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Newbie looking to buy my first Real Grinder


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Hi all.

I’ve appreciate reading the posts in this thread. 

For a while now i’ve been using a Ryobi belt and disc sander for stock reduction on steel but needless to say it’s not ideal - too much bulky metal housing making it’s difficult to get the steel in nice and close to the belt. so I’m looking at cheap belt grinders to get me started - anyone know if something like this would do for a while? 

Remove link to commercial site.

 

Im not a pro nor and I’m on a budget so not looking for pro equipment at this stage. Alternatively if this is just cheap junk can you please suggest a suitable and affordable belt grinder for a relative beginner. One that doesn’t need someone with an engineering degree to set it up. 

Thank you all for your time m and kind regards

Neddy

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Do the slots on that motor allow grit to get into the innards?  I'd consider anything not using a TEFC motor a toy.

Also the big cost of a grinder over time is the abrasives.  Does that model use easily sourced belts?  Paying extra for odd sized belts builds up fast, especially for relatively small ones that wear fast.

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Hi all. Thanks for the responses. (I got warned for that post as I didn’t realise I couldn’t post a link in it. I tried posting a pic of the unit but it didn’t let me so...) this is the description ... 

950w Bench Belt Sander Grinding Machine Double Axis Variable Speed 40x680mm

that's definitely a fair point about the odd sized belts and how difficult or expensive it may be to replace them. I’ll do some googling on that point. ..

Ah this time it’s let me post a pic of it. Let me know your thoughts on if it would work for a relative beginner.

grinder.jpg

thanks and kind regards 

neddy

 

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Other potential drawbacks as seen from photo:

  1. Belt tension system missing, or difficult to use
  2. Belt tracking micro adjustment missing.
  3. Idler wheels are stacks of ball bearings?
  4. General flimsy construction 
  5. Drive wheel diameter  (what is belt SFPM?)

I'd take a Grizzly, or homebuilt over that any day.

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Wow--that grinder has a lot of potential expletives one could attached to it.  Its chief benefit would be in the health category--because you should get plenty of exercise in your quest to run away.

There is no great solution that is also "cheap".  There are some passable solutions--for instance many get good results using a flat disk in an angle grinder if they work carefully.  There are also chinese 1 x 30 machines that are in the $ 120 USD range which, though underpowered and a bit frustrating, can get the job done if you don't push them too hard. (put your money into only high-quality abrasive belts/discs--going with the best there is where things pay off well).

One thing to keep in mind though:  It's expensive to get into quality but the value remains--quality can be resold in a short period to recover the majority of the purchase cost.  Junk will only be worth junk prices later if anything at all.  You are basically putting money into the "bank of iron" for a while.  That means if one can scrounge a bit more money for quality to begin with, it isn't really a loss to your wallet, it's just banked for a rainy day or later upgrade.  Not everyone can weasel the cash up front for a larger purchase but it will pay back better over time so should at least be considered among the possibilities.

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  • 4 months later...

I bought my 1.75 hp, 110 or 220 single phase Dayton motor at the scrapyard for US$10; looks brand new; they are remodeling a building on Campus and I probably got it right after the old one was swapped out by maintenance. Going to use it for my 25# LG!

The 3 phase ones were also $10; but it would cost thousands to get 3 phase to my shop.

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I just bought my first 2x72 belt grinder. $600 for the frame, platen, drive wheel, and work rest xxxxxxxxxxxx

They also have complete systems for a very affordable price.

$235 3 hp 3 phase 220v motor from Amazon $100 2.2kw vfd. If your on a budget this is for you everything for under 1k.

 I am not sponsored by no one, I'm a new knife making trying to help and save need knife makers money 

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You were not warned about helping others,  you were warned about posting an advertisement for Ameribrade.  Do not say you weren't told about the rules, you were told about the rules of posting, and did it anyway.   It is not our fault if you refused to read them, even though you signed when you joined that you read them and agreed to follow the rules,

the warning was to remind you to not do it again

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Just out of curiosity. How do you know a good grinder from cheap junk being new to the craft and all? From what experience do you draw for your opinions?

If you believe you'll learn to be a competent bladesmith by watching Youtube you're in for a sad reality check. Most folks posting how to videos on Youtube don't know what they're talking about. The only qualification necessary is a camera and internet connection. 

Stick around and adjust to plain talk and there are world class bladesmith members of Iforge who'll help you out. IF you're willing to read articles and such to which you're directed. We don't do research basic math, etc. for people. 

Frosty The Lucky.

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  • 4 months later...

