wd&mlteach Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 With the prices of anvils constantly rising at insane rates here in the States, it is starting to make me think a little bit more about anvil security. I currently live in the middle of town. My forge is on wheels and when I smith I have my garage door open for the all of the world to see. The folks that live in my neighborhood are nice enough. They know me and seem to like having me do my thing. I have always made it a point to make sure any visitor walks away with something like a hook, bottle opener, or hog-tailed turner. My hopes in befriending all of them is two-fold. Firstly, I hope that they do not turn me in for violating any borough ordinances. And secondly, I want them to know me, my normal hours and to keep an eye out for people other than me messing with my stuff. Currently, two of my anvils are mounted on stumps with spikes hammered over. I know the spikes are not a security option. They are more for keeping the anvils from jumping around when working with them. I have toyed with the idea of ditching the traditional stumps and welding together something a little more substantial. I would then lag the base to the floor and weld caps on the bolts to prevent them from being loosened. I guess, ultimately I could weld the anvils to the bases. But man that would just kill me and some of their value. That being said, I think I would be more disheartened to wake up and find them gone, so welding them is a real option at this point. I also toyed with the idea of drilling and tapping the bottoms and bolting them to the steel or wooden bases from the inside. Steel would be way easier in this respect, but it is possible with the stumps as well. I also know that if somebody wants it bad enough, they will get it. No matter how much I try to devise a way not too. I guess what I am looking for is some sane ideas on anvil security. What do you folks do to keep your anvils from walking away? I have locks on windows and doors, but locks only keep honest people, honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CactusBob Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 14 minutes ago, wd&mlteach said: I have locks on windows and doors, but locks only keep honest people, honest. No kidding, Last week I had someone, ( a neighbor no less) come onto my property while we were gone and steal 6 utility poles I had stacked up. Even to include cutting three of them with a chain saw to fit on their trailer. Since my anvil is outdoors I will be definitely watching this thread for ideas Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Unfortunately pressure sensitive mines are not an option in most countries... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigb Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 My anvils are all outdoors but hidden from view. I am in the process building my stand for my newest acquisition, my 149 lb A&H. My plan is to use a section of 1/4" steel utility pole (it wasn't me Cactus Bob!) since they are tapered and have a perfect shape to be able to walk around while being very stable. I will weld a base on the bottom (the wider end), cut the top to the proper height then fill it with sand. Then I will attach the anvil to a plate that fits just inside the top diameter and place it on the sand. Then I will weld tabs around the top edge of the base so I can still turn or level the anvil but it cannot be lifted out without grinding off the tabs. At least this way it will weigh enough to deter theft. The picture is a piece of utility pole I got at the scrap yard last week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foundryman Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Luckily here in the UK anvils are relatively cheap and plentiful so therefore less desiresble to would-be thieves. That being said, when I was moving my forging equipment to my new house last year a scrap metal collector drove past and asked if I wanted him to take all that "junk" off my hands. That junk was my 125lb brooks anvil 5 1/2" post vice and all my hammers and tongs. I declined his generous offer to take it away free of charge! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausfire Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 I hear lots of stories from visitors about 'grandad's anvil' and many instances of anvils going missing. One guy recently told me that his large anvil was in his garage and thieves broke in a stole it. Not only that, they stole his trailer to take it away. My demo anvil is nailed down with steel straps and my home anvil is bolted down, but whatever you do, if someone is keen enough they will find a way. I like Charles' suggestion. A dog with big teeth hanging around can be a good deterrent, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfudd Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 There are lots of relatively cheap alarm systems available, even some from harbor freight, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustAnotherViking Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Since many people use heavy chain to help deaden the ring, why not take it a step further.. Install a couple of ground anchors, and chain/lock the anvil to the ground? If it gets in the way, remove it and re-fasten when walking away. On the other side of things, I'm sure there's some form of insurance cover against theft... Doesn't stop potential theft, but means you at least aren't completely out of pocket should it happen... Just make sure the cover gets you close to the cost of a new one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exo313 