JHCC Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 Playing around in my head with a bunch of ideas for a treadle hammer, and was thinking about making the head from a 9-10" length of 4" square tube I have kicking around, welding a thick plate on the end, and filling it with lead (melted down from wheel weights). Then I find that wheel weights aren't lead these days, so I start thinking about other sources of lead. Thinking about lead shot for reloaders, it occurs to me that if I filled the head with unmelted lead shot (perhaps with some oil as well), I would essentially be creating a large dead-blow mallet. This obviously wouldn't be good for a tire hammer or something like that, where you want to keep the tupp moving fairly quickly. However, since I'm envisioning this as replacement for a striker for punching, fullering, and the like, speed isn't that much of an issue, and the slower impact curve might actually be a benefit. Anyone have any thoughts on the practicality or advisability of this, or maybe a notion about where I can get some cheap (or free!) lead for my original concept? Quote
Daswulf Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 Would it matter if it's lead or not? Wheel weights, lead or not, Are weights after all. Quote
ThomasPowers Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 NE Ohio: talk to plumbers who have lead scrap from replacing lead pipe in old sections of cities. Quote
JHCC Posted August 2, 2017 Author Posted August 2, 2017 35 minutes ago, Daswulf said: Would it matter if it's lead or not? Wheel weights, lead or not, Are weights after all. Well, it's a matter of putting weight into a given volume. Assuming an interior volume of 3" x 3" x 9" (and I'm just guessing on that; I'm currently several hundred miles from my shop) or 81 cubic inches, that would be ~33 lbs of lead vs. ~21 lbs of zinc (which is what I gather they're using for wheel weights these days) Quote
Charles R. Stevens Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 A clasic dead blow uses steel shot, eithe buy BB's or go to a reloading supply and buy bags of bird shop Quote
Daswulf Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 I get your point. Many tire/ mechanic shops still have lead weights. Out of enough junk weights I'm sure you could find enough lead weights. Just ask enough shops and you might end up with buckets of them. ( There's a bucket full just in our body shop mechanic bay I need to grab some time.) I'd imagine you could test suspect weights by scraping them with a blade. You would end up with less weight with the loose bbs or shot anyway. Quote
JHCC Posted August 2, 2017 Author Posted August 2, 2017 One bullet casting video I watched showed that you can differentiate wheel weights by rapping them against something hard and listening to the sound: steel goes "tink", zinc goes "clank", and lead goes "clunk". Quote
Charles R. Stevens Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 Unlike a solid mass of led. Shot keeps moving forward after the hammer face stopes moving. A led hammer is a direct animal from a dead blow Quote
JHCC Posted August 2, 2017 Author Posted August 2, 2017 9 minutes ago, Charles R. Stevens said: Unlike a solid mass of led. Shot keeps moving forward after the hammer face stopes moving. A led hammer is a direct animal from a dead blow I understand how a dead-blow works; I'm just curious as to whether or not it would be good for my projected use. Quote
Jasent Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 A dead blow is designed to not rebound which may be a deterrent to repatition Quote
Stitch Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 I really like your idea. I would use steel BB's sort of like the kind dead blow hammers use. I believe that it wouldn't take very long for the lead shot to nest and pack together. Please let us know if you go forward with your idea! Quote
Daswulf Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 I can't say to wether a deadblow with bbs or solid mass would be better but as far as cost it would probably be easier and cheaper to scrounge lead and melt it in then to scrounge bbs to put in it. Possibly could use wheel bearing balls but they are not always the easiest to scrounge in mass. On a side note, A friend of mine and his uncle do make lead shot but IIRC it's around $25.-30. Per 2litre jug. I have seen the setup and it's pretty cool. They have spent a lot of time perfecting it to get proper shape and sizes. Quote
SLAG Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 JHCC, Hospital radiology departments and some oncology units, receive radioactive material frequently. The lead containers, these chemicals are shipped in, tend to pile up. Years ago, and in another city, I had a nurse friend that collected them for me and I had a good pile of them in no time. The staff did not have the time to scrap them. Creativity & obscure knowledge can help solve problems, sometimes. SLAG Quote
