Pagan Hammer Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 Hi all, I am new here and new to forge building so please forgive me if I pop any dumb questions on you. I have a 20mm ammo can (7" x 14" x 17") that I would like to make into a forge. I think once I line it with fire brick I will have a good area to heat blades to make good bowie sized knife blades. Has anyone done this before and what type (and how many) burners should I use? I want to make this a propane forge. Thanks in advance! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 Will you be wanting to forge weld in it? Hard or soft firebrick? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzkill Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 Welcome to the forum. I have not made a propane forge out of an ammo can, but I have made a couple propane forges. Rather than try to ask you all the questions that will help narrow down whether or not what you have is compatible with what you want to build I highly recommend pulling up a comfy chair, grabbing a cold beverage and some snacks, and then spend a few hours in the gas forge section of the forum. In simplest terms a propane forge has a shell to contain heat, a burner to introduce heat, and openings that allow for putting stock in and allowing exhaust out. Some shapes work better than others though. The number and size of burners are normally determined by volume of the forge chamber, although the shape also can have an impact on that. Regardless, please read through at least the pinned topics and any others that catch your eye. If you still need help and advice after that we'll be happy to help you figure out the best way for you to build what you want. One of the things you may pick up though: Just because you have a certain item doesn't mean you should try to use it for a propane forge. You might be better off hanging on to that for a quench tub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pagan Hammer Posted January 15, 2017 Author Share Posted January 15, 2017 Thomas, all I am really interested in for now is making knife blades. I suppose I will eventually get into forge welding. Buzzkill, Thanks for the advice I will certainly read up on it. Myself and a buddy of mine are planning to partner up and learn to make blades. I have a few of these ammo cans and so one just may become a quench tub...lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 As I do pattern welded blades generally when I make blades; for me that would go "all I am really interested in for now is making knife blades; so I will want to forge weld extensively in this forge"----a good example of what you do may not be what other people do; so provide details! (I am amazed at the number of smiths who must be wearing foil hats as I have such difficulties reading their minds!) I have a friend who once made a propane forge using soft firebricks and a rectangular shell; one of the first times he tried it he accidently melted his workpiece---it was at a smithing meeting so I got to see the pool.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WL smith Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 I hate to sound rude and crude to the blacksmith community however here it comes. If everyone of us made knives we all would be standing on a street corner giving them away because there would be no market. I have been smithing since the late 60's. During that time I have made two knives and gave them to family. Now I have repaired steam tractors, made gates, straitened bumpers and round bale stickers, and a lot of stuff long forgotten. It is a big world out there that needs us in other endeavors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 WL, sounds like the .... er, stuff I get into. The best was the father and son who had a bet as to wether I could straiten the level indicator on a John Deer front loader... its a peice of 1/2 rod inside a peice of 1/2 schedual 20 pipe. The made a nice "S" out of it. Dad lost $40, and payed me for two trims. Son tipped me $20, lol. I think a nice tail gate barbeque grill would be a better use for sad ammo can, or a Jeep tool box. Talk to Wane Cole about a nice freon/helium can forge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 1 hour ago, Charles R. Stevens said: Talk to Wane Cole about a nice freon/helium can forge. I think CRS means Wayne Coe. Pagan Hammer, if I may suggest: just because you have an ammo can doesn't mean you have to make an ammo can forge. Read over the sections on building gas forges and seriously consider not reinventing the wheel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave51B Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 6 hours ago, WL smith said: I hate to sound rude and crude to the blacksmith community however here it comes. If everyone of us made knives we all would be standing on a street corner giving them away because there would be no market. I have been smithing since the late 60's. During that time I have made two knives and gave them to family. Now I have repaired steam tractors, made gates, straitened bumpers and round bale stickers, and a lot of stuff long forgotten. It is a big world out there that needs us in other endeavors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 I've known several smiths who started out all knives and ended up all ornamental! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommytaptap Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 16 hours ago, Charles R. Stevens said: WL, sounds like the .... er, stuff I get into. The best was the father and son who had a bet as to wether I could straiten the level indicator on a John Deer front loader... its a peice of 1/2 rod inside a peice of 1/2 schedual 20 pipe. The made a nice "S" out of it. Dad lost $40, and payed me for two trims. Son tipped me $20, lol. I think a nice tail gate barbeque grill would be a better use for sad ammo can, or a Jeep tool box. Talk to Wane Cole about a nice freon/helium can forge. Or even a forge mounted quench tank/fire putter outer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 JHCC, my daughter has an oppinian as to what my Innitials stand for... