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 We have volute drivers every winter here. Beautiful work as always Alex! Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyBones Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 4 hours ago, alexandr said: Day off, and as usual at work. Aint that the truth. If not actually "at work" it is that honey dew list that will keep us working. Got this knife petty much to completion. Need to put a coat of poly on it. Ths may be the nicest one i have ever made and i think i will keep it for myself. So that also means i will dive into leather working becuase no knife is complete with out a sheath. Zebra wood handle, brass pins, and copper for the guard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goods Posted March 19, 2023 Share Posted March 19, 2023 Today, I finally got back to working on the hatchet my wife requested. I wasn’t happy with the last attempt, but this one will do: Made from forklift tine with a coils spring bit. Now to sharpen and haft it. Getting better, this one only took 5hrs from lighting the forge to start of tempering. Keep it fun, David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlpservicesinc Posted March 19, 2023 Share Posted March 19, 2023 David, Nice work. Why the added steel in the bit? 4140 does a decent job. Alex, I don't think you ever sleep. Your level of production impresses me every time you post a photo. For one person I don't see how you do it all. I would have to automate to even come close to what you accomplish.. Very impressive indeed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goods Posted March 19, 2023 Share Posted March 19, 2023 Thanks JLP. I’ve considered not using a bit in this material, but I haven’t done any testing with it for edge holding. I’ve made tools out it: hammers, swage, power hammer set tools, etc and they’re holding up quit weld, but nothing with an edge… The coil spring I’ve been using, I know will hold up. I guess I need to do more testing in order to make things easier. (The joys of mystery metal.) Keep it fun, David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anvil Posted March 19, 2023 Share Posted March 19, 2023 20 hours ago, JHCC said: The problem is that these same words often mean different things in different situations Most Every thing I said has to do with the building codes, UBC? As best I know they haven't changed. Again from memory Their are 3 types of defined curved stairway rails, a spiral, a sweep, and a winder. I don't remember the differencs. As I remember all three have this in common for the inspector: the rise and run are named and the measurement is taken "X" inches from the outside edge of the center of the vertical support. Seems that distance was 6 or 9 inches and I don't remember the rise and run at that point. The other commonality was they all three have a fixed radius. I've actually never done a spiral type on my own. I have done a few as a helper for other smiths. Think fireman's pole with a 36" or so tread length that has a section of pipe at the inside of the tread that slides over the center pole. The two I've done on my own were built around an "ugly" log center pole with half log treads mounted to the big ugly via a blind tenon and wedges in the mortise. Both had an ever changing radius and were approved by the inspectors before I did them. On both, the inspector( the same for both) said an ever changing radius did not fit code, but he would approve them anyway as long as I met the rise and run heights from the outside of the "Big Ugly". The inspector may or may not have been the one who associated a volute with a sea shell and that it had an ever changing radius. Beyond that, my last math was sophomore year, '67, engineering at U Colorado and I have very little remembrance from then concerning this. Heres a pic in progress of my second one. It's actually a half rise to a landing, then a straight run to the second floor. There lies the "Big Ugly, the treads and two of the forged iron stringers being fitted. I milled the treads with my alaskan mill and the rest of the log work was done by a good friend. Design by me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlpservicesinc Posted March 19, 2023 Share Posted March 19, 2023 4140 you can heat treat just like spring steels.. It will respond favorably.. Way back yesteryear and today, I use water for quenching 4140 but people today are more conservative and worry about water cracking.. 4140 has and does hold a decent edge. Axes and hatchets are one of those items that the edge meets a certain sharpness desire and then pull it back just a little based after use depending on the wood being cut. Black locust here is a great test wood.. Still pulling fingernail curls up is a good sign it will last a tad bit longer in hardwoods like oak, ash, elm.. Did you see the video of me limbing some black locust and maple about a month ago with the hatchaxe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goods Posted March 19, 2023 Share Posted March 19, 2023 JLP, yes I saw the video. Was the hatchaxe 4140? While I’m not sure exactly what this is, I treated this material like 1045 or 4140. (Some of the local smiths are convinced it’s 4130.) For all the non-edged tools I’ve made with it, it reacted very well to water quench. How’s the school coming along? Recovery been smooth? I’ve been missing not having new technique videos from you… Keep it fun, David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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