Make a Nail Header?

[SReynolds]

I was reading how to. And it looks quite scientific in terms of the angle of the punch required. It looks like I need the aid of a mathematician and mechanical engineer......? So this youtube video I found is not at all like what I read.

Used a horse shoe pritchel to drift the square/taper hole. Is it really that simple or does the pritchel really NEED to be an exact angle in the fourth degree?

 

I am not concerned with the steel stock used for the pritchel nor the header......I am asking about the dimensions of the pritchel and the hole it must make for the nail header.Any incite will be great.

[Charlotte]

I've made hail headers with out paying much attention to angle.  I just forged a convenient taper and punched.  My headers seemed to work ok. 

[Frosty]

Sorry Mr. Reynolds, your worst fears are WAY too optimistic, unlike every other process where hand forging is concerned nail headers require a minimum of 8 decimal place accuracy in all dimensions. And whatever you do don't forget it must be painted the right shade of titian red! 

Put the calculator by the checkbook and just draw a long taper to drift the hole you punch. Dome the header a little first, punch if from inside the dome over a bolster or the pritchel hole. Then drift it a little with the tapered piece, a nail works fine, heck perfectly. Drift from inside then from outside. The outside or top drift only needs to be a little, a touch so the nail blank can seat without jamming.

See, not ONE decimal!

Frosty The Lucky.

Edited August 21, 2015 by Frosty

[ThomasPowers]

No matter how carefully it's done they will wear with use.  I tend to have an undersized one handy for students who couldn't control the hammer when tapering near the transition.

[Frank Turley]

1. Just made one out of S7, forged the handle away from the head and with a tapered round punch of H13, punched all the way through bottom to top of head. It took quite a few heats. Three or four licks, and the punch was withdrawn to prevent upsetting the punch end. When the punch business end bucked against the anvil face, it was time to turn the piece over to back-punch the thin burr. Annealing then allows for some cold work, perhaps trueing up the hole with needle files. Then air hardening and tempering for hot work. S7 lasts quite a while in use before getting 'wallered out.'

[Glenn]

Do a site search for "nail header" and Found 242 results including this diagram in the 2nd hit.

[Dogsoldat]

A really good tutorial for nail headers. Few different ways to make them and what makes a good header.

[SReynolds]

I do understand the concept. I make round shank (pin/rivet headers) from old crow-bar stock. Don't know what it is, but it hold up well and can be made quite hard if quenched.

The nail header is different in that the hole is square. I was informed one must employ the "non-locking" taper in order to punch (square) the hole. So the non-locking taper obviously is a myth.............

[Charlotte]

I find it easier to forge a square punch than a round one.  As I said convenient taper.... something less than 45 more than 12.  Look at  pictures above.  should give you the idea.

 

[Jacob Nothstine]

I used the plans on anvilfire.com project number 48 under the iforge how to. To make the square hole I used a small hand file tang, I think it was a round file. Kind of looks like a nail if you were to cut it off the file. The nail header I made worked fine.  

[Frosty]

Don't over think the thing S, it's really pretty straight forward. I knocked this one out for a friend who wanted to make nails for his cabin. Well, actually he wanted to buy hand made nails till he found out what he'd be charged. The idea behind this tool is NOT needing anything but a hammer and camp fire or wood stove to make small items, nails in particular.

In the pic with it laying on the anvil with a couple sample nails the bar across the stake is a stop to prevent the tool being driven too deep in use AND it's the hot cut. Unfortunately the fellow I made it for isn't really a tool using kind of guy and and broke it right off using it to drive the stake into a log. <sigh>

Anyway they aren't something to over complicate like this example.

Frosty The Lucky.

 

 

[SReynolds]

Thanks guys!! I will commence nail header construction. I have several from the Blacksmith's Depot and would like to make my own only for bragging rights. I really don't need them.

[Shamus Blargostadt]

Would like to see the outcome S.. you're not the only one struggling with this. I've been trying to figure out how to make a "square nail" (and failing) with more effort than I care to admit.

 

[SReynolds]

Students in my class snicker when I tell them the nail is one of the more difficult lessons. I show them two common methods and they can't do it. The nail headers from Blacksmith Depot are nice. They sell different sizes. I am told that apprentices had to make 100 per hour. Requires one heat to do it.

I just can't believe it. No way. I can make a 1/8th inch nail in maybe 1.5 min. And it's a short one. And I want to do no more than a few in five. Maybe for fun I will try different hammers............see if I can make one in a minute. But not 100 in an hour for hours on end. That just isn't believable.

I'd like to see a 1/4 inch nail 2.5-3 inches long in one minute/one heat. I make them at the co.fair for the crowd in maybe 4 minutes each. I can cut that down if I use about three different nail irons, but then timing is difficult to calculate per nail. 

[Glenn]

Being quick takes practice.

Making the header is rather straight forward. Take a piece stock and form a square taper the size of the nail you want to make. Heat a piece of flat bar, place it over a short piece of pipe, hold a ball pein hammer on the flat stock and whack it a couple of times forming a dome. Drill or drift a hole in the top of the dome and with a good heat on the dome, insert the square taper. Reverse the dome and insert the taper from the bottom side forming the hourglass with the bottom of the hour glass being larger than the top. Adjust as needed.

When you form the taper on the nail stock insert it into the header until it catches. Add 1-1/2 times the diameter of the parent stock above the header and cut with the hot cut leaving just a bit to hold the nail to the parent stock. Heat the nail, insert it into the header, and twist off the nail from the parent stock. Place the header over the prichel hole or the hardie hold and give it a hard deliberate blow straight down. This will form the head on the nail. If you whack it again N, S, E, W you can achieve a 5 flat decorative  nail head. 

