Bantou Posted May 12, 2021 Share Posted May 12, 2021 9 hours ago, BIGGUNDOCTOR said: As for learning how to smith I would also suggest the videos made by our very own JLPServicesinc on the Tube. I’ll give them a try but I tend to learn better from a book than a video. Something about text helps keep the ADD squirrels in-line. Thomas, I downloaded a copy of The Complete Modern Blacksmith. It is definitely more my speed. His list of “essential starting tools” is a bit daunting but he makes good suggestions for building your own power tools. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elemental Metal Creations Posted May 12, 2021 Share Posted May 12, 2021 This followed me home yesterday. 126 lb Hay -Budden S/N A16845 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad J. Posted May 12, 2021 Share Posted May 12, 2021 Nice find! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pnut Posted May 12, 2021 Share Posted May 12, 2021 Is it your first London pattern anvil? Good score. Pnut Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elemental Metal Creations Posted May 12, 2021 Share Posted May 12, 2021 18 minutes ago, pnut said: Is it your first London pattern anvil? Good score. Pnut No, I also have a 75 lb Lakeshore (Montgomery Ward brand) Hay budden and a loner 300+lb unmarksd. I only had to give 400 USD tor it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted May 12, 2021 Share Posted May 12, 2021 For a Hay Budden in that fine shape made in 1919 $3.17 US per pound is a good deal. How did it do on the ring & rebound test? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elemental Metal Creations Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 13 hours ago, Irondragon ForgeClay Works said: For a Hay Budden in that fine shape made in 1919 $3.17 US per pound is a good deal. How did it do on the ring & rebound test? Rebound is about 85% and the ring is LOUD. My wife heard it in the house and she usually doesn't hear either of my other anvils. Is this one with a tool steel top and wrought base? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Yes, 85% is very good. Loud isn't really what you're listening for with the ring test, it's consistency. The entire face of the anvil should have a consistent ring it will change gradually as you move away from the sweet spot over the center. What you do NOT want to hear is a sudden change as in a dead spot/zone or a buzzing note. These indicate a spot that's lost hardness as in somebody used it as a bench to heat something else with a torch. A buzz indicates a place where the face is delaminated from the body, the weld between face and body is or has failed. A buzz will be dead as well, dead as in poor recoil and a tink or thunk rather than ring. Make sense? That is a BEAUTIFUL young lady, take care of her and your grandkids will be telling stories about grand Dad the blacksmith while they teach their grandkids the craft on her. She is one SWEET SCORE. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elemental Metal Creations Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 1 hour ago, Frosty said: Yes, 85% is very good. Loud isn't really what you're listening for with the ring test, it's consistency. The entire face of the anvil should have a consistent ring it will change gradually as you move away from the sweet spot over the center. Frosty, I understand what you are saying and it makes total sense. I did not fully understand what IDFC was asking. I did check and the tone is consistent throughout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 3 hours ago, Elemental Metal Creations said: Is this one with a tool steel top and wrought base? Yes Hay Budden started making the full tool steel top on a wrought iron base in 1914 if memory serves me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul TIKI Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) speaking of Hay Budden, there is going to be an estate auction about half an hour from here that includes a bunch of stuff from a blacksmith shop. Listed Items include a 108 lb Hay Budden Anvil, 200 hammers, a forge, and other tools. What would be a fair price for that anvil, assuming it's not damaged? I'm thinking I might go and I want to make sure I have the cash without over spending. I just looked on the auction website, the pictures of the anvil aren't great, but you can see the 108 on the stamped side of the anvil. that would be in hundredweight, wouldn't it? The other pics don't show any obvious flaws with the anvil. The edges look clean. I want to go for more than just the anvil now that I have seen the pics. Edited May 13, 2021 by Paul TIKI Found more information Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George N. M. Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Paul, if it were me and I really wanted the anvil I wouldn't go with less than $500 in my pocket and would probably drop out of the bidding around $400-450 or go to the full $500 if it were in really good shape. My experience is that at auctions blacksmithing items go for either very cheaply because everyone but you is interested in other things or go quite high because there is a lot of interest in those items. My auction advice is to keep a very tight rein on your own impulses and know ahead of time how high you will go for any particular item and stick to it. Even if it goes for one bid increment higher than you wanted stick to your plan. If you walk away empty handed you have still gotten an education on the value of blacksmithing items. I have been shocked, shocked I say, at how high some things have gone. "By hammer and hand all arts do stand." