I am new to blacksmithing and don't know what to use for material. I was going to use rebar and railroad spikes, but heard they don't work that well. I am looking into making knives, nails, and different types of tools. Is there any other scrap/not expensive metal I can use for forging these things?

  Thanks so much

 

Your multiple question post has been split into multiple posts and placed on the correct forums.

A lot of these questions have been asked and answered before.  You should try cruising thru the site and reading some more so you have a better basis for asking your questions.

Junkyard steel is a mixed blessing.  Mild steel can be used for nails and some tooling (like tongs for instance), but knives and struck tools should probably be made of high carbon tool steel.  With the time invested in making knives, it is probably worth purchase of steel of known quality, but a fair source for tool steel are automotive shops that do a lot of modding of suspension.  If they have cutoffs from new coil or leaf springs  these can be used for making tools and knives.  You should probably consider starting with more basic projects to get the initial techniques down before assaying something as complicated as a knife, where esoteric things like proper heat treatment can make or break you.  Check out the many posts on beginning blacksmithing as well as the "stickies".

Start at my forge building and go about 6 miles north the scrapyard there will have tons of good metal to forge.  Not knowing even what country you are in makes it hard to suggest anything---"silver steel" may be a great suggestion in the UK but not found in Chile.  If you don't have a scrapyard near you I suggest going upstream and finding a medium sized ornamental iron shop that will sell you their drops at scrap rate.  This will be A36 and so not suitable for knives but will be a good cheap learning steel.  Once you have that down pat look into automotive springs and axles for higher carbon than A36 stuff

Good Morning, Mr Carver

There is no simple answer for a specific question.

First, where do you live and cast a shadow, Add your location to your Avatar.

Second, if YOU can't take the time to read all the information that is available in previous conversations on THIS web-site, How can ANYONE else help you??

Third, You have to forget about making a knife or a sword!! Learn how to Forge by making MANY mistakes and learn from your mistakes!!

Fourth, Find someone near you and take a Beginners Course. There are many available through your Local Blacksmith Associations.

Don't feel down.

To start, First you must start. Get away from the keyboard and make your body move!!

You need something to heat material with (a campfire?), You need something to hit on (a flat rock), You need something to hit with (another rock), you need something to hold your material with (vice-grips, pliers), You NEED something to Hit, You also need personal ear and eye protection!! If you burn yourself you will learn to not do that again (until next time), Read a book or this web-site and get an idea. Make it!! Keep trying until you can make a nice one, not a piece that looks like scrap. There is not a specific starting point, there is no end of the LEARNING, until you die.

Enjoy the Journey, it is not a free ride.

Neil

Rebar and A36 are made to meat a spisific engenering use, and can be nerly eanything, as they are generaly melted down scrap (small diamiter rebar from mexico temds to be faily high carbon) you can work with it just be aware that even A36 can have a section high enugh in carbon to crack when quenched.

spikes are low carbon so make good stock for learning and orniments, not knives, auto motive springs ar good for tools, tho be aware that old leafsprings can have stress cracks from fatigue. Truck axles, torsian bars, stering lincage, anti sway bars and such also lend them selves well to tools, with axles making fine hammers, bottom tools, top tools anx axez.

Edited July 23, 201511 yr by Charles R. Stevens

walk a railroad track with a 5 gallon bucket tons of free spikes to practice on

 

walk a railroad track with a 5 gallon bucket tons of free spikes to practice on

 

I've got to warn you if you do this. The RR police don't like it and there really are police that are employed by the RR company. Just a warning.

agreed. RR tracks are private property. Taking anything off the tracks can and will be considered theft.

Once again we have an good example of a beginner giving advice without knowing what he's talking about.

Picking up ANYTHING on a rail road right of way let alone a RR yard is a federal crime and the feds do NOT recognize a minor so you can be 15 and still get in more trouble than you ever dreamed of. Sure you might not get any prison time if you're in your mid teens but a federal record is forever and the fines are intended to teach you to NEVER do that again.

I'm not faulting folk for trying to be helpful we all try, especially when we're beginning in a craft. Unfortunately our unenlightened "help" can be more harm than good. Seriously, just possessing rr spikes in some places can get you in a lot of trouble unless you can document where you got them. And NO the RR doesn't sell spikes to the public, almost all stations have single buyer contracts for scrap.

You CAN buy new spikes though but buying 5/8" sq low carbon from the steel yard is more economical and you don't have to deal with the spike head.

Frosty The Lucky.

 

I would fine a metal supplier and pick up some 1/4 mild steel round and square. Cheap around .70 a foot by me, cuts easy, heats up fast, bends easy and you can make a lot of different stuff. Hooks, candle holders, harts, nails, pop holders, hotdog cookers, marshmallow cookers, pokers, corkscrew,  practice twist.   

