picker77 Posted July 29, 2019 Author Share Posted July 29, 2019 Isn't it amazing how quickly metal things can sprout legs? In the Navy yard a few workers (and sailors, too, I have to add) had the attitude that "heck, it's government stuff, nobody will miss it". Once in a while the shipyard CO would have the rent-a-cops do random outgoing vehicle searches at the end of shifts, with occasionally eyebrow-raising results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 On 7/27/2019 at 12:59 PM, picker77 said: overly cautious That's how most of us made it to geezer hood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picker77 Posted July 29, 2019 Author Share Posted July 29, 2019 I've found that the older I get, the more I marvel at some of the foolish things I (intentionally) did and did not die as a result of over the years, and I wonder why the Good Lord gave me a pass so many times. My father passed away at age 53, 50 years ago this month, a few days before the Apollo 11 moon landing. All that stuff constantly on TV lately about the moon landing has been a sad reminder, I'll be glad to see July in the rear view mirror. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris C Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 Sorry for your loss, Picker. Shame to lose a Father at that young an age. My late wife died at 56 and I thought that was young. Interesting how grief can so easily be linked to something like the Apollo Moon landing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picker77 Posted July 29, 2019 Author Share Posted July 29, 2019 Thanks, Chris. That's a hard thing to deal with. 56 is way too young! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris C Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 I think 100 is too young when you still have places to go, people to love and things to do! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George N. M. Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 Yep, there is no accounting for when we have to leave. My grandfather passed at 54 and my late wife at 59. Way too soon for us for them to go out of our lives. But I figure this is a temporary state of affairs. I figure that Martha has just gone on ahead to pick out a good campsite and the rest us us will be along in awhile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris C Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 Amen to that, George. I was widowed at 55 and I'm now 74. Been without her for a bunch of years now. Looking forward to the reunion beside the campfire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Hopefully all of our fur kids who have passed over the Rainbow Bridge will be there to greet me. My father passed at the age of 54 from a massive heart attack in '75 way too early. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris C Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 What is it they say.........."Only the good die young"? What's that say about the rest of us old pharts????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 We've learned not to stand too close to "the good"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris C Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Good one, Thomas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George N. M. Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Dear Chris, Martha and I had 6 years to get used to the idea that we weren't going to finish the trip together. I did most of my grieving when she was diagnosed. Also, she gave me strict instructions not to mope around and be sad but to get out and do things and meet people. So, when it felt OK I signed up for eHarmony and met a lady named Madelynn. We really hit it off and married 3 years ago. I feel very blessed and fortunate to have hit the relationship home run twice. I love Madelynn with all my heart and will also miss Martha every day of my life. How Madelynn, Martha, I, and Madelynn's late husband Tom will sort it all out on the other side is unknown but I'm sure that we will do it. "By hammer and hand all arts do stand." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picker77 Posted July 30, 2019 Author Share Posted July 30, 2019 Re-routed & retested the plumbing, thanks to several helpful suggestions. Lit the fire for first time this morning. Everything appears to work as advertised, idle circuit works great. The flame at all pressures from idle to wide open looks fine to me, but since it's the first flame I've ever put a match to, my opinion is suspect. No doubt it will certainly heat metal enough to move it around, although I have no idea whether it would get hot enough to weld. I included a photo of the interior about 2-3 min after shutoff from a short heat run. That shelf glowed for quite a while. Forge welding is not a concern right now, I just need to learn to hit what I swing at without hitting my poor anvil, which I have named "The Victim". Unfortunately our current string of 100 degree days won't help much in that regard. The "clean work" area/office in the back of my shop is air conditioned, and right now draws me like a magnet! I resized these down a lot, hope they aren't too big. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzkill Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 My only suggestion is get some fire bricks to block off some of your openings then get to mashing metal. I would not be at all surprised if you can forge weld with that setup without changing anything other than trapping a bit more of the heat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picker77 Posted July 30, 2019 Author Share Posted July 30, 2019 Thanks, Buzzkill. I hope you're right. I was a little surprised how easy it was to light, and I liked not having to fuss with "tuning" the burner. I have several more of the hard splits on hand after covering the cart's top shelf, but probably should look for some insulating bricks to use for heat doors instead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Sells Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 I notice you still have the fuel can in a dangerous place, its still a bomb waiting to