Does anyone have a recommendation for a very simple shelter for an outdoor shop?

[Frosty]

Frosty The Lucky.

[BillyBones]

I have never used one nor know any one who has but you can get helper fans to push air up and out of a chimney. You can get some that go inside the pipe, on top of the pipe, or inline with the pipe. 

I use 8" pipe as well. The only times i have a problem with  it drawing is when i first light my fire and if i have the windows in the shop open on a windy day sometimes it hits just right to blow the smoke out of the hood. I have an exhaust fan up near the peak of the roof in my shop that helps with excess smoke so it does not get out of hand. Even if you have a hood that draws all the smoke out i would still use an exhaust fan just to keep air flow through the shop anyway. If you do go with an exhaust fan get some kind of filter for the motor. I learned the hard way that soot will build up and cause it to quit working. A cheap furnace filter cut to size works rather well with a rubberband to hold it in place over the back of the motor. 

Make sure you get a good rain cap. Those elbows will rust out in no time when water mixes with the smoke and soot inside the stack. I am no scientist or chemist but i believe it has something to do with the sulfur in coal mixing with the water, acid rain kinda. Which may be one of the reason i do not know anyone to use a helper fan as well.  An inline fan, which if i was to use one seems the way to go, costs around $150 US. Not something i would want to replace often. 

A note about roof penetration. I used a 3' piece of triple wall pipe through the roof. The rest is single wall pipe. Code where i live says that is fine to do. IIRC code says 18" from flammable material for single wall, 3" for triple wall. Having 18" inches above and below, and 8" side to side from the rafters i was well with in code. Maybe an overabundance of caution but i also put heat sheilds on the roof and rafters. 

[Paradigm11]

Do you have a link for the helper fan? I was initially thinking about one but couldn't find anything that was rated for heat. Could maybe have one at the bottom of a T coming out of the chimney pushing up.

[BillyBones]

Commercial links not allowed. Do a search on "chimney draft fan". 

They sell them at that website named after the giant river in S. America. Also chimney supply places usually sell them.

The in-line fans go on the outside of the stove pipe with the blades protruding into it from the side.  Kind of like a squirrel cage fan. On the outside it will be much less exposed to the heat. 

If you are really interested in one i would contact a chimney supply company like Rockford (they have a website with a chat function) and ask their opinion and what would work best for you. 

My thought when i contemplated one was using and old air pump off of a car with air ride suspension. Mount it to the wall then run duct to my chimney coming in at a bit of an upward angle. That way the fan is well away from any heat and the duct would be much easier to take off periodically to clean out any soot or debris that may accumulate. 

In my opinion i think you will be fine with just the 8" pipe. As long as you practice good fire management and not burning a lot of green coal. You will get the errant bit of smoke but it is negligible. I would try it with out a fan first then if you need one look into buying one.    

[JHCC]

1 hour ago, BillyBones said:

Commercial links not allowed. [...] 

They sell them at that website named after the giant river in S. America.

Giving the names of businesses is entirely acceptable (Amazon, eBay, Blacksmith Supply, Airgas, etc), as is giving the name of a specific product on one of those sites. It's just live links that are forbidden.

[BillyBones]

JHCC, yes i know that. I am not a fan of that online retail site named after the river so i refuse to actually use their name or use their services any longer. Long story but they basically told me that there was nothing they could do to help me get a refund on a product that was never delivered.  

I do wonder at times though was it named after the river, the forest, or the warrior women? 

[Paradigm11]

Appreciate the replies, as always! I think I may try it without the fan for starters.

 

We're getting close to done now. Got some rough cut pine for $0.85 a board foot and I'm nailing that up as siding. Looks really nice if you're into the rustic look, imo. 

Getting a truckload of fill soil this week to fill in that back corner, it's all level I swear!

Waiting for a couple dry days in a row to get the water barrier up.

I'm very glad I decide to build this myself. Costs keep climbing but it's still been cheaper than buying one and it's nice to learn as I go. Still can't believe I built this.

 

Fitting the top board (not pictured) was a bit of a bear. The 10' high one is going to be stressful.

