Blacksmith - limited to a wheel chair

[blubrick]

I believe what's needed is a chair that can pivot to move between forge, anvil and vise, and lock in place while hammering, bending and twisting. Of course this can be done in conventional wheelchairs with simple two handed movements, but this would necessitate our hypothetical chair-bound smith putting his work down between removing it from the forge and working on it.

In order that our smith not lose his hard-won heat, the pivoting controls could be activated by pressing down and forward or backwards with the elbows at the same time, and then lock into position once the elbow controls were released. This would allow him to pivot while holding tongs and hot steel in one hand and a hammer in the other.

Of course, his workspace would need to be set up specifically for his chair, with forge, anvil and vise all a bit lower than usual, but I think it could work.

[jayco]

I had to think about it a little bit, but I think a straight track(think mini railroad track) with chair attached might be a way for a wheelchair confined smith to work.
The chair would be mounted sideways on the track and the smith pull himself left and right to access his tools.

Using his arms, the smith could grab the track rail(or an overhead rail) and, under his own power,travel along his work area.

This track could be as long or short as the smith needed. In this way, the smith could have access to ox-ac, arc welder, gas forge,coal forge, bench grinders,post vice, etc.

Of course, the track and also the chair must be securely mounted to the track for the whole system to work.

There would need to be a brake, but that's not a problem, something as simple as an oil filter wrench acts as a band brake. A cable/friction brake( like on a bicycle) would do.

Placing the post vise and anvil on offset pivots(an arm that swings outward......think 'crank shaft') ,would allow the smith to pull out those tools and lock them in the position he wanted for a particular job.

The smith could work from either side of anvil or post vise as he chooses.

The simple 'drop pin' system used on farm tractor grader blades makes this possible.

something like this could be made with common materials from the steel yard and hardware store.

Just an idea........

[Glenn]

Blacksmithing at it's best. Solving a problem that does not exist (yet), without knowing the scope or specifications of the project. I would like to hear from the fellow that finally puts this thread to use and report back as to what worked. (grin).

[steponmebbbboom]

Expensive? Price a new fully decked out handicap van, with motorized wheel chair...

i dont have to. one of my clients is a wheelchair van manufacturer; i also have two clients that manufacture industrial robotics. i am well aware of the costs, and robotic arms... those vans would be peanuts in comparison, and not to mention that theyre necessary for basic survival. sorry to be a wet blanket here but the reality check bears underscoring. that said,

perhaps since the smith needs to be held from twisting, and means of getting him/her around are not simple to say the least; perhaps instead of a work triangle, fixing the smith in one position and placing the anvil, water bucket and forge on a lazy susan arrangement that locks in place may be more workable.

[larrynjr]

Expensive? Price a new fully decked out handicap van,

I bought one this year for transporting my son around in his power chair. Actually got a good deal, just over $30k for a 2005 with only 1500 miles on it. Most expensive thing I've ever bought before.

[steponmebbbboom]

thats a steal actually. moving forward, i think that getting the smith around the shop isnt so much a problem as making sure that his/her controls can be left unattended and (s)he can be fixed in place and have leverage; and that (s)he can transition from one step to the next as quickly as possible. as far as the chair itself, i think any rail arrangement should have a captive roller underneath so the chair cant be wrenched off the rail, kind of like a rollercoaster car. id look there for inspiration, and even for sourcing parts. also, further to that idea, any part of the chair that is movable for the purpose of positioning the body (including the wheels and rails) should not be able to coast, like for instance if the chair is to swivel as i think it should, it should have a clutch/brake on it so it locks as soon as you let go of the control. having to manually lock anything will use valuable time. and for the most part this technology already exists, manual chain hoists for instance.

i could probably source parts if someone has an idea or specific need for something, but im not an engineer or draughtsman. my only input in that regard is that i would shy away from any powered implements as although i think they would be efficient and compact, cost would be a problem unless you could get it from military/avionic surplus, and even then youre likely working with odd voltage requirements. maybe its just as simple as making every operation more conducive to have an unskilled shop hand just helping with positioning and bracing. :confused:

[Archie Zietman]

Could one take some inspiration from a Japanese forge, where the smith is always seated, with the anvil right in front of him/her, and the forge right there to the left?

[Valentin]

Man i don't even what to think about this ! And i can't read makes me sad and scared

[brian]

Bit off the wheel chair subject.
I have only 20 percent use of right hand ( hammer hand) due to grabbing a wire with 6000 volts running through it when I was a kid.

I can usually find a way around this eg. using a power hammer for as much possible ,using a heavy hammer with a thick handle .
This has enabled me to become more skilled with the power hammer and making different dies plus safer for visitors as they don't have to duck out of the way when a hammer flys across the shop!!!
You can find a way to get things done if you stop and think for a while.

[Neal L]

http://www.iforgeiron.com/forum/f7/west-african-blacksmith-2873/
These guys forge while sitting

[Little Forks Forge]

Chair to the tool ... not tool to the chair....

Video - Breaking News Videos from CNN.com

If you kind of sit sideways on this chair and set the anvil...could it work?

