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Hey guys long time.

 

I have an interesting question to ask but it might be a stupid one? I recently watched a video on youtube about quenching and heat treating, the question is the guy said that smiths quench with the blade facing magnetic north to reduce the possibility of warping. Is this an old wives tale or does it hold any credibility? 

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Lol :o , I've never heard that one.  Sounds fishy to me. <_<   Lets see, my quench faces West, some times east, every once and a while north.  The last one that warped It was quenced in a south east trajectory. :unsure:   nah.  wives tale. ;)

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Thanks guys, I thought it had no credibility as the only factor that could influence it would be the earths magnetic field, but on such a small piece of steel I doubted that it would affect it in any noticible way, I just wanted clarity on the subject so thanks guys  :D

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I've heard about the method on a primitive knife making video shot by Ron Hood- of a neo-tribal smithing group. True or false, the guys made very impressive knives with very little equipment.

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Alot of he stories you hear about quenching with water from some rare stream or by the light of the moon are just plain hogwash. Its done in order to mystify the process B) . Though the one about quenching in the blood of a virgin makes me.... :D :lol:

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I don't know about preventing warping... but, I have read a while ago, while researching about magnets, of an old method of making a magnet.  Basically to my understanding, by forging the iron, while having it aligned from North to south, and hitting from North to South,   would induce a type of magnetic alignment.  Creating a weak magnet.

 

Read in a book "De Magnete" by William Gilbert,  16th Century I think.

 

Page 212:

http://books.google.com/books?id=YT9EmW1TmakC&pg=PA212&source=gbs_selected_pages&cad=3#v=onepage&q&f=false

 

Never tried it myself.  Found it interesting though.   Btw,  making a real strong permanent magnet is not easy.  Research I did years ago tells that it involves materials such as Boron and involves heating to high temperature,  running the material through a Very Strong magnet, in order to create the magnetic alignment of the molecules, then Flash freezing (Quenching if you will), the Molecules in place, using I think something like Liquid nitrogen or the like.  I could be wrong, been a while since I looked at that sort of stuff.

 

I'm no pro btw, was just wondering if it was possible to make a magnet in a home shop.  Short answer = Kinda.  Still need a relatively strong magnetic force, and would have no way of Freezing the molecules to make the magnet permanent,  in which case you are just better off creating a strong Electromagnet by itself.

 

-Bruno

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I've heard of doing it but haven't worried about it. I will say I've learned to check for straightness before going to the next step. Easier to correct sooner than to discover later after grinding and polishing that its bent.

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Variances in the local magnetic field can change radically based on where you parked your truck and where your quench tank is in relation to your anvil. These must, of course, be taken into account when pointing the to-be-quenched blade. :D

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Don't forget the steel toe shoes affects of the magnetic polarity, depending on weather your left or right foot is forward.  Also, plastic handled hammers with electrical tape wrap provide just the right inverse impedance of the alpha temporal field, which of course everyone knows is necessary for the forging of a proper Light Saber.  The color of the so said Saber is thusly determined by The number of virgins on hand divided by the beers sacrificed in relation to the time of Second yearly Blue moon.  It's all elementary... :ph34r:

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its funny how folks will give credence to theories like blade orientation during quench, while at the same time paying very little attention to quench fluid, volume etc...

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too many want a fast easy way rather than to learn what really needs to happen to harden a blade,   its not hurting anyone except their own credibility, but if people have fun thats ok too, but they are missing out.

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If trying to find magnetic north to do such an operation, one must take into account the affect of ones anvil, stock pile and all other large metal sources when pulling out their compass. Large sources of ferrous metals will throw off the magnet in a compass. If using gps, then never you mind.
The Mad Rabbit

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too many want a fast easy way rather than to learn what really needs to happen to harden a blade,   its not hurting anyone except their own credibility, but if people have fun thats ok too, but they are missing out.

 

I was simply posting a question out of interest. It held no conviction in my mind that I would ever use it. I know many methods of quenching and this was a new idea that popped up. I have learnt never to dismiss an idea until it has been tried and tested to prove inaccuracy or impossibility.

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Common knowledge says that the reason animals can migrate, is that the iron in the system helps them navigate along magnetic lines. I am not so quick to poo poo old wives tales, if it could be guaged, I would say it is likely to be a negligable increase in crystal alignment, but hey....what do I know? I am willing to go through the ritual simply because I like to do it! But I bow 3 times and XXXX to the south as well!!

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As long as the people doing it simply on the basis of it being a superstition acknowledge that, and don't try to pass it off as a meaningful part of the process to the uninformed, I don't think anybody would have any objections.

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On 8/4/2013 at 12:07 PM, Razzputin said:

Hey guys long time.

 

I have an interesting question to ask but it might be a stupid one? I recently watched a video on youtube about quenching and heat treating, the question is the guy said that smiths quench with the blade facing magnetic north to reduce the possibility of warping. Is this an old wives tale or does it hold any credibility? 

I’m by far no expert on forging, but I think there might be something to it. I do know that with rifle barrels, there is a process called aligned cryogenic accurizing. The barrel is connected to leads basically turning the barrel into an electro magnet (magnetically aligning the the molecular structure) and placed into a cryogenic “deep freezer” which sets the alignment. I do know that absolutely does increase the accuracy of the rifle. So it would make sense to me that north quenching might achieve stronger blade with minimal deflection  that holds it’s edge longer. The Japanese have used north quenching for centuries. 

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did you even read the thread here? where did you get that idea of the Japanese following that nonsense? 

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I would suggest that believers try testing a sensitive compass in their shop first.  If they can get it to point true north while inside the shop then they have a basis for experimenting.  My guess is that the power in the walls, metal framing, corner and edge bead in the walls, the welder, etc...have a much larger impact on the compass than the Earth’s magnetic field.  That being that case, I have high skepticism about the North quench theory.

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On 4/24/2018 at 7:31 PM, Steve Sells said:

where did you get that idea of the Japanese following that nonsense? 

People will justify just about any kind of nonsense by saying “That’s how _______ did it.”

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If Earth's magnetic field can warp a blade to the north or south, depending on hemisphere, that means it should be constantly pulling on steel all the time, yeah?. So how are skyscrapers standing up? Why are my refrigerator magnets not being pulled north, or at least lining up with the magnetic field?

Its bologna, thats why. Technique plays more of a role than magnetism. 

 

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