JLP Blacksmith Teaching Center.

[jlpservicesinc]

22 minutes ago, Irondragon ForgeClay Works said:

The possibility exists that sometime in the distant past, someone started to restore it and only got as far as de-greasing it with a caustic solution of some sort. Then something happened and they never got back to it.

I'm starting to think this might be the highest possibility.     The arm for the auto feed ratchet is missing but the bolts are in the holes..  Also there is a wear pattern on the cam gear which shows it was in use for a number of years.  The tract where the bearing rode on the cam.. 

It's the only thing that makes any sense.. 

George this came from Blanford, MA it's about 1hr 20 minutes from me.. So that puts it out in the Berkshire's.. 

If all the items were equally rusted I'd say it's because of altitude.. They sit about 1100ft above sea level. 

Here are the rust rings..  The area under the gears and drill body were extremely rusted.. The polish is because of turning the gears while freeing them up and on some items using abrasive paper to clean things up to move easier. 

[jlpservicesinc]

ok, so the last weeks it's been interesting with high temps and lots of horses to do. 

After getting the drill cleaned up and everything freed up I put it on the side so I can order new bearings for it. 

With this, I resumed work on the inside with pulling the insulation down from the front wall on Thursday.. 

Since then I have spent hours organizing and cleaning the smithing side to find room so I can move items over more for more work room.. 

I sorted all the screws, nuts and bolts used in building construction and sorted all the items still needed. 

So, today I finished the final cleaning and organizing..  So now I can get back to work and work quickly since there is room again and items have all be sorted. 

I sorted the anvils by brand.. 

[jlpservicesinc]

So last weekend I asked my buddy Andrew to come over and help with wood detail..  The plan was to go get a tree that was taken down on the side of the road, then move into getting the Cannedy Otto moved and the 201 Champion drill press mounted in it's place.. 

After a little looking and thinking I decided it was best to just deal with the drill press exchange including mounting the Cannedy Otto onto the back position..   This needed to have a new mounting surface installed because of the rear braces..  

Turns out that my figuring that the Cannedy Otto sitting on the back of the frame all by its lonesome was challenged by the fact it then became unstable..   So to correct his while we installed the Champion we had to weight the other side. 

Took about 30lbs of ballast to get it to be ok.. 

Once the 201 was installed I could climb on the Cannedy Otto and it would not budge. 

Over the last few months I've been giving Andrew lessons on welding.. So was good time for him to get MIG time in.. 

[Frosty]

Nice Jennifer, a double bitted, cordless portable drill. 

I can't tell in the pic, do the wheels have locks? You might get the stand wanting to move around when you crank the drill. Or are you putting a motor on it?

Frosty The Lucky.

[Rojo Pedro]

Wow Jenifer that is a nice collection. 

[jlpservicesinc]

On 6/14/2021 at 6:58 PM, Frosty said:

Nice Jennifer, a double bitted, cordless portable drill. 

I can't tell in the pic, do the wheels have locks? 

Frosty The Lucky.

thanks..  That is cute..  Yup, dual cordless portable drills..  LOL.....  Ha, ha.. 

No wheel locks..  I might have to put some sort of locks on them but with the urethane wheels its kind of locked into place until you start to roll it.. 

something I never knew about the Urethane wheels is they are great with lighter loads but once you get to a certain weight point the urethane compresses some and they don't want to roll until you get them moving.  

Unlike solid steel wheels which roll super easy with or without load..  I wanted the urethane to minimize damage to the floor. 

I'm not really sure if these will be used with students or not.. I have 3 other electric full sized drill presses for them. 

The neat thing about these units is the electric aspect..  Both hand crank and electric motor. 

The Canedy Otto has a pinch bolt to move the gear train out of contact with the electric motor for easier hand use. 

The Champion had some sort of device on it and the motor was underslung..   I'd love to find a photo of the Champion with electric motor on it. 