[BillyBones]

Looking pretty good. That is the same way i am doing my "office" in my barn. I had enough left over 2x10's from the porch i put on my house to frame in a floor. The kid next door to me moved out and left me about 15 2x4's i have been using for studs. The walls are from stock boxes i am getting from where i work, all pine board much like what you are using. 

One question though, how is it all anchored to the ground? Or is it all just sitting on those bricks? I would have dug down  couple feet and poured concrete pillars then anchored it to them. 

[Paradigm11]

Yeah, just on the blocks for several reasons. 

It's situated in a position where wind is a non-issue and I'm building it in a way that I don't need a building permit. I didn't want to have to deal with concrete or digging in my rocky soil. 

[BillyBones]

You do not have to have a permit? Around these parts we have to have a permit to build pretty much anything bigger than a dog house. 

Wind is not an issue? is that a normal day or does that account for storms with high winds or maybe even a tornado? I have never been to New Hampshire or know anything about the weather there so i am not trying to be critical, just wondering. 

Thinking about it, with the way we have high winds and tornados may be one of the reasons we need permits to build just about anything here. 

[George N. M.]

Billy, most towns, cities, and counties that have building codes have a minimum size requirement for building permits to avoid requiring them for every garden or storage shed.  My old, rural county in Colorado didn't require permits for anything of 100 sqare feet or smaller.

That said, some places, particularly in rural and more  politically "red" areas do not have any building codes or permits and cities and towns are more likely to have them than counties.  My county here in Wyoming does not have them.  The theory is that folk should be able to do what they want with and on their own property.  If they want to build something out of sticks and cardboard that falls down around them be in on their head (literally).  The major problem with that approach is that often non compliant with building code issues are hidden and are not disclosed to subsequent owners (either through purchase or inheritance).

In my old county we adopted a building code when there were several incidents where someone had built something substandard and then it was sold to an unsuspecting purchaser who got stuck with an expensive problem.  The conservative County Commissioners felt "something should be done" to prevent that in the future.  We also started licensing and requiring bonding for contractors after folk got taken to the cleaners by cowboy builders.

In some places building codes, or parts of them such as electrical and plumbing, are adopted and administered at the state level.

Yes, wind is a real issue.  You can get 60-70 mph gusts from any thunderstorm, even in New England.  On the plains of eastern Colorado we adopted very stringent requiements for tying down mobile homes.  In New Hampshire I'd worry about snow loads on the roof.

George

[Paradigm11]

In my area we don't need a permit for any accessory building under 200 sq ft so long as there isn't a solid foundation. Concrete pilons / sonotubes are allowed, but the effort of digging that deep isn't practical without machinery.

Regarding the wind thing, I'm not sure I have the right way to explain it. Basically, its a wind dead-zone. I have some pictures from winter I can try to find that kind of illustrates the point.

There are no requirements for it to be firmly attached to the ground, but I do intend to do some anchoring with cable and ground anchors because it's cheap and practical.

[BillyBones]

George, i know most of that. I was just saying that here, even in the rural areas code is kind of strict. More of a comment on how things are different state to state or even county to county. 

There is no such thing as a wind dead zone here. It comes from all directions and many times all at once. When settlers moved to this area the native Americans who lived here then call this place the spot of big wind or something like that. So what did we do, built our county seat there. In my life time it has been devastated twice by tornados and a couple years back we had 18 touch down in one night in this area. Gets a bit breezy round here at times. 

[Paradigm11]

A couple more pictures! Winter is coming and it's been a really busy few weeks. Got the roof flashing on (waiting for another warm day to put on the actual roofing).

Big step today was to have enough coverage to be comfortable bringing my forge out and starting to figure out the positioning.

Had a REALLY windy day and it didn't budge despite all the wind catching in that back corner so I'm pretty confident I'll be all set with it "floating."

After putting down those pavers I really like how they look so once I get the rest of my gravel I'll probably slowly make most of the floor those. $6 each adds up fast, but there's no rush.

Still need to level it off better, this was me getting a position to line up the chimney bracing.

As you can see in one of the pics, I've got a lot of wood to stack and I had foolishly blocked my shelter with all of the building supplies so its it's going to be a busy week!

