Everything Mac Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 I'm sure there was a thread on this but I can't find it. Are there any advantages/ disadvantages of a metal stand over a wooden block? Considering building a metal stand for my anvil. I've always thought a really solid wooden stand would absorb more of the noise or vibration than a metal stand no? Cheers Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newbieforge Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 Hello Andy, I have built a couple of metal stands, and they are great. I cut some thin rubber mat, and put it between the stand and the anvil. It is thin enough that it doesn't absorb too much of the energy, but is thick enough that it absorbs acoustic frequencies well enough to null the anvil's ring. You will most likely get responses from people who say that only metal stands are good, or that only wood stands are good, and that any debate to the contrary is foolish. I would say, just use whatever material you think you will like the best. If you don't like it, it's not that hard to try another. Regards, Markus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pulsepushthepopulace Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 Hardwood tree stumps. free. heavy. easy to secure. Spend less time frogging about and more time smithing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macbruce Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 Mine is made of metal and concrete. 2x the weight of the anvil.........It never moves a MM when I'm working on it but when I want to move it about it's no problem on my concrete floor....it works for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel.85 Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 Whatever you make it out of, just make it as heavy as possible and able to secure to the ground. Wobbly is for noobs. Mine is wood, I wouldnt mind having a metal base for my next anvil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel OF Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 Glad someone else has asked this as I was thinking of making a metal stand. I'm like you Mac, I'd imagine the same on the noise/vibration front. To overcome that I was thinking of making the sides reasonably tall and including a solid base so I could put sand in there to deaden it down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everything Mac Posted April 4, 2013 Author Share Posted April 4, 2013 Whatever you make it out of, just make it as heavy as possible and able to secure to the ground. Wobbly is for noobs. Mine is wood, I wouldnt mind having a metal base for my next anvil. .... Sadly I'm unable to secure it to the ground. I work out of a small shed in a rented property, I simply can't bolt it to the ground. My current stand is wood, was thinking of building a metal one with a tripod base. Is the force sent down through the legs rather than straight down through a log then? Daft questions I know.. . Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John McPherson Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 IMNSHO, the rigidity of the stand is more important than the material. Save the bedrail and thin pipe for tong stands. You want the heaviest, thickest angle, pipe or plate you can lay hands on. If it weighs 2X more than the anvil, so much the better. Just make sure that you tie the legs together just above ground level with a 'Y' or 'H' brace to prevent hopping when you pound on it. Foot plates with holes to spike it to the earth, or use concrete anchors, are a bonus. Just remember at demos that there may be underground utilities or lawn sprinkler systems. (Don't ask how I know this.) Unless your stump is rotten like balsa, a whole chunk of any species green tree trunk ought to be plenty sturdy. Just make sure the top and bottom cuts are parallel. If the base is slightly cupped so that it rests on the rim, so much the better. Take the bark off to keep the bug and fungus problem down, or you will have to add wildlife ID to your skills list. Built up bases of 2 bys or larger work if you use lots of construction adhesive/lag screws/all-thread to secure it together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yves Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 My anvil (#275) stands on a piece of plywood topping the sand that fills a 1/4inch steel box. It does not move. I believe it does deaden the ring. I can move it with my overhead "crane". It works great... for me that is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Turley Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 ...following up from Yves' response I saw in Otto Schmirler's* book that they put the anvil in a fabbed steel box of sand. Three of mine in the shop are fixed that way and also fastened down with iron straps, allthread, nuts and bolts to keep the anvil from swimming around. Our sand is easily gotten from the New Mexico arroyos. Synonyms for arroyo would be dry wash, gully, draw, and coulee depending on where you are in the U.S. Not all of 'em have sand though. I like the sand box; it gives good rebound and deadens the ringing sound a little. *"Werk und Werkzeug des Kunstschmieds" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale M. Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 If using a metal stand go big... I mean use heavy wall tubing (1/4 inch) or more.... I used about 1/8 wall tubing on steel stand I made and there was a resilience or bounce to the light tubing that made the stand actually walk or vibrate across the floor.... Have since gone to a wood stand (for trial) made up of crossed 2x4 laid in "cribbing" manner with screws and glue and it does not walk ( sort of a artificial stump) ..... Not sure about any bounce or resilience to hammer blows on anvil.... At least I'm not chasing anvil across cement floor.... Dale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobody Special Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 Personal preference. Just as long as it's stable and heavy. I like wood or a stump myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaughnT Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 You can really silence an anvil by setting it down in a bead of silicone caulk. Doesn't matter if the stand is wood or metal, just that there is a silicone bead between the two. I didn't think it would work until I did it with my Wilkinsons anvil. It went from ringing like a church bell to almost as quiet as a Fisher anvil. Wood stump and no other "silencers" used. Is wood better than metal? Only if that's all you have to work with. Most folks are using reasonably light anvils and a heavier stump will make that light anvil work like a heavier anvil if the two are securely attached to one another. Wood rots, metal rusts. Wood is easier to work with and comes pressure-treated against bugs...... Lots of variables to consider. The key is making sure the stand and anvil are rigidly fastened together so that they act like one unit. Oh, and the silicone caulk to take the ring out of the thing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everything Mac Posted April 4, 2013 Author Share Posted April 4, 2013 Cheers guys, much appreciated. As said the current stand is made of wood. It works well enough but I had no idea how much it wobbled. I was