Judson Yaggy Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 Sounds like a good way to get lead dust into the air, all those little pieces of lead shot scrubbing past each other every time they start or stop moving. If you go that route weld up an air tight cap to the tube. Quote
JHCC Posted August 2, 2017 Author Posted August 2, 2017 3 minutes ago, SLAG said: JHCC, Hospital radiology departments and some oncology units, receive radioactive material frequently. The lead containers, these chemicals are shipped in, tend to pile up. Years ago, and in another city, I had a nurse friend that collected them for me and I had a good pile of them in no time. The staff did not have the time to scrap them. Creativity & obscure knowledge can help solve problems, sometimes. SLAG Thanks, SLAG. I've spoken with the radiology lab at the local hospital (I know one of the techs through the Boy Scouts), and they've already got a disposal method in place. However, my dentist still uses film for X-rays, and they're happy to give me the old film holders, each of which contains a small piece of lead foil. They're not very big, but I suppose enough of them do add up. 4 minutes ago, Judson Yaggy said: Sounds like a good way to get lead dust into the air, all those little pieces of lead shot scrubbing past each other every time they start or stop moving. If you go that route weld up a solid cap to the tube. Would topping off the tube with oil help with that? Quote
Charles R. Stevens Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 Wall mart still sells pint cartons of BB's and I don't know size of steel shot bags for upland game bird shells. If I remember my colonial history, traditinaly molten led was pored of a tower threw a sive into a water tank, then graded threw screens to size. Quote
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 I cast lead for my muzzle loaders. My source for pure lead is several tire shops who save the old stick on (as opposed to clip on) weights for me which are still made from lead. Quote
ThomasPowers Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 I was always told that lead hardness went, soft to harder: Plumbing lead, wheel weight lead, linotype lead Quote
Jasent Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 You can make your own Lino type lead by adding 2%-4% tin to your mix. Quote
Smoggy Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 JHCC, Do you have access to any supplies of solder? Particularly the older solders (reclaimed maybe) some of it is of comparible density to lead. Babbit metal may also be worth considering, depending on alloy. For a treadle hammer which is returned by a ballance spring, the abscence of a rebound seems of no great consiquence to me, but I'm no expert on mech hammer design. Quote
ThomasPowers Posted August 2, 2017 Posted August 2, 2017 Seams like it would be a waste of Babbitt! May I commend to your attention Rotometals.com and their "reclaimed lead shot"---their 25# bag is on sale right now! (Or you can buy the 2000 pound pallet of it if you wish!) Quote
BeaverNZ Posted August 3, 2017 Posted August 3, 2017 I would of thought a dead blow hammer would be less efficent than a solid normal hammer as when you hit a hot piece of steel the energy is usually absorbed with little rebound anyway, I would think it would be less efficent for forging as we all go to great lengths to have an anvil with a good rebound to aid in moving metal so i would think a dead blow hammer would be the same.I can apreciate thinking outside the box though Cheers Beaver PS I dont know why the joy police have such a problem with lead wheel weights anyway I have always managed to fight the temptation to lick them Quote
Lou L Posted August 3, 2017 Posted August 3, 2017 You could hit the yard sales circuit and grab up all the old fishing tackle that people ignore. There are many tons of unused old lead split shot, sliding weights and sinkers sitting in almost every garage in America. Heck, send out a Facebook request for people's old fishing lead. Many bodies of water no longer allow the use of lead tackle. Quote
ThomasPowers Posted August 3, 2017 Posted August 3, 2017 wherever it's used lead gets out into the environment and is toxic to more than just humans. Getting it out of Gas was a big step! Now with proper technique it's easy to deal with; my grandfather ran a baitstand and spent most winters casting sinkers and wen through tons of lead; he will be 94 next year IIRC and is sharper mentally than my father was at 80. Quote
JHCC Posted August 3, 2017 Author Posted August 3, 2017 Well, that's why I'm thinking about getting a few pounds of the stuff sealed up and out of circulation -- it's a public service, really. Quote
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