why wrought iron?

[Mark Ling]

so why use wrought iron. I mean, it sounds like its more difficult/frustrating than mild steel (splits, frays, hard to weld, etc) is it just preference? why use it?

                                                                                                                          Littleblacksmith

[tdaleh]

Works easy at right temperature,  doesn't rust as easly , forge welds easy. The wood grain pattern makes some cool knife hardware . Adds character to a project. 

[jmccustomknives]

As was stated, wrought has a beautiful look when finished right.  It is somewhat corrosion resistant when compared to mild steel.  From my experience, it takes half the hammer weight to move the same amount of material.  Heat is the big thing, wrought is worked much hotter than steel.  There is also different grades of wrought.  Higher grades can be worked further than low grade. 

[Forging Carver]

I have been looking all over for wrought and can't seem to find any. Besides going into old homes, mines, and getting gates, where do you guys get wrought from? Thanks 

[Frosty]

I have a friend who used to live in Jersey, he salvaged wrought from the old docks, ship yards, etc. at low tide. You live in one of the oldest areas settled by Europeans on this continent AND it supported significant industry. It's all over the place but you have to scrounge it yourself or pay someone else to do it for you. That's buy it from shops, etc.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Charlotte]

However,  there is a caution about salvaged material.  Some of the wrought Iron found in the interior of the country can be the pits to work with.  A friend of mine salvaged a fence fabricated from wrought Iron.   It turned out that is was such poor quality that it was not really usable.   He was trying to give it away last time I spoke to him.

[Frosty]

Oh yeah, learning to evaluate salvaged iron and steel is part of the craft, with experience a person can determine muck bar from even single wrought especially if weathered. There's a place for any of them but it takes experience to learn the differences from salvaging, working, to uses and finishes.

Good point Charlotte, I sometimes forget even the most basic of things.

Frosty The Lucky.

[jmccustomknives]

1 hour ago, Forging Carver said:

I have been looking all over for wrought and can't seem to find any. Besides going into old homes, mines, and getting gates, where do you guys get wrought from? Thanks 

Find you some guys locally that metal detect.  To them it's trash, but if you ask they will gladly give you all the axes and other things they find.  Usually they'll either pass over the stuff or prop it next to a stump.  You'll need to learn how to identify these materials to separate them.

[SmoothBore]

The use to which wrought iron was originally put, is also an indication of quality.

Bridges, Marine Fittings, Rolling Stock and Farm Machinery got the best material, while Fences and Ornamental Ironwork didn't require the same quality.

.

 

[Forging Carver]

Alright thanks. The issue is that I really don't want to go to an old bridge or farm and potentionally steal the steel. Nice pun there. I have a metal detector, maybe I can go around looking for some wrought iron. No idea where to start though. Thanks

[arkie]

Look up "Old Globe Reclaimed Wood" on the entrynet, then go to "Other Products" and also the "Contact" info.  I bought some wrought iron rod from them a year or so ago.  I don't know if they are still selling any wrought iron these days.  BTW, the history of the Old Globe grain storage facility is interesting reading anyway.  Google it.

[Alan Evans]

I would not bother looking for it myself...horrible stuff.  

If you can find some with the triple crown mark that is the best quality. But even that can have the odd bit of (sulphur?) contamination which makes it hot short...given the fact that you already know about the perils of working it at too low a temperature when it splits and frays. The welding is definitely much easier than mild steel...well, fire welding is. If you try gas, stick, mig or tig you must ensure that all the fibres are fused. If you weld to just one surface those fibres can then delaminate from the parent bar....There is a very good reason that the fire welding scarfe forms are designed to collect and consolidate the whole bundle of fibres.

Do you have a particular interest in it or a burning curiosity? Unless the fibrous pattern in the finished product is an advantage to you then it has few merits as far as I can see. If you are going to paint it you are only going to see paint, so what is underneath is irrelevant.

If you want to try forging something softer than mild steel for instance, try silicon bronze...and what ever you make will have that extra caché and premium value. You could even try aluminium.

