Daswulf Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 last night I found a piece of pipe in my scrap pile and had been wanting to make candle holders. Using my spring fuller I tapered off the section to use as the "cup" for the candle and it went well. I then took it to the anvil horn to flare the top then taper off the lower part of the "cup" a bit and I noticed I'm twisting the part I fullered, and it's splitting. The last one I even tried to pay more attention and tried to go easier and watch to see how I was getting this twist but couldn't really see how. Looking at the tutorial that I hadn't looked at for a while I pretty much answered my own problem as they flared the cup before spring fullering the section. Still would like to achieve a hammered look and maybe there's a better way then what I'm doing in getting the the fullered area twisted and split. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 If the pipe is galvanized remove the zinc first. Always plug the non-working end of the pipe so it does not form a chimney or generate a steam cannon.Flare first, hammer texture, then fuller.EMT pipe is good for candle cups. Work any pipe HOT to help avoid splitting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted October 11, 2015 Author Share Posted October 11, 2015 Thanks Glenn, I'll give it another go like that. I did remember you mentioning blocking off the other end of the pipe in a talk before and did that. no problems there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSW Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 I've had plenty of issues with cheap imported pipe in the past. The stuff has hard spots, won't thread right and so on. It wouldn't at all surprise me if the welds in the pipe aren't cruddy as well. For this reason I won't buy pipe at places like Depot if I can at all avoid it. I'd rather spend more at the plumbing supply, or drive farther to go to my steel supplier, for US made pipe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted October 11, 2015 Author Share Posted October 11, 2015 I see what you mean about that DSW. If i get into a more important project with these i'll look into getting higher quality pipe. As for this it was just to give it a go and see how it worked. I'll try the above mentioned by Glenn and see if it goes better for now. Not that it's great to try to get proper results from lesser materials in testing or learning but until I get to a supplier i'm working with the scrap at hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironwolfforgeca Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 (edited) Das not sure why that is happening on the twisting thing ? but you are thinning the top end to make a flare on the horn !so the fullered area is thicker then the top shouldn't be a problem but ?? I find it easier to make lg pipe smaller then to take smaller pipe & flare out to a Lg size over the hornI also use a PH LOL Edited October 12, 2015 by IronWolf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 Hi Das with regard to the twist, it may be you are rotating the piece as you are striking the top tool, thus one half is rotating whilst the necked bit is stationary between the fullering tool. Try it with a pause in rotation when you strike the top tool.I would also suspect the forging temp is low judging by the finish on the fullered area, if the tools are smooth, I would expect a better finish on that area as you can see on the centre one of the three where it is not necked in but has been struck.Hope this is of some assistance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted October 12, 2015 Author Share Posted October 12, 2015 I had a little better luck tonight, sorry didn't finish the piece or get pictures, but got a long winded phonecall conversation from a friend. will get pictures tomorrow if i can. did still have problems but i didn't try to taper in the bottom by the fuller as much. think i have some usable pieces and suspect the rustiness and quality of the pipe to be part culprit for the issues until i get my hands on some better pipe.I appreciate the ideas guys.IronWolf, i was just trying to flare it out a little for looks not to make the whole thing bigger diameter really, and havn't had much problem there. it's been harder for me to taper the pipe in more at the bottom by the fuller for some reason. and thats when i get the cracks.John B, possibly for that i should be using the straight pein that RT redid for me that has a wider radius but the cracks are happening before hand. as for the rotating on the hits i tried to pay attention to that more this time and actually While fullering it dosn't Look to be twisting it's while i was working the rest that it seems to twist, or atleast show it. i tried to work it like Glenn said and couldn't get the taper before the fullering that i wanted but with flaring and then fullering i did still get a minor twist crack on one. but i also still lightly worked them after for the look.. Ugh.. my bad.. i'm going to try some new pipe and see what i get out of it. it could be this pipe or My working it. i even kept an even heat in between where i fullered on both sides this time thinking i under heated half last time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rthibeau Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 (edited) all hammers I've made or reworked have the requirement that the smith faces North when using them........check yer compass....it's 'cause of the Fairy Dust I use Edited October 12, 2015 by rthibeau added Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 You can cut the socket off a lug wrench and weld it to a hardie plate. Heat the end of the pipe, place it on the socket and whack the other end a couple of times. Instant flair, and an even flair all the way around.You can try fullering down the pipe from opposite sides, 2, then 4, then 8, then 16 etc like forming a taper from square to round, and it may not want to twist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 (edited) Glen, you of course mean: "weld the open end of the lug wrench to the plate leaving the swell pointing up to use as a flare tool." ?