[arkie]

Pavers.....yeah, they're expensive.  Ever think about making your own?  I haven't crunched the numbers, but you could make several forms out of scrap lumber, mix your own concrete and pour several of your own pavers at a time.  I did that for a small shed and the only negative is the time it takes to make them.

Your shed is coming along nicely.

[NoGoodWithUsernames]

Also check your local craigslist or FB marketplace for pavers, can often be had for much more reasonable prices if people are tearing them out or order too many for a project etc.

[Paradigm11]

Didn't think about DIY, That might be a good idea. I was so thoroughly on the "no concrete" path I didn't even think of it.

[Frosty]

The local Home Depot sells plastic molds to making pavers in a number of shapes. It's coming along pretty well, it'll be a nice space.

Frosty The Lucky.

 

[Irondragon Forge ClayWorks]

I bought one of those molds for making bricks, it works a treat I think it makes something like 8 bricks at a time.

I can't control the wind, all I can do is adjust my sail’s.
Semper Paratus

 

[rich_c]

You're shop is looking good, Paradigm11.

[arkie]

When you get your smithy finished, you need to add a final touch...a sign hanging outside made from sheet metal in the shape of an anvil....

[Frosty]

Or hang an anvil from a shop forged hanger.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Shainarue]

I'm gonna piggy back on this thread because we're getting close to certain on the purchase of a new house with 3 acres of land - but no existing outbuilding.
So I was brainstorming ideas (carport, metal shed, wood shed, etc)
I noticed in previous replies on this thread suggested the carports with the rollup fabric. Would that be safe? I feel like fabric & forging don't mix well, lol
I'd like to keep similar with my current setup - which is a forge table & treadle hammer just outside the shed door and everything else just inside the door.
How much can stay outside other than table/blower/anvil? Like - tools (punches, chisels, tongs, hammers) - I would assume those need to be covered? But maybe they don't need as much babying as I'm thinking, lol

 

Given the amount of $$$$ we're dropping to get all this rolling, I'd really like to stay as lean as possible.

I do have quite a few cedar fencing boards that were intended to surround the existing shed I have, so I know there's enough to at least get the walls sided if I went with building.

I'm just not sure how much coverage I truly NEED.

[Goods]

Shainarue, one thing I will definitely recommend is that whatever direction you go on the cheap, make it so that when the time and money comes to improve it, you won’t waste too much of what you put into it now. Especially the time, you can always make more money…

As for the fabric walls, I’ve spent a lot of time thinking about that for my own shop. I was looking at canvas drop clothes from HF. The cost was way below what I could buy the raw fabric myself. As for the flame resistance, soak the canvas in a saturated solution of water and Borax (20mule team) and let if air dry. I also heard that adding Boric Acid to the mix resists smoldering, but I haven’t researched that one.

Congratulations on the new property (if it works out). Personally, I would not want to be buying right now. Strange market, both high prices and high interest rates.

Keep it fun,

David

[Frosty]

A couple thoughts for you Shaina: First I agree with David, this is not a good time to be buying unless you have access to repos or similar. Maybe save someone close to bankruptcy by taking a mortgage off their books. These can be good deals for all involved. 

On these lines, you can get great deals on garages and such during remodels or bankruptcies. That's how we got out barn, it used to live in an acquaintance's brother's back yard. He'd put it next to the house facing across the driveway at a fence. Unfortunately there was no way to make a turn in or out with a car. When he tried moving it and getting permits, the city discovered it was unpermitted in the first place and worse a post and beam building!  (GASP!) It was grandfathered in being there since the 1940s but the city threatened to refuse permits until it was moved. Sooooo, I brought my 20' car trailer in and we dismantled it, stacked in on the trailer and reassembled it in our yard where goats lived happily for many years. 

Anyway keep an eye out for things like that they happen all the time, especially during times of hard money.

I forged in a plastic covered carport as seen at Costco for many years and didn't have any issues with it and it wasn't just my propane forge, others joined me with their coal or charcoal forges in the shade during demos. 

Thomas Powers used to watch for people repairing hail damaged metal roofs. He maintained contacts with roofing companies who were not averse to selling old roofing rather than scrapping it. It wasn't going on a home or similar so dents, dings and occasional holes were no issue.

Frosty The Lucky.