6.80 per lb for hey budden 235lb anvil

[Black bear 89]

 Found a hey budden  235 pound Anvil in my area asking price is 1600 have not looked at it in person but seems to be in good condition is this a fair price and is the tool steel separating from the wrought iron a concern when it’s tooled from the waist up?

[JHCC]

Without knowing what your area is, it's hard to say. Some places, that would be fair; others, hideously expensive. If you add your location to your profile settings, we could be a lot more helpful.

If you haven't yet, PLEASE READ THIS FIRST!!!

[ThomasPowers]

Note if you are just getting started in smithing a US$50 piece of scrap steel would work nearly as well for you. A fancy anvil does NOT make you a better smith; time spent at an anvil makes you a better smith.  Once you have a few hundred hours in you can judge what YOU need better. (and pay for it with stuff you have made and sold)

Most places in America I'd say it was overpriced. I don't usually suggest people go over US$3-4 AT THE MOST!  Look at the new anvils for sale too.  Note that anvils are in rather a bubble right now, look up TPAAAT for suggestions on how to find one at a better price. Warning however it requires you to get off the internet to search  as the internet is one of the most expensive places to find anvils!

If you are anywhere near Troy Ohio I'd suggest going to Quad-State and see the hundreds of anvils for sale there; but it's in the Fall.  If you are in the USA you could ask around at the ABANA Affiliate meeting closest to you.

[Black bear 89]

 I’m in Arizona  and this is the first time I’ve ever seen the genuine article in my area aside from the rebound test is there anything else I should look for ?

[Daswulf]

That looks like a wrought iron body with just a steel faceplate. I have a Hay Budden with the full steel above the waist. That's not one. You will usually see a weld around the waist usually ground down but evident and no signs of a face plate. So what do you mean by separating steel from the wrought? That's a major concern and I'd pass. I'd pass at that price alone anywhere around my area of the world. 

[ThomasPowers]

So any luck when you asked around the Arizona Artist Blacksmith Association?

[Black bear 89]

Well I do have these 12 x 8 x 1” in beds I was going to set  in 2 12 x8x8 masonry columns  and this old POS  but I’ve always been limited and really want to start some bigger projects just built my first real forage And I’m eager to undertake some larger projects

[ThomasPowers]

Stop by and I'll tell you how to get to a scrapyard selling large chunks for 20 US cents a pound. (up to a 40000 pound piece of a scrapped navel gun!)

Or you could ask the local smiths where you can find something big to hammer on.

[Black bear 89]

41 minutes ago, Daswulf said:

That looks like a wrought iron body with just a steel faceplate. I have a Hay Budden with the full steel above the waist. That's not one. You will usually see a weld around the waist usually ground down but evident and no signs of a face plate. So what do you mean by separating steel from the wrought? That's a major concern and I'd pass. I'd pass at that price alone anywhere around my area of the world. 

Well I have no experience in identifying these kinds of things but it appeared to me that there was a textured change at The waist which I thought was where the wrought iron was forage welded to the steel

45 minutes ago, ThomasPowers said:

So any luck when you asked around the Arizona Artist Blacksmith Association?

 I am not a member don’t you have to pay dues or buy a membership? 

27 minutes ago, ThomasPowers said:

Stop by and I'll tell you how to get to a scrapyard selling large chunks for 20 US cents a pound. (up to a 40000 pound piece of a scrapped navel gun!)

Or you could ask the local smiths where you can find something big to hammer on.

Where are you located?

 

[JHCC]

15 minutes ago, Black bear 89 said:

Where are you located?

If you look right under his profile picture, you'll see his location. 

If you add your location in your profile settings, that's where we'd be able to see yours.

[ThomasPowers]

Generally groups allow new people to attend meetings for free for a while  to see if they want to go ahead and join.  You'd have to contact the local group directly to see how they do it.

When I was president of the NM Group we would allow folks to attend for several months before we'd ask them if they wanted to join.

[Marc1]

$1600 for 100 kg anvil is atrocious even for Australia. Half that price is still expensive. 

Pass and keep on looking. 235 pound is not even big.

I bought a 240 lb Peter Wright that was advertised at $1400 for $700. Waited that he relisted the thing without any takers and asked him if he actually wanted to sell. When he said he did want to sell, I added that at such a price he will never sell. He was happy to take my offer. People ask silly prices in the hope that someone will bait. Unfortunately someone sometimes does bait, and so prices go up and up. 

[Daswulf]

1 hour ago, Black bear 89 said:

Well I have no experience in identifying these kinds of things but it appeared to me that there was a textured change at The waist which I thought was where the wrought iron was forage welded to the steel

We do and that's why I mentioned it. Yeah there is a bit of a changeover there but it's not the typical weld you will see with one welded at the waist. And if it were showing something like that (with a faceplate And weld at the waist) is showing Id be very skeptical, as in it broke at the waist and was welded back together. ( I have seen it) 

We are trying to help you out, not beat you up. 

46 minutes ago, JHCC said:

 

1 hour ago, Black bear 89 said:

Where are you located?