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 I'd be tempted to stamp any anvils I owned with a custom touchmark. That way I can ID them if they show up online, and it's doubtful the thief would know what it's for and so therefore try to obliterate the mark. Show up to the sale with the stamp in my back pocket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfeile Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 It kind of helps to live in a really small area where word gets around quickly and be a combat pistol instructor and expert class competition pistol shooter. Some kids went up the hollow playing mailbox baseball one night and hit every house along the road except mine. I have mine chained to a wood block, and the block is lag bolted to a steel plate buried in the dirt floor. Someone could still get it with enough effort, but the dog would let me know they were there before they could. Admittedly, an 8 pound miniature pinscher isn't very terrifying, but she is a good alarm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exo313 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Although. If one could wire something up to trip an air horn when the anvil is touched, your average burglar would probably need a change of shorts after falling over themselves to get away. Better still: a train horn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 When I lived in the outer edges of the inner city of Columbus OH. I kept my anvil in the basement and carried it up the stairs, across the kitchen and out the back door to the stump under the tree when I wanted to use it. Only 91 pounds but it was a bit of a workout. I've wondered about a hidden hole in the top of the stump and a short length of chain mounted there to the bottom of the anvil so as they try to pick it up and carry it off it's brought up short; I don't see that as a booby trap; but it might be construed as one in a US legal case. Hmmm what about a bit of grease or never seize on the pick up points---purely for rust prevention of course... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MastaStan Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 I was only thinking about this issue this morning. Then it popped up... I had a thought about hiding a cheap tracking device in the stump if my anvil.... There's not much crime where I live but it still scares me to think It could go missing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigb Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 A guy on another forum does what I call a poor man's alarm. When leaving the shop he sets up a bunch of 2" pipes standing on end arranged so that anyone coming in will likely set them off in a domino effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Several posts referring to a very dangerous suggestion have been removed. Alarms are only good if someone hearing the alarm actually responds. How many times have you heard a car alarm go off in a parking lot, people turning and looking and no one actually going to the car, or calling the police? Putting the anvil and other valuable tools indoors or in a secured location is good. Out of sight is better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustAnotherViking Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Motorcycle disc lock alarm on the chain would be a relatively cheap deterrent, coupled with being locked to ground anchor bolts; should it be impractical to move indoors. Weld wheels to the stand so it can be tipped on end as a trolley to move it out of sight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS3900 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Having stuff inside helps a ton, but I am a strong proponent of anything that makes you look harder to burgle. Cameras, exterior lighting, and a real alarm system where someone calls the police. You want to try to convince them not to do it in the first place. A lot of people forget in the trades that once someone does get into your shop, all the tools are there to defeat whatever low tech "security" you have in place. How many folks have a grinder, cutting torch, or bolt cutters in plain sight in their shop? At that point, if an alarm company isn't calling the cops, or you are not recording them, they have all the time in the world. Also, make sure there are no "tools" easily accessible outside to help a would-be burglar. Whenever you talk about theft, I think of the flip side which is insurance. With the rise of the home hobby blacksmith and the parallel increase in anvil and tool value, I wonder how many home smiths have spoken with their homeowners insurance people about a rider to cover the theft of those items. Most of the time I see posts to the contrary about people afraid to call them in the case they're told a forge is a no-go under their policy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLAG Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 CMS3..., Wonderful. Thanks. I got so mentally involved in thought (yes I'm a little mental. Marg just yelled "a lot mental") about theft deterrent methods and suitable punishment, that I forgot about getting insurance riders. Having a smithy full of tools (burglar, smith, and others) would probably not excite these cretinous crooks. They are in a hurry, and any measure that will slow them down increases the chance that they will quickly move on to an easier target, elsewhere. SLAG. Glenn, a home alarm, in a residential neighborhood should arouse other residents. That observation does not include car alarms. I remember about 20 years ago, the over-numerous cheap trashy car alarms that