POLL VIP Membership feeler...

[Pulsepushthepopulace]

Issues and concerns pop up from time to time in the realm of forum evolution. A great deal of issues can spawn from the win and wann of updated systems and a growing forum; the need for more server space, bugs and fixes, administration needs, coding, spam hunting, etc. The purpose of this poll is to generate a tangible count on how many of you wouldn't mind making a monetary contribution towards a VIP- like iForgeIron experience. Below is an example of perks that could possibly be implemented, as an incentive to go VIP, to include a subforum viewable by VIPs only. This subforum can serve as a platform for special correspondence, possibly sponsorship incentives?, or whatever else your imagination comes up with... Heck, maybe someone can throw in a cool bumper sticker to sweeten the deal???

 

For those whom cannot afford it;

In my past experience in forums with this VIP option, the forum admin and moderators would recruit helpful members of the forum by sponsoring 1 year memberships. In an even more selfless notion, VIP members themselves might sponsor a valued member. 

 

The whole point in this is to support the website with the availability of capital for furthering it's capabilities and expanding an already priceless hub of information. Excess cash flow could further the setup of IFI sponsored events, establish a retail portal for merchandise, or even offer scholarships to young budding smiths that lack the financial means to further themselves... ( just brainstorming possibilities)

 

example of perks;

 

 

So, who's willing, able, or interested in such a step??? Who's not??? 

 

add an additional input as to Why? / Why not?

 

air your opinion and reasoning... open platform and no looming judgment with either choice..

[TedT2]

I Forge Iron VIP

Pulsepushthepopulace I have a few questions for you.

Your relationship to Glenn and I Forge Iron makes a big difference about my response to your question that you have posed to us.

 

1. Are you a part of Glenn’s staff?

2. Is this your Idea, or was you asked by Glenn to fix the site?  

 

To my way of thinking, we have enough people that act like VIP's.  

Blacksmiths that are Skilled and not Skilled, OLD and NEW, Poor or Rich, come in here.

They are all VIP's in my thinking. 

 

Now if Glenn asked this same question, or if he asked you to do this; that is another story.

Glenn has done nothing but Give, Give, Give to all of us!

This kind of a question should only come from the authorized people who are in charge.

 

I think some deep thought would be in order about the outcome of what dividing up people by financial ability and making them VIP’s will do to this site.

Being a VIP does not make them a better blacksmith, but may sound good to some.

 

If Glenn is upgrading the site, Then so be it!  Again; That is another story! 

[LastRonin]

I voted "Maybe, how much we talkin here?" As long as it is reasonably within my budget... Absolutely. I am not poverty-stricken, but do not have much leeway in my budget. But to keep within what I perceive the original intent of the site to have been... the VIP benefits would need to be structured in such a way that they did not at all hinder someone who didn't have the money to get it from accessing any of the information they may need to learn and grow. So in that respect, not sure what benefits it should provide... maybe a tshirt or hat...

[macbruce]

What Ted sed..... :)

[Chinobi]

I left myself unvoted, because i didnt see an option for where i felt most comfortable, which would be 'i am infavor of monetarily supporting the site, but i dont like the idea of stratifying the environment'.  I have bought IFI shirts, and i will probably pick up more in the future, but im not a fan of status based content.

 

i think if anything a VIP concept should be geared towards physical stuff.  support the site with a donation, get a little badge that says supporter or VIP or what have you, and recieve a handful of unique swag comensurate to the level of donation.

 

the whole concept of the site that i have seen and have been led to believe is an atmosphere of open communication and sharing of ideas and information, which a special members only section may hamper. to me it seems that adding a roped off section of the forum only for VIP's will discourage new members or members that cannot field the capital to buy their rank.  they may perceive the VIP section as the established community trying to keep out the new folks, or keeping all the 'trade secrets' there, or otherwise as a platform of exclusion.  i have been in the 'cheap seats' on many forums in the past, its not the same experience and i did not stay long.

 

as to the other perks as prototyped, necking down the resources (file size, number of photos, etc) feels to me like a disincentive to participation, as it would make it that much more difficult for a new smith to post photos of their kit and setup for critique and advice if they are hamstrung by the number of photos they can post.  makes it kind of hard to post pics of projects for advice and questions as well.