[Frosty]

I'm looking forward to seeing yours when you get them ready to work.

Frosty The Lucky.

[jlpservicesinc]

Frosty, I'm looking forwards to getting all the stuff setup..   I put the legs into the old Buffalo forge and put a blower on it so technically there is a forge in the shop..  

Today was a good day.. I installed all but 1 sheet of siding where the electric panels are going..  

I'll try to get it installed tomorrow and then can start to run the conduit in.. 

I need to come up with 2 wireways.. I have 1 that needs fixing..   so really only need 1 more I guess. 

[jlpservicesinc]

Latest addition to the shop..  

 

Oster 784 threading machine

 

[Ted Ewert]

That's a beast. Handy though if you're plumbing in gas for the shop or making large bolts. Do you have plans for it?

[Frosty]

The plate on the side says, "Pipe 1/2 - 4" and "Bolt 3/8" - 3"

I can't think of either a pipe nor bolt thread of those TPI. Do you know what the plaque signifies?

Frosty The Lucky.

[jlpservicesinc]

1 hour ago, Ted Ewert said:

That's a beast. Handy though if you're plumbing in gas for the shop or making large bolts. Do you have plans for it?

Gas plumbing here for propane or natural gas depending on pressure can be threaded or welded.. Anything over 10psi for propane inside a building has to be welded pipe..   

I do,,  Thread bolts or nuts and/or use it for twisting bar stock. 

41 minutes ago, Frosty said:

The plate on the side says, "Pipe 1/2 - 4" and "Bolt 3/8" - 3"

I can't think of either a pipe nor bolt thread of those TPI. Do you know what the plaque signifies?

Frosty The Lucky.

That is just the sizes and capacity it can do..    So it can run from a 1/2" pipe up to 4" pipe size and can run from 3/8" to 3" bolt size..  there are adapters to go smaller.. But 4" is the largest it will hold.  I think a 3" bolt face diameter is the largest the chuck will hold so is the limiting size for bolts.. 

Ideally they can be any thread combination needed for the given item.   

This unit came with the adapters for 4", 2" and nuts as well as nipples..  They have nipple adapters so they can use really short pieces.. 

Unlike a portable machine this would be used as a production type environment bolted down. 

Manual

784 Manual (1).pdf

[Frosty]

Size range makes a LOT more sense.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Ted Ewert]

Never thought of twisting steel, but a great idea. Did it come with a bucket of thread dies?

[JHCC]

Rather like Ric Furrer’s monster twisting machine:

 

 

[jlpservicesinc]

https://www.ostermfg.com/thread-machines/oster-784

 

[Frosty]

Well darn, those are both impressive machines. If you get yours going Jennifer I'd sure like to see a video of it in operation.

I also noticed how the bar in Rick's twister kept getting hotter. I sure appreciate him carrying on a narrative rather than music. I was also impressed at not being able to hear any motor or machine noise, that must be one torquey machine.

Frosty The Lucky.

[jlpservicesinc]

Frosty, I will post a video for sure..    I will make a few square bar holders and a slip vise..  The nice thing is the rear of the machine has the threaded cut off tool and the steady rest.. I'm pretty sure the steady rest could be made to hold a square die/vise setup.. 

Today I got the accessories cleaned up..

this machine has all the optional items that I could see..  Has the nipple holder for both 1" to 4" which is actually 2 separate holders.. They have a neat slider inside with a special lock that keeps the nipple from feeding in more and getting stuck. 

It has the small die head with adapter, the smaller die head has no dies with it so will try to find some.  the large die head.. 

And 3 extra sets of dies for the larger die head.. 

[ThomasPowers]

Ric's machine was a lot more impressive than having a couple of smiths hooting as they twisted some 1.5" stock with a custom built wrench with 4'? extensions on the sides.   (But doing it by hand was a "hoot".) Now for production work MORE POWER wins hands down over more Powers!

[JHCC]

Wouldn't that be "Powerses", Precious?

