Kendall P Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 I was chatting with the wife and she showed me a fantastic program for veterans that was art based that helped veterans cope and come to terms with their experiances, I dont know about the rest of you but working out in the shop has always been for me at least very theraputic, I thought WOW this could be great as a therapy for vets so i decided to log on to IFI and open the floor to other folks. What do you think? does anyone think they could handle starting something like this up? maybe it`s already being done by some of you guys. Their might be a thread ive missed? Please feel free to chip in with thoughts and ideas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Geist Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 Sounds like a good idea. You think there'd be much interest amongst vets? George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keganthewhale Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 As a current Marine I know several people that are interested in it and come over to forge, however we aren't the guys that see combat, soi can't speak from that angle. However, it's a great way to destress and work out the day to day stress that accompanies the military lifestyle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 It's a good thought. I'll put out word locally my shop is open to vets who need some creative therapy requiring hot fire and hitting things with hammers. What I find therapeutic about smithing is the necessity for control. Competent forging requires a very high level of eye hand control in a fluid environment where the subject is different every time we strike it. Before we can control the outcome of a blow we must control all it's elements, it's intensity, position, angle of the hammer face, the angle and position we hold the stock, etc. Lots of factors to control with timing in the millisecond range. Let's not forget the fire, fuel air, etc. the heat time temp range, position, etc. etc. To control any of these things a person has to control him/herself. It's getting a handle on myself that I find therapeutic. Really, you can destroy the iron in many ways but you can't hurt it. It just doesn't care, it can't it's dirt we disturbed and converted to our use. If it could be happy I'd think it'd prefer being a seam of magnetite or a rust stain to being a plumber's snake. (I know that's a silly stretch but I rushed for an example of a crappy job) the point of that last bit is to say, there is NO satisfaction for us just beating hot steel to death, the ONLY satisfaction is in the creation of something. The transmutation of a piece of discarded just into something beautiful useful or just silly gives the old brain a positive boost, something to show off, brag about or better still show someone else how to make. Oh yeah, Smithing as therapy; GOOD idea. Let's just put the word out to the local vets, nothing a GVT. involvement can do but screw up a good idea. Ask a vet about getting help from the GVT. sometime. I think I'll mention the offer at church, maybe hang a note at the local Legion hall, tell the guys at the coffee shop. Word will get out, I'll hear from anyone who thinks it'll help. Frosty he Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george m. Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 This is a great idea and I can tell you from personal experience that the control and creative process is great for addressing stress and PTSD. I will contact the local American Legion and VFW to see if there is anyone around here with an interest. George M. Infantry Platoon Leader, 1st Cav. Div., Viet Nam, 1970-71 PS Someone could infer my military experience from the pin on my boonie hat in my photo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LawnJockey Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 A great idea for those that have earned more than we can ever provide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Ivan Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 I do something similar in my shop. Art therapy is an incredible way of dealing with whatever troubles you. I open my shop to street kids regularly. These kids are run-aways, homeless, drug addicts, mentally ill etc. By giving them a hammer and hot steel along with some instruction and also someone who came from those same situations to listen to them, its amazing how fast these kids start changing themselves for the better. Blacksmith work as therapy is the most amazing thing I have seen to help the hopeless and struggling deal with things. Through my shop alone I have helped 3 kids get off heroin by giving them something to look forward to and occupy themselves with (the hardest part of staying clean is keeping interest in something other then drugs). 4 kids decided to sort things out with their parents and return home with the hopes of setting up their own shop one day. 1 person got his GED and is trying to get into a welding program. All I have to do is give instruction on how to make what they want to make after learning some fundamentals and let them at it. I feel like the mix of "violence" and control that is blacksmithing really helps people who have problems. You can get your aggression out and learn to control it at the same time as making something useful/beautiful out of an otherwise static and boring piece of steel. So that said, I highly encourage folks to do the same if it interests you. The reward outweighs the cost of fuel/material/time tenfold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 Blacksmithing is like video games in that you get instant feedback on what you are doing, your work builds on what you have previously have done and your skills improve with practice.It differs in that you end up with a tangible item that *you* have made that can easily last for generations! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 Well said Ivan! Ever wonder about people who take classes to learn self confidence? How do you teach someone to be confident? People who lack confidence in themselves often seek escape and drugs are an easy way out. Can't handle the world? Run away, hide. Lack of self confidence is a B-A-D thing, PTSD just kills a person's confidence, eats their soul alive. What's this have to do with the topic? WE can teach self confidence. Confidence is the knowledge you can handle whatever comes. That's it, a mental tool box with tools in it. Real tools, not some silly mantra we learned to say to a mirror, "I am worth respect, I'm a good person." yada yada yada. Learn to make a spear and go out and SLAY THAT DRAGON! There is a soul deep satisfaction to taking two of humankind's oldest tools, fire and something to bash with to the thing human civilization is built on. Iron and steel; without them, we don't have anything so grand and wondrous as humanity has built and is building for itself. So there it is, you, fire, a bashing implement and bend steel to your will. Make the Earthly universal symbol of strength, durability and immutability dance to YOUR song. Anybody who can pick up a piece of debris, heat it and beat it into something: useful, beautiful, vital, valuable, etc. can handle whatever comes his/er way. A person who can handle whatever's coming feels better, is better. Dragon in your way? Pfffft, here dragon, dragon, dragon, come and get it. I got IT for you. And THAT brothers and sisters is self confidence. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rthibeau Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 gee.....and I thought I was doing it because it was fun. :unsure: But I agree that it is indeed a great therapy to hammer out your aggressions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaughnT Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 I definitely agree that smithing is good therapy. Some folks have said I have PTSD (non-mil related) and others say I'm just plain crazy. For me, smithing is all about focusing right there on the metal. I zone in on the project and quite honestly forget about the rest of the world. I remember reading about an organization that was helping wounded vets learn how to make custom knives. It received some good press and got a lot of help from the office of veteran's affairs as I recall. Were it me, I'd definitely contact the local military organizations and see if there wasn't a program already in the works that you could sign on to. A lot of the time, you can be paid for the time and materials the soldiers use - and that only allows you to help more Joes. Might be worthwhile to contact the Wounded Warrior Project and see what they have going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkaschner Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Might check out Don Foggs forum (Bladesmith's Forum?). Christopher Price and a few of his friends are doing this and looking for mentors and/or tools, materials and supplies. It is a wonderfully worthy cause and, as specualted here, seems to be extremely well recieved by the vets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Like Vaughn, I have PTSD, that predates my military service. In some ways the service agrivated the situation and in ithers it moderated it. For me, manipulating hot steel with a hammer and anvil requires a calm focused approach (not unlike what I developed to deal with a violent/dangerus situation). If your angery or distracted the steel wont cooperat, you cand bash it in to submition, you persuate it, somtimes gently, somtimes not so gently. It requires a degree of concentration, even wile heating the steel (i find bellows and hand granked blowers even better for this) that quits all the fragmentary thoughts swirling around. You focuse on the steel, anvil, hammer and "the feel" of what your bofy is doing for a few seconds wille the steel is hot, then wile the steel heats you have just enugh to occupy your mind to allow you time for contemplation. As to morale building in the disposesed, "your worthless" or "you aren't good for nothing" really has a hard time standing up to the reality of the tools, hardware and peices of art you have made. Horses have a simulare effect, as they give you emidiate feedback and, thi not as tangible, when that scared little colt calmly caries you down the road, bravely facing cars, trucks and dogs, its hard to not feel pride in bothe him and your self. With out your gidance, perserverance and calm deminior he would still be just the sum of 20,000 years of insticts. Long ago, my Dad sat calmy buy eating his lunch and watching me strugle with starting a transmition mount bolt on an old chevy truck. As I struggled Flustration turned to anger. He didn't get up and offer to help untile I had found myself and calmed down. Then of corse the bolt started befor he could walk the 6'to help me, lol. Just one of the leasons indelaboy branded on my mind by that Man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Turley Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 I'll just say this. I had a student who told me this. "Blacksmithing is the most REAL thing I've done since I left Nam two years ago!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 Either you have been at this an aufly long time Frank or the VA was giving him some powerful medication! Lol. As one of mastere seargents was found of saying, "since Mosses was a privat" ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGGUNDOCTOR Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 I have a friend with PTSD who found help through painting, so yes, I believe that smithing could be used for therapy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