(I've had a few students that needed rather explicit instructions for things I thought was self evident...) Edited October 13, 2015 by ThomasPowers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted October 13, 2015 Author Share Posted October 13, 2015 Glen, you of course mean: "weld the open end of the lug wrench to the plate leaving the swell pointing up to use as a flare tool." ?(I've had a few students that needed rather explicit instructions for things I thought was self evident...) I understood what he meant but ya never know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 When you post stuff, it's out there for use for more than the original poster. I can assume competence for you but some folks out there remind me of Frosty right after his close encounter of the Birch (spelled it right this time!!!) kind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 John B, possibly for that i should be using the straight pein that RT redid for me that has a wider radius but the cracks are happening before hand. as for the rotating on the hits i tried to pay attention to that more this time and actually While fullering it dosn't Look to be twisting it's while i was working the rest that it seems to twist, or atleast show it.Looks like you are using the anvil edge, as opposed to your spring tool, If forged in a spring tool at the correct heat I would expect a better more smoother finish that what yours appears to have. New material may help, will be interesting to hear your results, (anyone near you can ask or can you video and put up how you are producing this?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 You are right, we need to be more explicate and detailed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSW Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 Mods please merge.... When you post stuff, it's out there for use for more than the original poster. I can assume competence for you but some folks out there remind me of Frosty right after his close encounter of the Birch (spelled it right this time!!!) kind.You are right, we need to be more explicate and detailed.Reminds me of a question some one else posted up on another site back in 2008.... The Op asked the following question about drill bits. "I'm working on a large project that requires a lot of drilling into 1/8" mild steel. For some reason, I am ruining all my drill bits on these pieces, which has never happened to me before. First, I know what you're thinking- I AM using cobalt bits. The holes are 5/16" and 1/4" and I'm center punching them first, then drilling a small pilot hole before using the large bit. I use cutting oil, but still the bits seem to only work for literally one hole and then just spin. I don't want to invest in a drill press, so I'm just using my Bosch hammer drill (not on the hammer setting though). I suppose I am probably drilling too fast (the drill is variable speed), but I don't think that alone could explain why they're being dulled so quickly.Does anyone have any idea why this could be happening? Is there a different type of bit I could purchase that would last longer?" I was the 6th person who replied to his question and as an after thought made this comment..."Remember if working on the floor, that the concrete will destroy that bit if it hits the floor. Put a piece of scrap 2x under the steel to protect the bit after it goes thru or set the material on blocks."Just a few minutes later he replies back.... " Ding ding, we have a winner! The bits hit the concrete every time. I started out using masonry bits and they actually lasted longer, so this is clearly what is going on. Thanks DSW! " I learned then to never take anything for granted. It seemed like such a stupid thing to mention but I did it anyways for some odd reason that day, Nothing else in the discussion had pointed at the actual problem he was having. I try and remember that many times we need to keep things simple as the person on the other end may not have the skills we think they might, or that someone later who has less experience than those in the original conversation might lack the knowledge to understand that steps were skipped expecting the OP to know and understand this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted October 14, 2015 Author Share Posted October 14, 2015 John B, I'll give it a shot as i plan to make more of these and would like em to turn out well. forthcoming. sorry DSW.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rthibeau Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 ummmm............wot was the original question???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted October 15, 2015 Author Share Posted October 15, 2015 the original question was what is the square root of pie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 ummmm............wot was the original question???? I'm still trying to get over the request for the Mods to merge! Too explicit for me NO pics PLEASE!!Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted October 16, 2015 Share Posted October 16, 2015 the original question was what is the square root of pie. More information needed, type of pie, size of pie, shape of pie, If it is a round pie, is it a different square root? You have got to have as many facts as are known/available before you can come to a result.(I think this is relevant to the thread) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave51B Posted October 16, 2015 Share Posted October 16, 2015 Very good John, just to jump on the wagon......I don't think it can be a fruit pie, all fruit trees I know of have round roots. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSW Posted October 16, 2015 Share Posted October 16, 2015 Everyone knows pies are round. If they are square, they are called cakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted October 16, 2015 Author Share Posted October 16, 2015 Everyone knows pies are round. If they are square, they are called cakes.cobbler in a square casserole dish could be the root of pie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 16, 2015 Share Posted October 16, 2015 Very good John, just to jump on the wagon......I don't think it can be a fruit pie, all fruit trees I know of have round roots. DaveClose but not quite Dave, Fruit trees have roots Around them, the roots themselves aren't so round.I'd say something clever but I'm pretty tapped out on root puns.Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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