thinking a steel base might be more secure. Need to find the time to make one now! All the best Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 Andy: As usual, ask two blacksmiths a question and you'll get 3-4 answers, let alone a fora with a few thousand members. Anywho, I have one anvil mounted on a spruce block and the other on a steel tripod stand. The Sodorfors is morticed into the spruce block when it was green so the anvil is shrink fit and doesn't move. It is however a real ear buster but it IS a Sodorfors. The Trenton is on the steel stand and is far quieter than it was on wood. The steel stand has a different resonant frequency so they damp each other in a couple resonant bounces. The anvil is loud but quiets almost immediately. The wood block damps the Sodorfors, HC steel face on a cast steel body but it takes almost a second, the wood itself doesn't damp the vibrations, the tight mortice does. I have used an anvil mounted on a sandbox and highly recommend this type stand for a number of reasons. First it's really easy to adjust the height by adjusting the sand under it. you can move it pretty easily by dumping the sand. They're quiet, the quietest I've encountered, sand doesn't resonate for beans unless you're an earthquake. The one down check you see for sandbox stands is the need to adjust them regularly as the sand shifts. This is really only a problem if you use alluvial sand from a beach, creak, etc. as the grains are rounded so it's like using a bag of marbles to mound something on. If you buy crushed sand it'll pack like concrete without bonding and your anvil isn't going anywhere unless you make it. Thems my six bits. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nhblacksmith Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 I have two anvils in my shop, a 250# Kohlswa mounted on an 8 foot piece of 12" x 16" rock maple set 6' into the ground. This anvil is securely bolted to the wood with a piece of truck tire inner tube between the anvil and the wood. It is rock solid and whisper quiet. The second anvil is a 165# Kohlswa mounted on a steel base that I built. The base is a piece of 12" I-beam on end of the proper height with a rectangular base of 1/2" steel plate which is slightly larger that the I-beam and a top which is also plate but the size of the I-beam. I have a couple hardy racks welded to the side and a shelf welded between the flanges to the web. Two pieces of angle iron go over the base ends of the anvil and are bolted to the top plate. This anvil also has a piece of inner tube between the anvil and the steel plate and it is just as quiet as the wood mount. If you know Kohlswa anvils, you know that they ring like bells and would be impossible to work on for any length of time without dampening the sound. The smaller anvil can be slid around the forge area as needed or used as a portable for demonstrations by moving it with a two wheel dolly. When used outside, the plate base (as opposed to legs) keeps it from sinking into the ground when struck. Either anvil is more than solid enjough for work with a striker and a 20# sledge though we tend to use the permanently mounted one more for that. My shop has mostly a concrete floor but in the forge area I used dry-laid brick so I would have the option to sink an anvil stump and vise stand. I think either a wood or metal base is fine as long as the anvil is securely fastened to the base so they become as one and I find no real advantage or disadvantage to either. They both get used daily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everything Mac Posted April 5, 2013 Author Share Posted April 5, 2013 Cheers frosty. Is the anvil simply sat on top of the sand? No brackets or anything keeping it In place? I would have thought it would move to one side as you strike? Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yesteryearforge Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 I have never attached an anvil to its base I have used various way to capture the base to keep the anvil from moving around or falling off its base wheter a stump ,boards or a metal stand. My vote is for a metal stand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Sayers Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 I think metal tripod stands are the best. Yes, they cost more than stumps, but I like that I can get my feet under them and get in closer to the anvil when I want to. With a stump, you will have to stand a little further out and bend in over the anvil. I find it easier to find a comfortable posture and work long hours with a metal stand. A thin sheet of plywood between the stand an anvil will work good to dampen it. Some people like rubber, but I like plywood (I do like to put strips of inner tube under the feet though). If you really want to eliminate as much ring as possible, pack the legs with oil-soaked sawdust (I think it works better than sand to dampen vibrations). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThorsHammer82 Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 my feeling is it's personal preference based on desired qualities and material accessibility. wood/stumps are easy, cheap, and readily accessible. Metal stands are customizable and effective. Both work fine, and many or most will use both regularly or find one they love and never turn back. I've used both. and don't have a favorite. Either works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSW Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Note original thread is from April 2013... One comment on steel vs wood stands. 3 legged steel stands are often a better choice for those who have to use uneven ground say at demos/fairs while a flat cut stump may be tough to level and stabilize. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlotte Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Since I have relatively light anvils, < 200 lbs. , I like to tie my anvil down securely as I often use hardie fixtures for bending and twisting. I favor heavy hardwood stumps that are as heavy as my anvil. I chainsaw the base to three contact points. ( Work by my self and have limited space these days) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThorsHammer82 Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 ^ is a great solutions, and one I think I'll be implementing shortly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 That's excellent Charlotte, good thinking! I wonder how it'd work if a guy just nailed 2"x4" blocks to 3 points on the base?Hmmmmmm.Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gote Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 forbidden Again! If you ask two blacksmiths...but it really depends on the anvil, your work habits your location your..... If you have a heavy anvil you do not need to tie it down. My 250 pound anonymous north Swedish type stands rock solid on its stump. My 80 pound Kohlsva London pattern is tied down. I have used four 6" square section nails and one result is a very obvious silencing of the ring. For both anvils, I have made sure that there is a thigh fit between all four corners of the anvil feet and the stump. Anvil undersides are not perfectly flat so this is important. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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