In my view the only good thing about wrought iron is the ease of fire welding. It can stick together just lying side by side in the fire. There is a much greater heat tolerance between welding temperature and burning temperature than mild steel. If you wanted to make edge tools with a wrought iron body and blister steel (farriers rasp) cutting edge it would be easier to shut together with WI than MS.

Generally I would rather rely on the homogenous quality of mild steel, even though it might be superficially less effort to forge WI if working with only a hand hammer. Do not just take my word for it though...if wrought iron was a superior product it would still be manufactured.

I say all this and a good friend of mine, Chris Topp, has a business which re rolls and markets WI anchor chain and etc. He has a very good web site which may be of interest. The company is called the Real Wrought Iron Company. 

He and I have had many a good natured argument about WI's merits and failings...I think he may have won recently because I had to buy some from him for a recent project.  

Alan

[Mark Ling]

I was just wondering the pros and cons.

                                                                                Littleblacksmith

[Alan Evans]

Plenty of both of them then!

I always like to trace the flow of the fibres around punched holes and welds in old WI objects...old anchors used as decoration on the seafront often have well defined grain patterns.

When working it I do think of it as a bundle of fibres which are not necessarily held together all that well...with that in mind all your forging processes are geared towards consolidation of the bar and not stressing it at too low a temperature. 

Alan

[Quench.]

Is there any way to identify wrought from others by looking at a rusted chunk of metal?  I mean, without cutting or bending it?  -Q

[Alan Evans]

If it has linear striations it is WI. But it needs to have corroded for a while for those to become obvious.

If it was shiny polished it would show the striations in the initial rust bloom/stain briefly but then they would be lost until major corrosion occurred later. 

Polishing it and then putting some acid on it will show the grain variation between iron and basic slag, in the same way as etching damascus.

But unless you happen to have exposed a fault you would not be able to tell from just the surface appearance of a freshly forged bar of WI or MS.

Alan

[Quench.]

Ok, thanks, kind of what I thought.  Can't tell one rusty chunk of metal from another without cutting or breaking it.

[odblacksmith]

My only experience with Wrought was a piece of 1.25 square in an L shape i bought from a garage sale thinking it was just mild steel from a piece of machinery.once i got it home i thought "great now i have stock to make bottom tools" I forged it just like you would with a big piece of mild HOT.I was making an "Edge tool/anvil block" and once it hit a certain shade of dull orange splits started to appear,so i went inside googled wrought iron and realized i could go back out and just forge weld it back together...now i have 5-6 bottom tools and 1 top tool made from WI,I can only assume it was pretty well refined due to the fact that it has held up well as tooling.I have little experience with it but Wrought iron was just the mild steel of its day and blacksmiths being blacksmiths worked what they had and made due.

[Mark Ling]

so, what happens when you try to upset wrought iron- what I mean is, does it mess up the fibers and cause it to split?

                                                                                                                     Littleblacksmith

[Alan Evans]

No it is fine. Just bear in mind the bundle of fibres at all times...it only delaminates if stressed too cold. Work it at welding heat. Tap the edges in before you start upsetting.

Alan

 

[ThomasPowers]

Of course they tended to just forge weld more on instead of upsetting it---like bend the top back on itself and weld it up and taper as wanted  Or to make the head of a bolt---weld a ring on and forge to the shape you want.  As to why to use it:  It was *THE* metal blacksmiths used for about 2000 years.  Mild steel came along mid 1850's with the Bessemer/Kelly process and then Open Hearth, etc.  If you don't need it's properties---and some of them are a pain! and you don't need it's historicity; then no real reason to go out of your way to learn to useit and then to source it.  (If I lived in NJ first place I would go is to the local creek or river bank and start looking for it)

[Mark Ling]

ok, thanks guys for the replies.

                                                                      Littleblacksmith

[SReynolds]

I have some in the shop from who knows what. It breaks apart when hitting it.

to make products I use only new low grade steel A36 1018  so I know what it is and how to work it. No surprises there. Scrap folks donate is just that; scrap. Good to throw out.