If you look right under his profile picture, you'll see his location

 

Actually on my mobile version it doesn't show. But, if you click their name it shows up in their profile if added. 

An anvil was listed, and asked about , today in my area. $1075 for a 270lb Hay Budden in better "looking" shape then this one( since I don't know about the ring and rebound of either). Hah, I could buy that one, ship it to you and still turn a profit. ( but I won't) 

keep looking. Head to a scrap yard, milling shop, fab shop.... And see what else you can find cheap. Or buy new or keep looking. That price is way too high. My max is $2. Lb. my reasonable side says a Max of $4.lb in great shape or you are better off buying new, if you need it. 

[Frosty]

Just laying a steel plate on a cast iron Anvil Shaped Object (ASO) will actually make it a worse anvil. The face must be solidly coupled (welded to) the anvil's body or a huge % of the energy delivered by the hammer gets absorbed in the transition. 

Too much for that anvil for sure.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Rojo Pedro]

That anvil has been for sale for a long time at that price, I'd say it was over priced for the area. 

My local scrap yard has all kinds of shapes and sizes at .35 cents a pound. I am soon to get a big chunk and try a Brazeal style anvil as I am finding my 100 lbs vulcan to be somewhat light duty as my forging experience progresses.

Goood luck and keep looking, I got the vulcan off craigslist for $1.50 per pound and its in very decent shape

[BIGGUNDOCTOR]

At $1,600 I would be exploring new anvils. Why? Better condition, better materials, better construction, known history, and in some cases a lifetime warranty.  You can buy a brand new 260# JHM for Reg. Price: $1,351.61 EACH on special for $1,287.25 from Anvil Brand. They are just one retailer and they offer a few different brands, Other retailers and brands are Ridgid, Peddinghaus, Rhino, Jymm Hoffman, Nimba, Refflinghaus, Old World Anvils, Centaur Forge, and a few more.  Glenn, have you ever contacted any of the retailers about sponsoring IFI or offering discounts to IFI members?

There are some who are pushing the recent craze for smithing and driving prices up through the roof. Hay Budden is a brand that has some collectors drooling as they consider them the finest anvils ever made... I have two and prefer my Fisher because it is inherently quieter than the others. Mopar vs Ford vs Chebby preferences so take it with a grain of salt. Personally I think we are seeing a bubble, others will argue that we have barely seen what anvils will go for in the future. The very small and very large anvils get a huge premium and go for many thousands at the moment.  It all gets down to are you a collector or a maker of items? If you are a maker, it really doesn't matter what make it is as long as it gets the job done.

Now having said that , if you are just starting out , I would suggest that the first thing you need to do is to banish the idea that you "need" a London pattern anvil like the one above to be a "real smith". That design is only a bit over 200 years old, while smithing dates thousands. Look at the simple cube anvils that Japanese smiths use, or the vast variety of anvils that third world smiths use on a daily basis. An anvil is nothing more than a mass that you hammer other items upon. There is a good thread here titled improvised anvils - and it is a pinned post - that shows what other anvils can be used that do not cost an arm and a leg. Locate a local scrap yard, heavy equipment rental/repair facility, tractor rental/repair facility, paving or earthworks company, concrete/cement plant, rock crushing, car shredding, railroad facility, etc... basically anyone who has big heavy equipment that has wear parts. Go and ask if they have any heavy scrap items like forklift forks, large bucket pins, hydraulic breaker points, crusher jaws, shredder hammers, heavy parts of steel - not cast iron (cast steel is OK). What you want is the most mass in the least amount of space, so cube as opposed to plates - unless it it really thick plate (2" on up). This is because you want mass under the hammer blow, not off to the sides. All you need is a working surface as big as the biggest hammer face you have. To give you some eyeball weight calculating power remember that steel weighs 40.8# per sqft when one inch thick.(12x12x1) A cubic foot of steel weighs 490#  (12x12x12) Interesting huh? that anvil above has around 1/2 of a cubic foot of material in its shape. I could outfit a smithy with an anvil, forge, vise, and basic tooling for $100 where I live with the post vise being the most expensive item. Don't get tool envy, it will cost you.

[ThomasPowers]

When people tell me they need a London Pattern anvil to make them a better smith; I sympathize and wonder if even those "Japanese Living Treasure swordsmiths" could make a decent blade if they were only using  a London pattern anvil instead of the rectangular solid chunk anvils.

Of course most folks are not happy to be told it's time spent hammering over dollars spent buying...

[jlpservicesinc]

From the pic it looks like a 2nd gen..  

Anvils and pricing becomes how much is it worth to you..   1600.00 is brand new anvil territory..  275 Peddinghaus/Rigid delivered to your door is possible for that kind of coin.. 

As mentioned there are a lot of avenues out there.. 

With London pattern anvils there is such a thing of the anvil being to large to work on certain sized pieces and this means have to make large hardie tools to get that smaller work surface..  Double horn anvils offer 2 to 4X the work surfaces depending on which model you get..  side shelf, upsetting block, conical horn, vs smooth horn.. Etc etc..