happen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzkill Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 It doesn't make a huge difference at the openings in my opinion. In either case it's a good idea to put a coating of Plistex or Matrikote on the side facing the forge. Mikey recommends leaving a little space between the bricks and the forge body so that the exhaust can escape while a good portion of the heat is reflected back into the forge. The down side of insulating fire bricks is they are fragile and tend to crack or crumble due to the combination of repeated thermal cycles and the occasional bump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzkill Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, Steve Sells said: its still a bomb waiting to happen I wouldn't say that his configuration is danger free (or possibly even legal), but stating that it's a bomb is somewhat hyperbolic. IF the forge were in operation and there was a catastrophic failure somewhere which allowed a rapid exodus of the contents of the cylinder, that would create a rather nasty fireball, but it would not explode. All of these cylinders I've seen have overpressure protection designed to release the gas rather than allow the pressure to build up to the point where the tank turns into flying shrapnel. While we are using propane the effect is to cool the tank which lowers the pressure rather than increase it. An external heat source or mechanical failure could still make it happen though. There was a whole segment on Mythbusters where they actively tried to get propane tanks to explode by shooting them and other measures. They never succeeded. Even the Hindenburg filled with hydrogen gas didn't explode. It burned rapidly, which is what would happen with propane. Unless you can mix the right amount of gas and oxygen in an enclosed space and then provide an ignition source afterwards there will be no bomb-like detonation. However, being engulfed in a large fireball would be highly unpleasant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Sells Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 If you want to get technical Gunpowder does not explode either it just burns rather rapidly, and I have seen one blow up. Or should I say burn rapidly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pnut Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 That's how explosives are rated. Speed of combustion. Quicker the burn the bigger the boom. Pnut Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzkill Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Good example. A pile of gunpowder in open air won't explode; it will burn. However, if you contain it and provide ignition then it will produce flying projectiles. The potassium nitrate in gunpowder provides the oxygen necessary for rapid oxidation. Propane doesn't include an oxidizer in the container and must get it from the air, so the only way a cylinder can "explode" is higher pressure than the container can handle (without overpressure protection) or injecting oxygen into the container and then providing an ignition source in the container. The point of all this is not to claim that there's no danger; there is. However, in my opinion at least, there is a different level of danger between a fire and an event which sends high speed projectiles around or even instantly destroys a building due to rapid expansion of gases exceeding what the building can contain. Calling something a bomb more accurately portrays the latter description. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pnut Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 A propane leak in an enclosed space like a garage could explode I would think. I know natural gas and propane are different but I heard my neighbors house explode due to a natural gas leak. It broke all the windows in my house that were facing the explosion. When dealing with flammable gasses I'd rather err on the side of caution. Pnut Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picker77 Posted July 30, 2019 Author Share Posted July 30, 2019 Thanks for the concern, Steve, and I certainly acknowledge the inherent dangers if I planned to routinely operate as it is. However, as I said in my initial opening post on this topic, "This forge will be operated almost exclusively outside". It so happens I'm waiting on delivery (today, in fact) of a 12 ft regulator/hose setup which will allow leaving the tank always outside, no matter where the forge is. This little exercise this morning was simply to do do an initial light off, and to gain any further comments from experienced members on the reworked plumbing. This will probably be the only time it ever gets operated with the tank installed in the cart, although even in this instance it was sitting in the middle of a wide open garage door, and was 3' from another open door. I could and maybe should have done the testing by wheeling the cart outside, but I was concerned about being able to properly see the burner flame and other heat colors in very bright summer sunlight. That's good news, Buzzkill, I'll use the bricks I have for heat doors, didn't like the idea of messing with soft bricks anyway, lol. Thanks. And roger all on the rifle, pistol, and black powder comments. I have reloaded off and on since the 60's, and I'm pretty careful with propellant and primer storage. In fact, like most, I don't use black powder any more because of the cleanup hassles and handling/storage risks. There are now excellent and safe modern substitutes available. I'll leave the black powder to the pyrotechnics guys, handling the stuff always scared me anyway, because of static electricity. Getting zapped by a doorknob in winter is one thing, drawing a static arc from your loading press is an entirely different thing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picker77 Posted July 30, 2019 Author Share Posted July 30, 2019 (edited) If it's doors I need, it's doors I shall have. Unfortunately I don't have any Plistex or Matrikote, all I've got is some kiln wash and a few pounds of Kast-O-Lite LI 3000. Edited July 31, 2019 by Mod30 resize large photo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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