[Justin Caradoc]

just looking through the archives and thought I would put in my 2 cents.
If you were dealing with a person with out the use of their leggs. Instead of moving the smith and loosing heat or setting up the shop for a wheel chair. could you set the forge, anvil, power hammer, and vice/ twister in a circle that would be easily accesed on a swivil chair that is on a steel shaft sunk into the ground say 3-4 feet. Now the anvil, forge and vice/ twister would need to be low enough or the chair high enough to work and the power hammer would need to be set up with a pull cord to work the foot peddle. this would limit the size of stock that could be worked but could this be an option?

And what if you set up multiple stations for diffrent purpouses with the power hammer on a locking swivil. kinda like the train roundhouses on a smaller scale to move the hammer. You know one station could be general purpose smithing and another could be used for larger steel with a chain lift to help support the metal.

This way the smith could hop off his wheel chair and have a solid grounded base to work on.

Just my 2 cents I thought this was an interesting thread and thought I would chime in.:D

[jayco]

Justin, thanks for the ideas.

It's good that we keep this thread alive and keep coming up with more ideas.

I,m 52 and have back problems..........meaning that these ideas could come in handy for guys like me!

I would imagine that when I,m 72 I will have decreased mobility......but I,ll probably want to do some smithing.

This thread is probably where I will look for information!

James Flannery

[cablemonkey]

i hope I can get this thred open agian I need some good ideas and have a few of my own that I could share with others with handicaps not just wheelchair bound.
I am using a one foot piece of railroad track as an Anvil mounted in a big vice to get it off the floor. I would really like to mount it on something but not sure what to mount it on. Whatever I mount it to it needs to be about 12" off the ground so when I mount the Anvil to it The thing will be at the right hight. On rollers would be great to,That makes it easer for me to work I can roll thing out of the way when i'm not using them it keeps the floor clean. Everything I use that will not fit on my woorkbench goes on rollers. IE Vice, Anvil, Forge, Mig and Tig weilders All my tongs and hammers are on a seperate rolling dollie and when I am not using them Ihave a place along the wall where I can get them out of the way.
With me leaning over is the only option I am parilized from mid-chest down. When I reach my arms out front of me I fall over. Plus it keeps me from getting a lap full hot metal. your stand up idea was great, They have wheelchairs that stand up. The only problem with that is that they are about 15 to 20 thousand dollars and I would hate to get it into my shop and burn a hole in the seat or a spark on an battery or electric line.When I get the shop The way I like it I will take a couple pictures and let yall see what works for me. I think everyone is a diffrent cercomstance but alot of what I have done can be applied to other situations.

[Glenn]

Your a blacksmith, build a stand up chair, or adapt something to be used as such. I can see starting with a "normal" wheel chair and then removing the seat and replacing it with a stand up "seat". All the controls could be moved to the standing position.

You would then need to build a stabilizer to keep the center of gravity low and keep it from tipping over. If your in one general location, you could secure the top of the frame to the ceiling to keep it upright at all times. This could be nothing more than a piece of cable attached to a swing arm on the ceiling. It would limit your circle of movement, but secure the chair from falling over.

If you could find an old hospital bed (it is 3 sectional and adjustable), you could scrap the parts and make a chair that could articulate from the sitting position to the standing position through screws or hydraulics. Then use a clevis or other device to attach to the overhead cable as noted above. An overhead roll bar or halo would be a good idea, just in case.

As to hot stuff getting on things, a leather covering attached with Velcro could protect the body. A cover (deflector) over any electrical or otherwise critical components would be needed. One concern would be running the tire across a hot piece of metal and having a blowout.

Now if your really into brainstorming, you could just hang everything from the ceiling and use a track system. This would keep you off the ground (for safety) and if the track were set up according to the lay out of the blacksmithing tools, it could get you to everything you need to reach in order to work. They use industrial tracking in many locations, look into what is already available. As to getting into and out of such a device, look again at a articulated sit to stand device mentioned above.

They have adjustable ladders that can be configured in multiple positions. Look at the mechanisms and the locking devices and see if they can be adapted for your use. If you think of the standing chair as a ladder, you could attach the top via cable and motor to it could be lowered to an inclined. You could mount the standing chair on the incline, strap in, cover up, then lift with the cable and lock the ends of the ladder into receiving holes to make it secure.

You could bolt the flywheel of a car engine to a trolley that ran on the track, then use the starter motor (mounted to the standing chair) to turn the standing chair CW or CCW as needed to rotationally position the standing chair. The starter should afford enough drag to be able to generally hold it into position.

I do not understand your limitations or your abilities so some of the ideas may not apply. We can though use them to spin off other ideas.

[Mick]

I am so glad this thread has been revived, as I have been interested in mobility / enablement aids for some time now.

My thoughts on this problem:

If I were in the situation of being wheelchair bound, I would not want my shop designed in a way that would exclude friends, visitors from sharing it with me. This would preclude the use of any floor mounted rail type system, or the setting of anvils etc below useable heights for a standing person.