 

i will specifically exclude special avatar perks and other non-obnoxious profile asthetics type incentives because that is more along the lines of upgrading your appearance/experience than changing access to available information and is the kind of perk that goes well with wanting to support something you appreciate.  however increaseing avatar size may make load times painful for members on slow connections.

 

special online options and sections for VIP status may also incur expanded O&M costs, which could make the cost of upgrading the system prohibitive, or require some minimum number of subscribers before it breaks even.

 

there may also be some tax ramifications requiring the establishment of a non-profit if we were to offer scholarships or otherwise funnel donations to causes outside the site or to individual members (im not an accountant, just musing)

 

TLDR: i think the VIP experience should be limited to the aforementioned cool bumper sticker, or keychain/hat/special edition T-shirt, and some kind of 'power member' or 'VIP/supporter' tag stacked somewhere with the username, avatar, member status etc, rather than significant special privilages within the forums.  we want a system like the public library, give name and basic contact info to get your black and gold card(in california at any rate) and access to the nations supply of literature and knowledge, not like a newspaper website where you can only read the executive summary and need to sign up with $$ to see the full article.

 

edit: couple of tweaks for de-railed train of thought.

[David Einhorn]

So if I understand correctly, a person without a VIP membership might be prevented from posting images and/or PMs that help answer people's questions.  :lol:

[doc]

I agree with Ted and macruce.............

[Chinobi]

So if I understand correctly, a person without a VIP membership might be prevented from posting images and/or PMs that help answer people's questions.  :lol:

 

i have seen similar restrictions based on how long someone has been a member, a sort of 'probationary period' to keep people from spamming and make sure that the user is actually serious about joining.

 

come to think of it, that might help incentivize people to read through some of the stickies before they lead in with 'halp i needz anvil!' :)

(and yes i just doublechecked to make sure i didnt do that myself :ph34r: )

[Judson Yaggy]

Seems to me that PPP is just offering a modest and rough idea for a possible solution to current and ongoing challenges in regards to the funding of IFI.  Nitpicking details at this point would be distracting, let the powers that be decide what is a good idea and what is not.  He made a real suggestion about fixing a real problem.  Kudos even if it doesn't work out.  Honesty would dictate that he disclose if he was asked to post such a poll by the admns.  

 

Everyone should be aware that hackles are up due to the irritation of the current problems and human nature being what it is that will aggravate annoyances past or present.  

 

I am here because I ENJOY being here (talking about blacksmithing), I assume that this holds true for most others, administrators are admins because they like running a site for blacksmiths.  If this is untrue perhaps we should re-evaluate our priorities.  

[windancer]

I am not sure why this is being brought up except by the owner/manager of the board?

 

I think the problems that crop up are part of living and that fixes will always take a little time to ID the source of the problem, the required fix to the problem and the resources to implement the fix.

 

A little gratitude goes a long, long, way.

 

I am thrilled with the entire board!

 

Dave

[Pulsepushthepopulace]

I have no affiliation with Glenn nor did this thread originate from anyone in the staff.  I've pitched quite a few fits with him myself, almost left a couple of times due to moderation disconnects. I just have to settle down, look at the big picture, and realize that this place is at the top of online references to blacksmithing. I want the art to flourish, I want to be a part of it's rebirth... I see an issue, then see a plausible solution.... 

 

 

This idea originates from another forum I am a member of, and the VIP implementation served it well. It's probably one of the closest knit communities I'd ever been a part of, and the members hold the support of the forum in the highest regard. The rules over there are very lax, and the community is genuinely motivated in keeping the fight alive. 

 

All these ideas that are coming across are essential in tweaking the VIP  idea to suit the needs and wants of the forum. 

 

The proposition isn't meant to be a profitable venture, it's more of a cohesive implement, and one that enables the forum to grow. I think 

 

out side forum link removed

[Sask Mark]

I can remeber 2 times since I joined when Glenn had a fundraising drive.  It was purely voluntary and there was no penalties or rewards for contributing or not contributing.  Glenn was extremely fair about it and, if memory serves, the fundraising goals were met.  