[ThomasPowers]

Been a bunch of decades since anyone called me "Precious"; precocious yes, precious no! (And preposterous on a regular basis!)

[jlpservicesinc]

So I sorted the dies.. I have 1 set of 4", 3 sets of 3", and 1 set of 2.5".    I just ordered a set of 1/4-20, 3/4-10, 2"pipe and 1.25 pipe.  Need the 2" dies to cut the Rigid for the electrical. 

The larger 784 die head is only for the larger sizes 2" and over.   The model 784 head needs different dies for each size.. Super inconvenient and costly.. this head can cut left or right hand threads.. 

The model 74 head will use only 1 set of dies to cut from 2" to 4" which is super handy..   But only right hand threads. 

The oil pump froze with water in it and broke the housing. 

Motor is not seized, but the oil pump is..  The gear box works as it should when the pulley is turned. 
 

 

Bolt & Pipe Threading Dieheads _ Oster Threading Dies.pdf Oster Dies & Chasers _ Pipe & Bolt Threading Machines.pdf Oster Threading Machine Serial Number Lookup.pdf

[jlpservicesinc]

Well busy weekend..  Got the new to me machine sorted..  ( everything was seized).. 

Turns out the short lever for the gear changer was sticking and only getting to 1 gear so pulled the top cover off (which I planned to do anyhow to check things)..  

There were a couple of circlips on the input shaft moved and the shifter shaft was rusted.. So cleaned up the rust, and moved the clips and gears back into position..   Will see how that works and if the clips move again I'll make up spacers.. 

The gears are stationary on the input shaft so can be spaced.. 

I then took all the electrical switches apart and cleaned them all and got them working again..  Turns out the stop button had a broken shaft so I welded it back together and now they all work..  The run button is actually a 3 position switch so that was interesting.. 

Anyhow the switches work now.. 

So gave it 1 more good cleaning and shot some paint at it..  

I like the inside of items to be white as well no matter the color externally. 

All told I have about 40 hrs into it..  

[Ted Ewert]

Sounds like a fun project, looks great. I like to hear that other people fix electrical switches. I've saved many switches just by burnishing the contacts. Nevertheless, the newer ones are getting harder to get apart. Made to be tossed out. 

[jlpservicesinc]

Thanks Ted,   I love doing projects like this.. 


I actually ordered some parts from Oster and they are reasonably priced.   The guy I spoke with as my sales rep had great information as to durability and rebuildable info and what is recommended for cutting oils and such.  (rigid or Oster cutting oil).. I asked which is better..  He then explained Oster has gone back to their original formula and now has more sulfur... 

Also the gear box takes SAE W90  though I would like to find a modern worm gear oil that drops contaminants back to the sump. 

He said there are people out there using these machines for twisting steel bars..   He said 1" and even 1.5" cold should be possible..   He said 1" is nothing for the machine.. 

I ordered the finishing touches so new gear plague,  10gallons of cutting oil, plague blind rivets, oil pickup screen, oil level glass, inner chip deflector and basin screen. about 700 in parts.. 

Oster offers a rebuild with 1 year warranty for 30K..  Take the old unit and replace everything worn on the carriage and will rebuild the gear box and install modern electrics.. 

So, the die heads and such as well as dies can be expensive..  but hunting for a good deal on the Bay or FB has paid off.. 

I'm going to get some 5/8" and 3/4" stainless for the levers and have them threaded..  5/8-16tpi for the knobs.. 

Little bit more clean up but in the home stretch..  Good thing too.. Sunday or Monday I will move it over to the garage and hook it up to power to see if it runs.. 

Still want to put a blue racing stripe around the middle, finish up the paint on the inside motor compartment and forge braze the oil pump.. I tried to find a replacement from Tuthill but they stopped supporting this pump back in 2004..  This model has an oil by pass at 20-25psi all their new pumps with belt drive do not have any bypass.