polluted our peace and quiet, that could go off if you bumped into the car. etc. etc. Soon no one paid any attention to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wd&mlteach Posted February 18, 2018 Author Share Posted February 18, 2018 Thanks for the feedback so far. It looks we are already coming to the same conclusions. I know you can't stop them only make it harder/slower. I believe in keeping my stuff locked up when not in use. I will work on making it as tough as I can to take, creative mounting is where that is at. As far as noise makers go I put cow bells on all of my swinging doors. I hope if somebody starts prying on a door to bust the lock, the bells will start making some noise. If not just moving past them makes them ring. It also sounds like a general store on most days. Keeping along the door lines, I have also place old u bolts from a Jeep Wrangler in the tracks of my garage door. Even if they pop the lock, lifting the door is not happening until those are gone. As far as insurance goes, I have talked to my agent and I have raised the coverage for the garage. He recommended that I go through and photograph every tool from anvil to zener diode. Then drop the memory card off with him or upload the photos to a free Google account. I still have to do that individually for each tool. For now, I have gone through and shot a video tour of everything. It is a stopgap until I have time to lay everything out on the floor for family pictures. A few last things that I do now. One of them is to spray paint the handles of everything with glitter spray paint. Glitter, for those of you who do not know, is the Virus of the art world. Once you get it it is easily passed to everything you touch. I know it makes all of my stuff look, well not as manly. Folks who do not know me question it. But I just tell them I like purple and glitter. They just smile and shake their heads. I figure I have a heck of a time getting it off of my clothes after a day working, if somebody takes my stuff they will too. Even if they do strip it off, there will be glitter evidence somewhere. As for my last step in defense, I keep the cutting tip off of my oxy-a setup. I know once they get in they have access to all of my tools. The first tool I will not let them have the hot knife. Yeah, it means walking back in the house every once in awhile. But it keeps the tool away from any unauthorized users, even my boys. Plus, I would hate to foil a would-be theif with a great secure base design. Only to have them get huffy and run the torch over the face just out of spite. Man that would tick me off big time. I toyed with the idea of placing some expanded steel over the windows. I know it is not as heavy as a bar, but if it is done right it would slow them down. But then I threw that out when I realized the sides of my garage are wood boards. All one really needs is a crowbar and they are in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc1 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Bad idea. Glitter is a terrible polluter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Instead of glitter, use "clue spray" visible under black light. We solved many burglaries/thefts with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigb Posted February 19, 2018 Share Posted February 19, 2018 If you called the police where I live to report anything less than assault, armed robbery or murder they don't even show up. Phone or internet report only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted February 19, 2018 Share Posted February 19, 2018 8 hours ago, Glenn said: Several posts referring to a very dangerous suggestion have been removed. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted February 19, 2018 Share Posted February 19, 2018 Alpine among other venders make non staining non toxic smoke ejectors for auto and commercial alarms, if they can’t see to drive it off they can’t steel it, and neighbors get much more exited about the prospect of fire than your alarm. I installed one in my Moms 1960 sprite after some jack wagon stole the radio knobs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLAG Posted February 19, 2018 Share Posted February 19, 2018 I.F.I. Citizens, Please do not set up booby traps in order to discourage theft, or punish the thieving fiends. Those traps are very illegal and there is great body of law that displays cases concerning same. And some of those cases go back hundreds of years. (ah the good old days) These cases are known as the "spring Trap decisions". That is the phrase to search with, for anyone who wants to read up on that body of case law. Gripping reading I might add. One case to illustrate the tort is a decision, about 30 years ago, in Florida, where the owner of some vending machines resorted to them.. Some of his machines had been broken into. He rigged a booby trap with a blasting cap to 'catch" the perpetrator. The felon was successfully 'catched' but died in the explosion. Said vendor was convicted of manslaughter, or second degree murder or first degree murder (of the "depraved heart indifference" category). I do not, now, remember which crime. Incidentally spring traps were the type of booby trap resorted by people in the 1600's and 1700's. Needless to day, I have given up setting such deterrents a while back and so should you. Regards to all i.f.i. people. SLAG. Charles, thanks for the tip. I may set up one of the Alpine smoke bomb devices in the guest bathroom when one of them overstays their welcome. (NOT) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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