 

I would gladly donate again if another fundraising drive was held.

[Pulsepushthepopulace]

 

I totally agree that there should be no divisive connotation, maybe some sort of physical service to the forum could count towards the VIP??? Say IFI and a regional organization such as FABA (just using one off the top of my head) sponsor a demo at a school or a craft fair... If your local to said demo, go out, get involved, help set-up, and earn it that way... 

 

On the note that everyone is a VIP, I agree to the core of my being that not one individual should be declared "better than someone else" by a simple title... The VIP is just the designator used in my other forum, you could simply title it as "supporter" if you'd like... or iron head... or hammer time...

[Chinobi]

My apologies Juddson, i had no intention of coming off as nitpicking.

 

Pulse provided a well thought out and detailed proposal of his plan, and asked for our opinions and ideas and why we thought that way.

 

 

add an additional input as to Why? / Why not?

 

air your opinion and reasoning... open platform and no looming judgment with either choice..

 

to which i have responded in kind, with my comments on his proposal and the reasons why i think that way.

 

i know i would appreciate a detailed answer more than a simple yes or no when the question was posed to brainstorm.

[Pulsepushthepopulace]

My apologies Juddson, i had no intention of coming off as nitpicking.

 

Pulse provided a well thought out and detailed proposal of his plan, and asked for our opinions and ideas and why we thought that way.

 

 

 

to which i have responded in kind, with my comments on his proposal and the reasons why i think that way.

 

i know i would appreciate a detailed answer more than a simple yes or no when the question was posed to brainstorm.

 

Any and all responses are appreciated, and lets face, it if it's a total wash I have nothing personally invested in this except the time it took to make the poll and the attached thread... I like fresh ideas, and logical perspectives... in the middle we find that communal mindset...

 

 

I did however LOL at the "being apart of Glenns staff..." It's not beyond reality, but if any of my conversations with him via PM were public, it would be all to clear that I'm not affiliated... I don't know who runs the show, I thought it was all of us?

[Bigred1o1]

just a thought but did you pm Glenn about this before putting it up as this was presented as lets change the how IFI is run

you have put a poll that has nothing backing it

yet presented it as options to choose from

 

so my "vote" is a pass unless someone real put its up

[Frozenforge]

I agree with Sask Mark. I would gladly respond to a fundraiser, I have not been aware of one since I joined, hopefully I didn't miss it if there was. I would hate to see preferential treatment based on your finiancial situation.

[TedT2]

Your honesty is refreshing Pulsepushthepopulace.

If you perceive a problem and have an idea, I would suggest that you chat with Glenn first, it would be good protocol.

 

First; a person would have to understand the history of the site in detail to understand how it is and has been run and financed.

 

Many times the valuable information found here at “I Forge Iron” has been presented to us FREELY from highly experienced blacksmiths

that were not inclined to be computer functional. And that is because they are Blacksmiths

and not computer oriented people by nature.

Some valuable contributors have been older (old school) and from very humble circumstances.  

 

I know that some extremely valuable information would be lost over time if it became even more

difficult “by making people have to pay in order to share their valuable knowledge” with us.

I am talking about the type of information that helped build this site to the (arguably) Most Informative

Blacksmithing Site on the internet.

 

We have been thus far very fortunate to have received information from craftsman who are NOT normally

considered as to be “computer people”; as a matter of speaking. 

But are highly skilled blacksmiths who no longer had or have the luxury or means to pay to subscribe. 

 

You would have to know and understand that this site has gone through a lot of changes and adjustments

in its history, and many people have contributed much by sharing their expertise and finances to help keep it going.

Again; I would suggest that you chat with Glenn first, “Who knows” he may approve of the idea,

and that is all that counts for me!

[Glenn]

I have been busy with another thread, fixing the site, and working my *day job*, and just found this post at 3:30 am in the morning. I need to thank the person making the report concerning the thread as it may have been another day or two before I saw it.

 

 IFI has not authorized its being posted or had any knowledge of its posting or the content.

 

I did however LOL at the "being apart of Glenns staff..." It's not beyond reality, but if any of my conversations with him via PM were public, it would be all to clear that I'm not affiliated... I don't know who runs the show, I thought it was all of us?