DangerDood:  Curious to hear your feedback on this Ameribrade grinder after a year or so, now -- are you happy with it? Is it sufficiently powerful for the various tasks you need it to perform -- knife grinding, general grinding/sanding, etc.? Have you / would you change anything? I'm asking because I'm looking for a cost-effective 2x72, trying to identify the best bang for the buck. My house has 220 because it used to have electric heat, so I believe I could get a 220 circuit wired up in my garage / shop, but it would certainly be easier / cheaper if it ran on 110/120 out of the box with sufficient power. My little 1x30 just isn't good enough, of course... As I am gathering, the imperative behind the variable feed drive is to slow it down to reduce heat in certain situations, right? I'm sure the way longer belts also help there, and last longer and there's a greater variety of higher-quality belts available. I'm into bladesmithing, axes and general fab / blacksmithing, so this tool seems highly important to add to the the shop. Trying to figure out if I need a VFD and how many HP the motor should be etc. Anyones' thoughts / links to any supporting discussions are greatly appreciated -- I'm sure there are loads more in here that I haven't seen yet. I'm pretty sold on a 2x72 -- just want to identify a platform I can get the basic setup for at the best price/quality point to start, but which can be added onto later with the small diameter / fine radius wheel, other attachments, etc., as funding allows. Any info is appreciated! 

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You'll want 220v or more to power the machine.  Using 110v limits the horsepower of the motor you can use on a traditional circuit.  It's best to have 1.5 hp or greater for a 2x72 grinder.   If your budget will allow for a VFD then I do recommend going the variable speed route.  The cheap Chinese VFD's are not NEMA rated and will need an enclosure to keep the dust and debris out of the system or they will fail fairly quickly. A 220v 2 to 3 hp TEFC 3 phase motor (and a VFD rated for the same or greater hp) works well for this application.  If you start off with a flat platen attachment, that will get you started. You can build or purchase additional attachments as your skill and budget allow.  I'm far from a master bladesmith, but the things I use the most are the flat platen, an 8 inch contact wheel and slack belt grinding.  Others probably have different preferences, but those are mine. 

It's worth the money to purchase quality belts and only use them until they stop cutting well.  The way I've heard it put best is "use the belts like they were free."   Trying to use a belt once it no longer cuts well makes you push harder, which builds up more heat and makes it more likely that you will slip and injure yourself or make grinding mistakes that are difficult to correct. I have some personal experience in that area.

There's my 2 cents.

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  • 3 months later...

Thanks Buzz -- that's a good 2 cents. I'm now at the point of -- buy the best motor and VFD I can get and don't build this thing until I can afford them. Kills me -- I was about to buy the IronHorse 2hp TEFC 3-phase and now it's out of stock. There are a couple decent alternatives. The way inventory is crashing these days on almost everything, I better get something soon. I'm liking House's design for the frame -- NOT that I'm plugging any specific product here -- the rules are strict! -- but looking for best value for a totally stable design, that two-arm setup using 2x2" tube and 1.25" tube, .25" thick with 3/8" plate (or thicker) seems rock solid. The tracking has to move positively in both directions and the motor and VFD should really both be totally enclosed. Those two pieces cost a lot, but you do some welding, drilling and tapping and you end up with a ~$1300 grinder that would've cost $2-$3K, easy, to buy fully assembled. I'll use my DC treadmill motors for some non-griding application.

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New motors are expensive which is why finding excellent condition, name brand, TEFC motors at my Scrap Yard was a nice surprise.  Buying a 1.75 HP Dayton TEFC motor for US$10 for my 25# LG  fit my budget and my wants.   (There was a major remodel of a building at the University and all the HVAC systems were scrapped no matter how long ago the motors were changed out.  I went through and bought a number of the best looking ones, $10 a piece, and have them on a shelf in the shop.  I'll be able to build the tumbler I've wanted. Use a couple on large fans, etc.)  I hear that the Uni building I'm working in now is due for a total remodel in 2 years...

For large motors for old equipment I used to go to a Motor Repair shop; they always seemed to have a couple to hand that someone dropped off for repair and never came back for.  Even better they warranted their work for a year.

If you can't buy new; learn how to source good ones used!

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I salvaged a 3hp 230v single phase from a freebie hot tub at a yard sale. They hadn't been able to sell it and I had a pickup so the people holding the sale and a neighbor helped load it in the truck for hauling it off and gave me what I did want to buy gratis. Had I been smarter I would've just chopped it out while in the truck and I wouldn't have had to load it again. <sigh> Then a friend drops a 3hp 22v motor off out of another hot tub then I salvaged the one out of our dead hot tub before throwing it off the 2nd story deck. 

Now I have 4 of them plus a couple treadmill motors. I don't waste time on treadmill motors, my first one was DC and after spending $50 on electronics it shorted out the first time I turned it on after installing it on the belt grinder. 

I see dead hot tubs everywhere and it's usually the heating elements or the hassle of keeping them clean or unfrozen that kills them, the motors seem pretty bullet proof.

Anyway, there are plenty of motors for little or nothing but a little sweat equity out there. I'm thinking my 50lb. little Giant  going to be a happy camper with a 3hp motor and I'll still have a couple spares.

Frosty The Lucky.

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