The use of any wheeled aid in a smith shop environment would present issues with debris on the floor interfering with wheels. (ever tried to move any hard tired equipment around the shop and got hung up on a small piece of steel or the like.)

Straight forward over head rail would restrict movement to a linear layout.

In a normal smithing session, a basic triangular layout is generally used - forge,anvil, vise maybe swage block, set out 3 ft to 5 ft apart.

So imagine if you will a wall mounted tv bracket on steroids. Two arms, the first pivoting from a fixed point overhead either wall or post, (a variation on this later), the second arm pivoted from the free end of the first (360 deg rotation) . Suspended from the free end of the second arm a chair to suit the user, also with 360 deg rotation, the suspension member offset to place the centre of the load directly under the pivot point.

If you can follow the above layout you will see that the arrangement would allow the user infinite and precise positioning anywhere within the range of the two pivoting arms, the chair height could easily be raised or lowered with some straight forward engineering.

Correctly engineered, effort required to move the chair would be very minimal, and motive power could be manual, servo motors whatever. Locking mechanisms would keep the chair in the chosen position.

Now imagine the whole mechanism mounted on an overhead rail on a traveling carriage, it would give the user access to the entire shop and contents.

The system could be made as basic or high tech as budget and or desire dictates. The design of the chair itself could be altered to suit the needs of the user.

The user would occupy no more floor area than a standing person, the need to modify tools and equipment would be minimal. The shop would be useable by anyone.

Just my thought on the subject.

Edited July 14, 2009 by Mick
Punctuation.

[Rcrew]

I had a preach that came thro here a couple years ago who was in a wheel chair. The car he was driveing, had one wooden dile rod for the gas and one for the brake. I saw it and told him to come to the shop the next day. We forged him one leaver for gas and one for the brake, but the best part was I got the chain saw and cut a stump short enough to put an ole anvil on and let him do some of the hammer work. This really made his day. I was proud I could help. Things we take for granted really make a difference in someones life. This is a good disscusion

[Ratel10mm]

I'd think if you're in a chair the biggest challenge would be getting your shoulder over the anvil? Wouldn't your knees get in the way? With that in mind, I'd suggest swapping the original anvil for a large bridge anvil.

[Lmale]

Is there a wheelchair bound mastersmith?

 

I'd kind of like to be the first wheelchair bound amputee who is a mastersmith.

 

Bill.

[Hottwheels]

I am in a wheelchair and just starting out with designing my forge and anvil and this is very tough, I am limited to my family garage rn and have an area I use for gun cleaning for my business but I am trying to figure out how to do all this blacksmithing without burning the house down and doing all my work within arms reach. If I have to go from one side of the garage to the other while carrying something hot in my hand it is difficult to do that, not burn my legs and move at the same time  

[Charles R. Stevens]

Even able bodied Smiths would be fools to carry hot stock across the shop. First consider a post anvil that will put the work at about lap high and just to the outside of your dominant side leg, this puts the striking serface close to the same position able bodied smiths work with. So with your off hand across your body holding tongs and stock or handled tooling and hammer.

place the forge in front of you, normally we want the forge at the same hight as the anvil so one doesn’t lift stock between the two and the anvil/hearth can support long stock. With tongs you can reach the fire with your knees against the hearth.

place your vice belly button high and to the off side so you can pivot to the off side wile the stock heats.

a welders blanket or a cut down cotton pad with leather top layer in your lap with a welders apron protecting your chest and as primary protection of your lap and legs should get you doing most hand forging. 

As to slacktubs, they are not used much with modern steel except in heat treating, and as heat treating can involve oil or water one must make provisions, my first thought would be to place both under the hearth but maybe under the vice with lids is best. 

 

Obviously one would remove the arm rest on the dominant side on those heavy grey and crome  hospital chairs.

 

[Charles R. Stevens]

Obviously I am not setting in a wheel chair, but it'll give you an idea. One can go 6-8” lower to get into the normal knuckle high position but that puts the anvil just forward of your knee. Still not a bad position if the forge is small. Tho a gasser will suck do to draggons breath roasting your legs 

[Al Stephens]

Hi Hottwheels, Where are you? Charles has made some workable suggestions, and this is a question that has come up to me in trying to set up classes at a local start up craft school. There a lot of very smart people that use this site, and some of them may be close to you. Look for a local group, and join them, or the closest active group you can work with, and please keep us updated.  For the rest of the IFI community, my opinion  would be we should focus more on a low cost, low tech solution to this problem, the less expensive idea's we can come up with, the more people we can reach. Al

[Charles R. Stevens]

I’m all about cheap, lol. Poor dose that to you. 

I would stick with soft coal as a fuel, a lot less heat and fire fleas radiated at you, I assumed total paralysis and lack of sensation in ones legs in my over abundance of leg protection, hot scale would be bad enough but dropping a small work piece in ones lap at temp is a real danger.

[JHCC]

Apart from following Charles's recommendation for lap protection, we do not recommend following his example for forge-ready footwear.