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGGUNDOCTOR Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 No, it is straight pounds for American anvils like HB Also watch out for buyer's premiums and other fees that raise the price Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elemental Metal Creations Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 27 minutes ago, Paul TIKI said: speaking of Hay Budden, there is going to be an estate auction about half an hour from here that includes a bunch of stuff from a blacksmith shop. Listed Items include a 108 lb Hay Budden Anvil, 200 hammers, a forge, and other tools. What would be a fair price for that anvil, assuming it's not damaged? I'm thinking I might go and I want to make sure I have the cash without over spending. I just looked on the auction website, the pictures of the anvil aren't great, but you can see the 108 on the stamped side of the anvil. that would be in hundredweight, wouldn't it? The other pics don't show any obvious flaws with the anvil. The edges look clean. I want to go for more than just the anvil now that I have seen the pics. The weight on H B anvils is in pounds so that is a 108 lb anvil. Fair price depends on several factors including area, how much you need/want it, condition, and how much you have to spend. If I had it at to spend I would not hesitate to pay $4 a lb for another good Hay- Budden and I don't need one, I have 2 already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul TIKI Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Thanks for the info folks. All that said it might jump out of my price range, but maybe not. It's hard to see in the pics, but it looked like a clean, well appointed shop. A lot of the focus might end up on other items there, but since I'm not an auction guy I have no idea. I guess it's a case of "treat it like a trip to the casino". I would like to see if I could score a good hammer or two and maybe some tongs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobtiel1 Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 I got some books from the library delivered today. As well as some dutch books, the first one you might know, as it's translated from english, the second one is a reference book for blacksmiths, looked through it and already saw a lot of pictures of ornamental gates and other such ironwork. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 The Thomas book has some good photos in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donal Harris Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 eBay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 Couple of copies of Practical Blacksmithing on abebooks for under US$12.25 shipping included. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 On 5/13/2021 at 9:05 AM, Paul TIKI said: All that said it might jump out of my price range, Paul: I suggest a little adjustment in your expectations, it'll make you a better bidder and bargainer. Rather than expect it to "MIGHT" exceed your walking price. Set in your mind that it will PROBABLY exceed your walking price. (limit) Learn to at least PRETEND indifference to irrelevant "features" like age and rust, they don't make it an antique or vintage. The auctioneer will talk it up loudly and without much notice of reality. It's their job. Don't hesitate to talk it down to the audience around you, mention every flaw especially how tiny it is at 108lbs. The auctioneer will be working the crowd so can you. Lastly go examine the things in advance and make a cash offer to buy it ahead of the auction. Seriously, YOU are a "REAL" blacksmith you know your stuff and they'' be lucky to get a couple hundred for it. Forget what people are asking on the internet, they don't show sale price because they aren't getting asking. Work the auctioneer, they're going to work you, you know. Yes? All's fair. A good tactic while working them down to a cash in advance sale is to point out a couple things they're underpriced. You don't really care if the leaf springs doesn't sell for silly too much do you? A little "expert" advice can get you on their good side when you need it. Oh and #1 attitude change is about finding what you want at auctions, they're at the top of the price curve, just under antique stores. Best of luck, that's a good size anvil, especially for a portable. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 Might be more likely to get a cash offer accepted if you also commit to buying some of the hammers or other tools. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 I've had luck at auctions when they lump a whole lot of stuff together by buying the stuff I want from the person who wins the bid---once it was tongs in a box of woodworking tools. The Bid winner wanted the woodworking stuff and was happy to sell me the tongs much cheaper than I would have paid. (Of course this doesn't always work, sometimes they want the same stuff you want; or wanted pretty much the entire cost for the items you want.) One of the easiest ways to save money acquiring smithing stuff is to already have enough of it that you are not desperate to buy more. Then only stuff being sold way to cheaply follows you home. (I have "buy points" set for most items I might run across, if it's at or under my buy point I will buy it, if it's over I'll ask if it can go for under my by point. If not, walk away smiling!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donal Harris Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 What is the bottom leaf spring called? I plan to cut a hammer drift out of it. Other than that, who l knows. Maybe one of those large cleaver things they use to split hogs in half. The coil springs, once safely removed, punches, chisels, a drifts. This thick plates with holes in them, who knows. Likely just leave them in a pile for my kids to dispose of some day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 I think it's called "Looks like too much work for a hot day". I'm making a hammer drift from a pick end I hot cut off. Funny think I've been running into old pick's at the scrap yard lately and need to figure out some stuff to make from them. (The old mining pick is up on the shop wall, the others on the possibles pile.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 Got my very first oxygen cylinder! (Sadly, there wasn’t quite as much room in the budget as I’d assumed, so I had to get a smaller one than originally planned. I’ll need to modify the cart a bit to make sure it’s secure.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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