Gunsmith's anvil

[Jobtiel1]

Hi all,

In my frequent browsing of our local online marketplace, I came across this anvil. The seller had a whole story about it. The anvil weighs 237 kg, and was used in a smithy from an old stone factory, presumably a factory where they make stuff out of slabs of stone.

He said that the gap in the face was used to make gun barrels. I'm in no place to buy it at the moment, he is asking 750 euros, which is a premium price for an anvil of that size here. But nevertheless it's a really cool anvil!

Have you ever come across anvils like this? Every once in a while one of these special anvils pops up. Maybe after I finish my studies I can see if I can afford one.

~Jobtiel

[George N. M.]

Cool anvil and good price by USA standards. $1.60/lb.  However, I am skeptical about the gun barrel story since the taper on the groove seems too steep for that.  Clearly, the anvil was made for some specialized purpose which involved the forging of a particular taper but that's as far as I can take it.

If it were over here there would be a LOT of people willing to pay that price.

"By hammer and hand all arts do stand."

[Jobtiel1]

I thought that too, I was thinking about maybe tapers, or sockets for chisels, since it might be easier to shape the socket with a drift inside if you have a matching taper in your anvil. I haven't contacted the guy, I reckon he's a smith since he mentioned you can test the anvil at his place. Maybe I'll go visit him some time and talk about the anvil a bit.

~Jobtiel

[JHCC]

The gun barrel thing sounds like a story made up to justify the higher cost.

On the other hand, one does see interesting wear patterns on anvils sometimes. Some years back, IFI member Lou L posted some photos of an anvil that had belonged to a renowned maker of handcuffs; it had two or three deep grooves worn into the handle from working those specific diameters. (Lou took the photos at the home of the person who inherited the maker's shop and tools, if memory serves. He himself didn't get the anvil, but he did pick up a whole bunch of specialized tongs and pliers for his own use.)

[anvil]

Sockets are what I thought too. You wouldn't need a top tool, just a cross peen hammer to set it into the grove, then roll it with the hammer while in the groove, or a mandrel that goes into the taper to roll the socket,, interesting detail to think about. 

[Jobtiel1]

Wear would be interesting here, the rest of the anvil seems to be in good shape, so it would be kind of weird for this gap to be caused by wear I imagine. I can't come up with something outside of a socket for maybe farming tools that would warrant a specific gap in an anvil. Maybe some industrial process needed this specific taper over and over again and reckoned it was easier to have an anvil maker make this gap in there for them instead of doing it with swages or free-hand.

~Jobtiel

[anvil]

Actually, I was thinking some special tool needed in the old stone factory for working stone.  

[Frosty]

Anvils weren't so sacred in the days they were a common shop tool and cutting or carving them for a special purpose was pretty common. In one of the books I lost there were photos of different anvils that were modified for making "French Clips." They were all similar mods but not a word about what a French clip was, or pic. 

I think it looks like a socket swage, lots of tools in a quarry require handles and if they're used hard, then replacements might have been a common shop job.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Scott NC]

  I googled "pistol barrel anvil" and under "images" was an anvil that looked just like this.  It was on pxntrest and I would link it but it would probably go against the rules.  They said it was a Belgian anvil and made the same barrel making claim.  Here is their image of it:

 

[ThomasPowers]

Perhaps the same one?

[Scott NC]

  I suppose that's possible.  I went ahead and signed up on pxntrest to see if I could find out more but the image disappeard.  I even tried the same search terms on their site and got thousands of other pictures.  It probably is... Never mind....

[Jobtiel1]

It looks nearly identical, the seller doesn't live in Belgium, but the anvil could have travelled a bit, it's not that far off. His claims are probably false if that's the only anvil that comes up.

~Jobtiel

[ThomasPowers]

A lot of people make unfounded claims about smithing stuff just from lack of background knowledge.  Perhaps they were "guessing" and could only think of one reason for it when smiths might come up with a half dozen.  Remember Hanlon's razor---"never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

[Daswulf]

I feel like I remember seeing multiple different sized half rounds on a swage block being used to make a barrel of a gun on smithing videos. That one in the anvil would be quite limited to one step. I'd bet it is more specialized to something else. 

[BartW]

Hello; I live in Belgium, very close to Herstal; and I've been through the old (and new) gun workshop places. They have lot's of anvils, but all were flat. For making barrels they  have huge swage blocks; and power hammer dies the size of anvils with different rounds in them.  I've never seen an anvil with a halfround cut-out in the surface. All barrel making is done with power hammers making the huge blocks of twisted steel; making that round and then over to a lathe.

I do have another theory... what if it was a cutout for anvil blocks; like a power hammer die fixture ? They were fairly common; and if that shape get's worn out; they may have ground it to a half-round ?
Belgian anvils have very distinctive feet actually (wide and relatively flat); have a look at UAT anvils. To me this one seems more german like the S&H anvils.

 

[Jobtiel1]

I think its a good theory that it was a cutout for anvil block, and once that became worn they ground it out to a tapered half round to assist in making of tool sockets. 

~Jobtiel