 

Pulsepushthepopulace is not staff, is not a moderator, and has no special privileges. He is a member just like the rest of the members on the site, nothing more and nothing less, 

 

 

For those that do not know

 

IForgeIron is run by 2 (two) site administrators who also own the site. There are two additional site administrators, and several moderators that have been been given the responsibility and authorization to run the site in our absence. Any moderated event is reported back to the admins and all moderated events are reviewed before a final decision is made. That decision is made by the site admins.

 

We have always tried to make the improvements to the site before we make a request for donations. This way folks can see where their money is going as the improvement is already on line and being used on the site. When we reach our goal, we close the donation drive. This sometimes makes people mad because they want to donate, but can not, as the button is disabled, once the goal is reached.

 

You can not buy your way into the site, it is all available for free, no charge. The information has been contributed by the membership.You need to thank the contributors when you find their information helpful.

 

 

Issues and concerns pop up from time to time in the realm of forum evolution. A great deal of issues can spawn from the win and wann of updated systems and a growing forum; the need for more server space, bugs and fixes, administration needs, coding, spam hunting, etc. 

All the right buzz words were used with little knowledge as to what is actually happening on the site. The site is updated as the material becomes available. The site and forum are growing rapidly. The server can handle the current traffic and bandwidth and still have plenty of room to expand. 

 

 

 

I don't know who runs the show, I thought it was all of us?

As the site owners, and site administrators, Andrew and I run the show. That is correct, 2 (two) people with day jobs and family run the largest blacksmithing and metal working web site in the world.

 

We are fortunate to have the best people in the world as members, They report anything out of place so we can address the problem. So in that respect the membership of IForgeIron do indeed assist us greatly in keeping the site running. Thank you each and every one for your assistance.

 

This poll is not authorized by IForgeIron,  Any comments made on behalf of IForgeIron did not come from, and were not authorized by IForgeIron.

[DKForge]

Thanks Glenn for your post. There are a lot of us that appreciate all you have done and continue to do in keeping this site running. As someone who used to run a website with a large number of visitors and page views per month I know what you are up against. It was my full time job and I had a staff of six devoted to running the site. I feel for you.

[David Gaddis]

Thanks Glenn for your hard work. And like many I would like to see some of those gozillion BP's that went away into "space".  I do however NOT WANT any of those  "advertisements" being pasted over  the website. And if there is a charge / fee for services and my account is hacked from there..then there would be no place in this world for you to hide. Many of us feel the same way. This place is somewhat safe and as comfortable as a worn shirt.  New and improved rarely fits the same way.

 

And BTW...I think the moderators do an pretty darn good job policing the site keeping the junk away from the most of us. HOORAY!

 

carry on

[Pulsepushthepopulace]

Thanks Glenn for clarification. 

 

The purpose of not informing owner / staff about this thread was to get a genuine poll, and dispel any underlying agenda... just feeding an idea, watching people chew it up...

[Francis Trez Cole]

there is an other site that has a VIP section personally I do not go there any more no content and it dose nothing for the advancement of Blacksmithing.  There was a person hungry to get started drove 4 hours to get an over view and get started came to my shop. Knowing one of the VIP's lived in the same town. I contacted them to put the two of them together. What a great opportunity. The VIP's said I rather you did not.

 

Well my point is at I forge I think any member would be willing to help and new comer, get them pointed in the right direction. That is a much better way to go.

[MOblacksmith0530]

So let me know when you need to have a fund drive and I will gladly contribute. I am with many others here I think we like what it is and don't want to see  possibility of stratifying the site. Pulse you are to be commended in my opinion in attempting to help out, I just don't agree with the method (opinionated blacksmith Who'd a thunk it).

[Francis Trez Cole]

I will share my story about an other site that has sponcer members I do not go there any more. I was talking with a Kid who drove 4 hours to come to a blacksmithing meeting at my shop. when He told me I said I know some one in the same town. when I contacted them about meeting with this kid. There response was I wish you would not. I like the way you run this site. and if anyone was traveling I am sure any member would be glad to meet them in person. That is a credit to you and the openness of this site. Thanks for all your hard work.