1/4"  stock is one of the fastest ways between smithing and money in my experience---good for demo's too as it works up fast.

Well Ive picked up enough railroad spikes to be put in railroad prison -  In my area it's not that big of a deal -- nor are the tracks maintained or patrolled like they are in different places -  Never been told that it was an issue and i have a buddy who works for the RR

Gabe are you sure you want to post that information on an open forum and in public?

Edited July 23, 201511 yr by Glenn

I dont condone breaking the law nor do i do it. Here where i am located there are Zero trespassing signs or warnings and there are old abandoned sections of track. Do they miss a 5 gallon bucket of rusted spikes that they pulled out years before or care? Here, i dont think so. If that were the case every person with a railroad spike knife or creation would be getting sued ?

Edited July 23, 201511 yr by gabe4183

Gabe, it doesn't really matter if they enforce the law or not.  Do you want to be the one to be made an example of?  The guys here may seem hard, don't take it wrong.  They do have your best interest in mind.  After all, they don't let you work a forge in the pen.  (not that that's were this would land you, probably more of a hefty fine). 

Personally, I won't wast the time with RR spike.  If you must use scrap (I started with it too) a modern truck leaf spring will give enough steel to make a lot of knives.  Better to spend a little and get some known steel to work.

MY experiance is that if you ask at the local maintanance yard they will happaly give some, and if you bring back somthing made from one they will give you more. And it keeps you safe. Most of the time no one minds but it only takes one guy with a grudge or a derailment in your area and then things can go bad fast

Ever talk with the RR police?  I have, not pleasant and like Homeland Security they have broad powers that make local police departments drool with envy! And CRS not only did they use to allow you to forge in prison they used to force you to!  Part of the prison industries at one time.  Ohio Tool used to use prisoners to forge their tools.  I have a book of historical photos of American prisons just for the picture of a room full of forges in a prison. IIRC I'll get the cite next time I am at home with the big library.

RR spikes can be hard to hold, you will need tongs that will go around the head of the RR Spike and hold it tight. Gravity like to pull them onto the floor. You will also have to do a lot of hammering to get it to move or shape. I would start with long stock so you don't have to use tongs the entire project.    

Or you can get a big bucket of nice new, unbent, unrusted spikes for around $1.50 per. Right here.

MY experiance is that if you ask at the local maintanance yard they will happaly give some, and if you bring back somthing made from one they will give you more. And it keeps you safe. Most of the time no one minds but it only takes one guy with a grudge or a derailment in your area and then things can go bad fast

I think this is the best way to do it if you wanted to be honest and safe, plus if the guys at the maintenance yard know you forge stuff they might have other metal that you can have (at the yard or at home), you could end up with some pretty nice metal since most people dont know what they have and will gladly give you their "junk" to make the wife happy lol.

but back on topic, some materials that i started with are rebar( i know some people frown on rebar but for practicing i have never had a problem with it), RR spikes, small axle shafts from a gokart,leaf springs, used mower blades, metal from home depot etc etc. if you ask around you can find almost anything. One thing you have to remember is that if you never ask the answer is always NO. you can always ask your mechanic if he will let you have springs,torsion bars and axle shafts or whatever else you could use off of a vehicle and you can always ask a scrap yard if they sell. calling up a steel yard is also a good place to get beginner materials, the owner or person in charge will always be glad to sell you drops.

 

I get mine from the scrap yard and get a receipt saying I bought XYZ spikes on it.

Around here a walk down the road turns up all kinds of goodies, scored a 18" flange block off 1" thick. I carry a coulle of buckets on the driving cart and saddle bags on the horses

RR police?? Fines?? Posts like this make me appreciate being Australian! Bucket loads of railway spikes for the asking. 

What I'm wondering now is what dill-weed went down the rail and started stripping spikes off of the tracks?  Something similar had to happen to warrant it being made a federal crime.  It's either that or some buddy of a railroad tycoon had a buddy who had a bunch of goons that needed work and it just stuck.  Ah, the good 'ol boy network, that's who to blame.

 cuple of things, first, fear of rail sabitage, been a cotage industry cince the civil war. Train robers, hostile natives, enemy agents ect. Then some on in the rail industry relised that crap steel was a valubal resorce and as the laws to protect rails from sabatage were in place they simply aplied them to protect their "investment".

I remember some fool put a derailer on the tracks between Phonixe and Tuson when I was a kid. Of corse, back in the 80's (as now) the go erment dost want to call it terrorism if it happens here.