divermike Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 I would be willing to assist any vet that thought it would help. I have many friends in blacksmithing that are old vets, must be something to it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WyoSmith Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 I originally got into smithing after a tour in Afghanistan. I needed something to do with my hands and getting lost in the metal and the hammer really helped out. I'm not good enough to teach others though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 Like Vaughn, I have PTSD, that predates my military service. In some ways the service agrivated the situation and in ithers it moderated it. For me, manipulating hot steel with a hammer and anvil requires a calm focused approach (not unlike what I developed to deal with a violent/dangerus situation). If your angery or distracted the steel wont cooperat, you cand bash it in to submition, you persuate it, somtimes gently, somtimes not so gently. It requires a degree of concentration, even wile heating the steel (i find bellows and hand granked blowers even better for this) that quits all the fragmentary thoughts swirling around. You focuse on the steel, anvil, hammer and "the feel" of what your bofy is doing for a few seconds wille the steel is hot, then wile the steel heats you have just enugh to occupy your mind to allow you time for contemplation. As to morale building in the disposesed, "your worthless" or "you aren't good for nothing" really has a hard time standing up to the reality of the tools, hardware and peices of art you have made. Horses have a simulare effect, as they give you emidiate feedback and, thi not as tangible, when that scared little colt calmly caries you down the road, bravely facing cars, trucks and dogs, its hard to not feel pride in bothe him and your self. With out your gidance, perserverance and calm deminior he would still be just the sum of 20,000 years of insticts. Long ago, my Dad sat calmy buy eating his lunch and watching me strugle with starting a transmition mount bolt on an old chevy truck. As I struggled Flustration turned to anger. He didn't get up and offer to help untile I had found myself and calmed down. Then of corse the bolt started befor he could walk the 6'to help me, lol. Just one of the leasons indelaboy branded on my mind by that Man. Well said........ :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 Wouldn't be worth a xxxx if it wasn't for that man, Arkie. Wouldn't have survived (or they wouldn't) raising rwo step daughters if it wasnt for horses. Been a wile, life has interfeared some, but a friend if mine and I spent the whole day hirseback reminding our horses that the crazy human world is in dead still outthere (riding the back roads in the middle if the oil (gas) patch. Good theropy, grand baby's birthday party and taking my lady fancing tomarrow. This why we cant give up on ourselves, thise we love and those that love us. We know what soul remching pain is, we can't let our friends and famaly face that, we have to percevier and find a way to live with what we have become. How to fetter our demons, and hiw to exept ours selves and manage our raging emotions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kendall P Posted February 16, 2015 Author Share Posted February 16, 2015 Weirdly enough as i had this thought for the first post in the thread Ive now found this campaign thats been started up check it out if you havent already! link removed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Scott Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 Its funny your bring this up Kendall P, I have been thinking of ways to start a program for veterans. Not trying to blow my own horn or anything but for back story I did a four year enlistment with the Marines starting in 2006. I did a deployment to Iraq and one to Afghanistan. I was with 2nd battalion 8th marines out of Camp Lejeune NC which is an Infantry battalion. We lost Marines on both deployments which is something I think about every day but it didn't stop there.We have lost many more Marines due to suicide that were deployed with my Battalion and have since returned to the states and moved away from the Corps. I often think what can I do to help fix this problem, because it is a problem but there doesn't seem to be a solution as it continues to happen. This is only one battalion of a big U.S. military, I don't care what branch of the military you come from something needs to be done about this growing problem.I struggled for years after leaving the military and had my own internal battles that I had to learn to live with. I think a lot of Veterans are struggling because they have such a void to fill. The void being the deaths of their brothers, not having the camaraderie they once had and also trying to find a job where they feel like they are being useful or making a difference. From my own journey through enlistment to deployment and then returning to the civilian world these are the struggles that I deal with everyday. Its not the same for everyone but I think that it would be very similar. I have made new friends but nothing can replace the relationships that were forged through sweat, blood and tears that I shared with my brothers in the military.Time is what I had when I was looking for a job, trying to go to college or just sitting around the house continually thinking and running through my military experiences. I think if we could reach out to the veterans and show them the way of the blacksmith we could help them fill their void of emptiness and despair. Nothing will every fill the void for us but there are ways to help change the empty feeling.When my forge is running and the metal is hot I can feel my emotions pouring from my body into the hammer and then into the metal. It has been such a positive experience for me, learning to blacksmith both mentally and physically. I want to share this with other veterans and I know that it can make a difference. This was a long post and I shared information that I would not normally share via the web. I feel that this topic has a chance to make a difference, even if it only helps once person or many.