Yes that is 2 heats but you are learning and success is addictive. 100 nails later you can modify your hammer strokes, and your technique so you can do it in one heat. Keep the tool cool.

I built my headers from mild steel and after years of use they still serve me well.

Edited August 26, 2015 by Glenn

[Frosty]

If you get the rhythm the stock will stay hot but your blows have to be accurate so as not to waste time and energy. With practice you can draw the taper really quickly especially if you use the method taught by Brian Brazeal.

Start at the tip, draw to the desired thickness in a short steep taper, turn the stock 1/4 turn each blow, just back and forth. Then lay the stock down just a little so it's resting on the corner between the stock and the taper. Repeat the first step till the second bevel meets the point. Lay it back a little and repeat.

The reasons to use this procedure is to take advantage of the basic physics that govern forging steel/iron. #1. Force always takes the path of least resistance. #2, The smaller the area energy is applied to the more ft/lbs. of force is imparted. #3, By rotating the stock every blow you are minimizing the contact area on the anvil reducing heat conducted away. Also, call this #3A. When the steel is smooshed opposite sides are flattened between the hammer and anvil making it pooch out on the sides. "Moosh a little gum, clay if you can't visualize this. With the sides pooched out when you roll 1/4 turn, 90* the point in contact with the anvil is maybe 0.000 decimal places as much area, same for the contact with the hammer. Resting on a tiny point means WAY less heat sucked out by the anvil and as a HUGE dividend impact from say a 1lb. hammer is on a couple 10,000ths of a sq. inch. So instead of say 100 inch/lbs. of force the work is experiencing say 300,000 inch lbs. and all that force is taking the path of least resistance, a straight line between impactor and anvil for maximum effect.

Okay, that's why rolling 1/4 turn between blows is such a GOOD idea on anything you're forging is shape allows it. Now we get around to why you forge such a short point first. Again the first blow on the stock has the stock laying on the anvil on a corner for minimum anvil contact AND the hammer is hitting the opposite corner, minimizing impact area maximizing in/lbs. force. 1/4 turn and the new spot is even tinier so force and effect is again multiplied. roll it back repeat. 2 repeats and the stock is to a short SHARP point. So lay it down a LITTLE so all that's touching the anvil is the corner between the shaft and the bevel. Strike, turn repeat and you have a uniform taper 4x as long as the stock used. Lay it back again, strike, roll, repeat.

Now you've turned about 3/4" of 1/4" dia stock into about 2.5"-3" of square taper to a point. And guess what if you do it fast the stock is STILL HOT enough to score it on the hardy, poke it in the header two bends and it's parted and ready to be headed. Another maybe 5-6 blows and it's a nail.

One heat, one nail, 20-30 seconds. An apprentice might take almost a minute but not a pro. Don't get me wrong, I can't do it, I'm not good enough but I watched Peter Ross do it on the Woodwright's shop in just about that much time AFTER spending almost 2 minutes making a header while keeping up a patter with Roy.

This is why making nails is such outstanding practice, there is a set goal, the one heat nail but you have to go fast and be accurate. FAST accurate isn't easy at ALL Atall.

Frosty The Lucky.

[gote]

Thank you Frosty, You explain not only how but WHY and that is the valuable part. Too often advice is given without any explanation. I have never thought about avoiding heat loss when drawing a taper. I have just tried to be as fast as possible. I never make nails but this thread makes it tempting.

Göte

[Frosty]

I learned it from Brian Brazeal a couple summers ago and he explained it better than I. It's my pleasure to pass it along.

Frosty The Lucky.

Edited August 26, 2015 by Frosty

[ausfire]

It takes me four heats and about as many minutes to make a nice 3 inch nail from 3/8 stock with a well centred head and faceted top. I know that's slow compared to you guys, but I have no NEED to do it in one heat. I'm not an apprentice with the boss man looking over my shoulder, so I just 'takes me time' and enjoy the journey. 

[SReynolds]

I have never seen Brian make a nail. I know he has many videos on youtube and have watched a few. Is there a video of the nail method?

[ThomasPowers]

Note too that the steel used makes a difference; a nice clean low carbon steel is a lot easier/faster to forge than say A36 on the bad end of it's loose spec.

I've been forging a while now but I still cant forge a RR spike into a nail in one heat by hand....now with a powerhammer it's a cinch...

[SmoothBore]

Note too that the steel used makes a difference; a nice clean low carbon steel is a lot easier/faster to forge than say A36 on the bad end of it's loose spec.

AMEN.

Recently made some 5/16" diameter, tapered "pins", , ... very similar to "nails", ... for use in the construction of a wooden boat.

The material was some kind of Stainless, with a lot of Chrome content, ... salvaged from old Oven Racks.

It was an absolute b!tch to upset and draw out, ... but made very nice finished parts.

.

[SReynolds]

I make short rivets/pins the same way a nail is made. I don't draw to a taper obviously. I draw it down and round it. I make a shoulder (like I do for a  nail) and that sets it into the header with a stop. No need to mark a spot to cut. the shoulder is the bottom of the head. Upset like a nail.

[Frosty]

Brian demoed making tapers efficiently, not nails though a taper to a point is a taper to a point.

I forgot to mention this, keep the point of the taper JUST inside the anvil's edge and use half face blows. This causes the steel to taper automatically while rocking it back makes it an even taper.

Let's see if THIS try get's forbidden.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Nobody Special]

And people say that the passion and art of nailmaking is dead...  I can't do them in one heat. Takes me usually two, sometimes three for small stock. More for a big one. Oh well. My nail header is an ugly, primitive looking affair, made from a rr spike.

What are handmade nails running for these days? I knew a guy that was turning them out for something like a buck apiece a couple of yrs ago.