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 8 hours ago, Charles R. Stevens said: JHCC, my daughter has an oppinian as to what my Innitials stand for... "Can't Remember Stuff"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted January 17, 2017 Share Posted January 17, 2017 Somthing like that, lol. Thats ok because as Dannie Ray McMichael "don't remember much" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outdoor gater Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 On Sunday, January 15, 2017 at 9:24 AM, Buzzkill said: Just because you have a certain item doesn't mean you should try to use it for a propane forge. You might be better off hanging on to that for a quench tub. Buzkill Thank you!! For giving me a cool idea for the use of my extra amo cans laying around. I've already built my forge, thanks to you I'll have a cool looking quench tub with a lid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaughnT Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 I would definitely use the ammo can as a quench tank. The sealing lid is great for containing the oil. I use a small one and it's never failed me yet. The biggest problem with all these "I can use this" forges is that they greatly limit your design. Why bother with an automatic limiter right from the outset? Why make a forge that can only be used for knife blades when you know, sure as the sun rises, that you're going to be interested in doing other stuff. Your wife/girlfriend is going to ask you to make something. You'll get the idea to make your mom something nice for christmas. It's just going to happen. Get used to the notion because you can't escape it. With some sheet metal and self-tapping screws, you can easily make a shell that's big enough to give you plenty of room for a scroll of decent size. No welding needed. Then you line it with some koawool, paint that with the refractory, install a nice T-Rex burner..... easy as pie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 Welcome aboard Pagan Hammer guy, glad to have you. I have to jump on the bandwagon about using the 20mm. ammo can for something else. There are a raft of things it'd be much better for as there are a bunch of things that'd make a more useful propane forge. If you want to use the ammo can that's okay, it's yours. I sure wouldn't use fire brick as a liner though. Hard brick is a terrible heat sink with only slightly better insulating qualities than limestone. Soft brick is a better insulator but is fragile and unless you want to buy the really expensive ones isn't rated for typical propane forge temperatures, even the less expensive soft fire brick is more than 2x as expensive as hard. If you're planning on basic forging to learn the craft and staying away from forge welding for a while, soft fire brick will serve but you don't need to shoe horn it into a shell. If you buy or make a reasonably fire resistant table top thing then a layer of cement backer board on standoffs I like brick on the flat for dead air space. You can simply stack the soft fire brick on the backer board and make a "Brick Pile Forge." Brick piles aren't so great as a permanent forge but they're splendid to experiment with chamber shape and size or as a throw together specialty forge for those Special occasions. To learn with a brick pile is a treat, no shell, arrange as you like/need and easy peasy to make. Build a basic burner and you're set to get it on. I keep a box of soft bricks and about half a box of split hard fire bricks to experiment with or do public demos. I used to take my shop forge to demos but it was a poor choice for a couple reasons: First it invariably did at least $50 in damage every time and secondly nobody but NOBODY at a public demo was tempted to try blacksmithing once they took a look at it. Using a brick pile forge at demos on the other hand encourages folks to give it a try. It's easy to look at one of my (plumbing parts) T burners poked into $50 worth of fire bricks piled as complexly as any 5yr old could copy and it's something they want to give a try. Once you've discovered that whatever first couple forges you build aren't what you really need, ask me how I know, go ahead, anyway once you have some experience you'll have a much better idea what you need and want. Of course after all this advice it'll probably be a 20mm. ammo can forge and it'll be a good one. Betcha. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 I think the large number of guys and gals who just want to make knives is a good deal all the way around; they don't need to get very far into it to make things worth keeping for family and friends. Everything about knife making creates valuable skills for many kinds of craft work, and anyone who persists long enough will find success; that's a pretty neat deal in today's world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outdoor gater Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 I've just completed my journey of building my first gas forge. I've bought a 2 lb cross pin hammer at Ace and dressed it up along with a 1lb small ball pin hammer I allready owned. I polished the 1lb for finishing work. I'm bitting at the bit to start on knifes and hammers but I personally know I'm not ready yet. So that being said I planned on practicing the basic 8, then when I feel I've got the basic 8 down I'm going to try my smithing and make all types of tools. Until I'm sick of making tools. Hopefully by next fall I'll be good enough to hammer out a few knifes as gifts. Gator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B_HOSS Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 I started thinking I wanted to make knives... Haven't made one yet. Turns out I just love making anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 I know a couple of smiths that started by making knives and now make pretty much everything but knives...Its great that blacksmithing is such a wide field that one can "wander at will" in it having fun and learning new stuff all the while! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 "...having fun and learning new stuff all the while!" Yes, exactly! Having fun learning...that is a hard trick to beat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 Ayup, it's the best learning curve I know of. I've made a few blades but only use the Old Timer in my pocket and on RARE occasion I'll hang the Buck sheath knife Dad gave me for my 14th. B'day. on my belt. I've only ever used one of the ones I made to test them. Been making other . . . stuff for the 30+ years since, I even use some of it. It's the playing with fire and hitting things with hammers that's addictive you know. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave51B Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 10 hours ago, B_HOSS said: I started thinking I wanted to make knives... Haven't made one yet. Turns out I just love making anything. I've heard your life would be better if you make blades...... I don't know...............not a brain surgeon here Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 5, 2017 Share Posted February 5, 2017 While I know a couple of rocket scientists who make blades I personally don't know any brain surgeons who do so... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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