-MSR- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Scott Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 Its funny your bring this up Kendall P, I have been thinking of ways to start a program for veterans. Not trying to blow my own horn or anything but for back story I did a four year enlistment with the Marines starting in 2006. I did a deployment to Iraq and one to Afghanistan. I was with 2nd battalion 8th marines out of Camp Lejeune NC which is an Infantry battalion. We lost Marines on both deployments which is something I think about every day but it didn't stop there.We have lost many more Marines due to suicide that were deployed with my Battalion and have since returned to the states and moved away from the Corps. I often think what can I do to help fix this problem, because it is a problem but there doesn't seem to be a solution as it continues to happen. This is only one battalion of a big U.S. military, I don't care what branch of the military you come from something needs to be done about this growing problem.I struggled for years after leaving the military and had my own internal battles that I had to learn to live with. I think a lot of Veterans are struggling because they have such a void to fill. The void being the deaths of their brothers, not having the camaraderie they once had and also trying to find a job where they feel like they are being useful or making a difference. From my own journey through enlistment to deployment and then returning to the civilian world these are the struggles that I deal with everyday. Its not the same for everyone but I think that it would be very similar. I have made new friends but nothing can replace the relationships that were forged through sweat, blood and tears that I shared with my brothers in the military.Time is what I had when I was looking for a job, trying to go to college or just sitting around the house continually thinking and running through my military experiences. I think if we could reach out to the veterans and show them the way of the blacksmith we could help them fill their void of emptiness and despair. Nothing will every fill the void for us but there are ways to help change the empty feeling.When my forge is running and the metal is hot I can feel my emotions pouring from my body into the hammer and then into the metal. It has been such a positive experience for me, learning to blacksmith both mentally and physically. I want to share this with other veterans and I know that it can make a difference. This was a long post and I shared information that I would not normally share via the web. I feel that this topic has a chance to make a difference, even if it only helps once person or many.-MSR- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Ray Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 I know this is a old topic, But I tried to get the VA to pay for me to go to the blacksmith school in Old Washington AR. They told me that they cant do that for a hobby even if it helps. I was in the Navy 94-97 AMCM and combat crewman. I fell from a MH-53E and messed up my back. 2 surgeries and a fusion later I am trying to find something to do with myself. Its hard for me to deal with a lot of people. I have nerve damage in my legs so sitting all day or standing for that matter is not a option. But I can get outside on the ground, in the dirt and piddle all day. I like to tinker and work on stuff, and yes it helps. There are days that I cant mentally handle people but out under my little carport messing around with stuff sure makes the day easier. I have always worked with my hands, I work on my tractor, with my animals ,just being in the garden clears the head. just trying to find something the boys and I can do together. And keeps me from hating the world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 I recently met a vet with PTSD issues at our club meeting and it's been my honor and pleasure to work with him the two meetings he's attended. He's putting his own set up together at home and is getting together with some of the guys locally and working the iron. He says it helps him a lot.I'm shocked and embarrassed by how out GVT leaves our veterans in need but in my time I've learned to expect no better from politicians. Expect DC to help? Good luck.Blacksmith UP boys, blacksmithing is largely about self reliance. That doesn't mean alone it means learning how to do for ourselves and others with what we have. Since I was maybe 8 yrs old I loved the idea a person with next to nothing can find some scrap a couple rocks build a fire and make the tools necessary to make life better maybe even win.Life is hard and it hurts the only alternative isn't worth anything. Running away only helps in the moment if being chased by something you can't whip. I know it's no cure all but learning to turn discards into useful valuable things speaks more deeply to our souls than words. We have the power to MAKE things and making the world a little better feels good even if it's just a nail a nail holds things together and holding things together is a GOOD thing. It feels good to do good things even little things. when I'm feeling down I go to parking lots, help folk load groceries, get doors, just smile and it helps.Learning to make things feels good and if you're feeling bad do things that make you feel good till bad gives up.I know that's all rambly and maybe no help but it's what I have and I owe you guys so much I offer what I have. If you're close enough stop buy we'll go light a fire, make something and tell bad jokes till you smile.With deepest respect.Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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