Mikey98118 Posted February 16, 2021 Share Posted February 16, 2021 On 2/10/2019 at 12:29 PM, Mikey98118 said: You will probably end up needing a .020" to .022" jet orifice size, although his burners might even draw enough air to support an .025" orifice. I ended up with slightly longer than 1/2" lengths of heavy wall capillary tube trapped in MIG tips with interference fits, on my own 3/8" burners. This was a misleading fact. Those lengths ended up just shy of 5/16" by the time they were sanded shorter, during tuning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted April 28, 2021 Share Posted April 28, 2021 AFD is being very quite; I wonder whats new here... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Another FrankenBurner Posted April 30, 2021 Author Share Posted April 30, 2021 I'm still around. Just when I thought life was slowing down, it had other plans. Not much to report on the burner front. Four forges in the hands of four smiths. I have not heard a complaint yet. I have spent a bit of time testing the burners in two different forges and the only negative I've got is that they are quite loud after you have listened to them a while. I think it is time I start working on a NARB. I continue to work on the burners in my mind. I'm not sure if it is progress or madness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted April 30, 2021 Share Posted April 30, 2021 It's not madness unless the voices start calling each other names while arguing. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted April 30, 2021 Share Posted April 30, 2021 I think NARBs are one solution to noise pollution; baffle walls are the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hefty Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 So, I hope you don't mind AFB, but with some of your dimensions, and some guesstimations, I've reverse engineered a version of your v30 in 1/2" for myself. It works like a charm!! Thank you for all your hard work! I don't have a nozzle yet and I haven't had time to really play around and tune it but I lit it for the first time tonight and got a stable flame straight off the mix tube at low pressure. It's not hugely evident in these photos but I can see the vortex in the flame even at low pressure like some of your photos earlier in the thread. I can't wait to get an appropriately sized nozzle attached to it and really put it through its paces! Cheers, Jono. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Another FrankenBurner Posted August 31, 2021 Author Share Posted August 31, 2021 I sure don't mind. I think it's great. I'm excited for you. Straight off the mix tube is fun but once you put a nozzle on it and step up the velocity, it will roar. I think I once called it an angry little jet. You can't help but smile when you hear it the first few times. I am now playing with ribbon burners to quiet that roar. After several hours, the noise gets to me. Very important, try to keep everything axially aligned. In your picture, it looks like that is not the case which is why the flame is not symmetric. The orifice and mix tube alignment being the most critical. A small misalignment in them can severely compromise the potential. I saw your question in burners 101 about beveling a Mikey hoping to get more vortex. Did you try it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 I suspect that beveling the longitudinal edges of rectangular air openings, won't provide much greater spin to incoming air; turning them into useful parallelograms, would require the use of a master pattern cut from the next larger pipe or tube, or twisting a small angle, so that it lays on the mixing tube at an angle. Of course, I could be mistaken, but that is my prediction, I don't bother designing burner improvements that very few people will copy, but others are encouraged to go beyond the old guy's finish line Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 We were looking at the vanes on a jet engine at the scrapyard recently and were wondering how well they would act to swirl the air at the intakes...Unfortunately the engine parts are in the middle of a court case so not for sale---yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hefty Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 The alignment is good, just the copper tubing is "pre-loved" refrigeration tube so it's not perfectly straight before it enters the plastic. The end and the MIG tip are pretty well aligned inside the plastic. Hehe, no, I didn't try the hand bevelling. When I read Mikey's response I had a bit of a head slap moment: I have access to a 3d printer and I'd been reading this thread for a while so why wouldn't I just print a vortex inducing head? I'm planning to use this one as a torch for smaller/shorter heats so hopefully the roar won't get to me too much, but I do also plan to make a narb for the 3/4 T burner I made for a forge. You guys and your burner designs have all just reignited my joy of curiosity and tinkering! Cheers, Jono. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 I have never had troubling noise levels from a burner that was mounted in a forge; they are easily reduced into insignificance by baffle walls. Remember that exhaust gas can go around corners just fine; but not sound waves. A burner is just one small part of a gas forge to get right. You want to be just as serious about getting all the other parts right, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hefty Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 I'm definitely serious about getting the other parts of the forge right, I just don't have the materials yet. I have an old 9kg gas bottle and two old disposable helium tanks (about the same size as the gas bottle but thinner steel) to choose from for the shell. There's a very small market for refractory materials at the hobby level here but the one supplier in Australia (that I know of) who specifically deals with "hobbyists" and "artisans" has a kit with ceramic wool, rigidizer, satanite and a fire brick for a door, so I've just got to save my pennies. I started with the burners because the parts are cheaper and (slightly) more available (especially the 3d printed part for me). Mikey, with baffle walls do you mean, for example, setting a wall perpendicular up against one interior wall of the forge and a door parallel to that baffle but up against the opposite side of the forge kinda like this: Where the blue are the baffles and the exhaust path indicated by black arrows. Cheers, Jono. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Another FrankenBurner Posted September 1, 2021 Author Share Posted September 1, 2021 I had thought about the parallelograms in the past. At the time I was thinking something like the hybrid burner only with diagonal cutouts. I was going to print a scaled paper cut pattern. Something like this: If anyone is interested in doing so, I can send a scaled printable pdf so long as I know the OD of the pipe you are working with, and the desired length and angle of the cutouts. I have been curious about it for a while. As to the noise level, even with full baffle walls, it is more the constant drone in the background that can get to me. The forge noise and my tinnitus play tennis together I think. I shut the forge off and something in my mind relaxes. Almost always, I am wearing hearing protection so it doesn't bother me. It's usually just when I am in the forge with someone else and not wearing the muffs. If we start using jet engine parts, I will have to get better hearing protection. Hefty, I think that will make a great hand torch. It's a healthy flame. I have a 3/8" version with a bent angle iron pistol grip. It is very handy. I have to admit, my mind took a double take on your baffle wall image. I'll leave it at that. As to the baffle wall, this post in forges 101 talks about it. Keep on tinkering. It is good fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 As the refractories we use may be used for boiler repair you might make a friend or two in that business as the scraps from that will do a forge for us! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 I 14 hours ago, Another FrankenBurner said: I had thought about the parallelograms in the past. At the time I was thinking something like the hybrid burner only with diagonal cutouts. Once again, you're right on track. I think that would make a very hot burner design, and about as good as anyone that can't print burner parts can get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew LB Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 Wow. I'm new to the site and just came across this thread and am very impressed with what you've been doing here. I'm sure its been mentioned already, but if you haven't, you should probably get a patent on your designs that work real well. Because if you don't, you'll be seeing them on Aliexpress in a few weeks i'd wager. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Another FrankenBurner Posted March 21, 2022 Author Share Posted March 21, 2022 Hello Andrew. Welcome to the site. If you like to learn, it's a great place to be. My original intention was to make my experiments public. Both, so others could learn with me and so that wiser others could point out my errors or offer suggestions. At one point I did pursue a patent, but I remembered that original intent and stopped. This thread is now prior art so "my" burner belongs to the public. If clones are eventually mass produced, I would feel accomplished. Until then, I'm just a guy in his garage having fun. Hopefully the clones are decent and inexpensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 Since the Chinese love to produce products fom zinc-aluminum castings, it's probably only a matter of time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted April 3, 2022 Share Posted April 3, 2022 On 4/29/2021 at 11:38 PM, Frosty said: It's not madness unless the voices start calling each other names while arguing. So, if they're just giggling a lot I'm still okay? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted April 3, 2022 Share Posted April 3, 2022 Oh yeah, that's a good sign. The voices and I say so. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted April 3, 2022 Share Posted April 3, 2022 That is a relief. You know that laughter is contagious. When the voices are having a party, I can't help grinning and giggling a little with their antics, but people look at me funny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted April 3, 2022 Share Posted April 3, 2022 I got used to people looking at me funny. Then I realized I was doing and saying things to get the look and it wasn't doing my career any good. Now I'm retired! Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted April 3, 2022 Share Posted April 3, 2022 Yup; I remember my first "proper job" Supervisor telling me that "You don't have to say everything that goes through your mind during a meeting". So I shut up and just inventoried my scars while looking attentive... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted April 3, 2022 Share Posted April 3, 2022 The people in charge preferred me in the better seen and not heard group. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted October 1, 2022 Share Posted October 1, 2022 On 8/31/2021 at 8:18 PM, Another FrankenBurner said: As to the noise level, even with full baffle walls, it is more the constant drone in the background that can get to me. The forge noise and my tinnitus play tennis together I think. I shut the forge off and something in my mind relaxes. You will be glad to know that the ringing is your ears goes away after a while. Then shop noise falls way off too; its great for working steel, but not for hearing your wife. Some guys feel that is a blessing too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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