Opinions of new anvils

[Rutterbush]

First, I have to say that I am NOT soliciting bids. If I were asking for bids I would contact Glenn first about the subject. Second, to submit a bid the sales rep must be familiar and enrolled in the North Carolina E-Procurement. One of the many hazards when dealing with a state supported school.

I have funds to purchase ~ six anvils and ten heavy firepots. Price is the deciding factor on the actual count.

Before I decide on which brand and from whom to purchase I would appreciate personal opinions about NEW anvils. I cannot purchase used or needs repair due to the NC E-Procurement.

Approximately five years back I purchased four 110 Kg (260 pound) anvils. I will NOT consider that brand again. All four have thumbnail sized divets raised or broken out or a crack from one side to the other on the faces. One of the anvils has three of the divets broken out in the middle of the face. However, the edges are decent and not sevierly chipped. I must state that the supplier was super nice and I did not hold them responsible for an import.

I viewed the Ozark Anvil. I like it. The price is the stopper. I've looked at the Peddinghaus at Kayne's. I could get five of the #9 model. I'm attempting to get at least six anvils, as big as possible and keep it under $9000.00, tax, tags, title and shipping.

Same thing with the fire pots. I have a cut off at $4000. Not a penny more. When the new smithy is complete I'll have 10 forges, so I need ten coke burning firepots, providing that the funding doesn't suddenly get diverted elsewhere or trimmed down to the size of a Sears lawn mower shed.

Your recommendations and the reason why you like whatever will be helpful. Don't be afraid to make a suggestion. All suggestions will be oggled if I can locate them on the internet.

Thanks a bunch.

[ironstein]

I can't speak from experience, because i have very little with anvils, but from what i've researched, Fontanini, formerly known as rathole forge, seem like an excellent deal $1165 for a 250 pounder, and $1769 for a 460 pounder. My first choice would be a nimba, but you can't beat the price of the fontanini.

[Thomas Dean]

I still would consider the Ozark Pattern anvil. With purchasing 5 of these beauties you may get somewhat of a price break. These are 275#ers and very nice anvils. I have used them and would love to own one myself---and will when the $$ comes in. Nimba would probably be my next choice although I have not had a chance to use one. I have heard good stuff with the Fontanini but here to no experience with one. Fire pot...sorry, no help here, although I would consider finding some Inconel and building them, will out last anything you can buy for sure! My fire pot is from 3/8" Inconel 600, made myself and I figure my great (to the 10th power) grandkids will still be able to use it! Making your fire pots would make a good 2 week project for your class...

[MLMartin]

Is there any reason to get such large anvils, If its all beginner students then i would think something in the 150 range would be just fine. We have EURO Anvils at our school, have held up just fine for the past six years with lots of striking and pounding from beginners. I think there in the 150 range. As long as there secured well to stands and maybe fixed to the ground then that size should be great. If students will be striking all day long with 18lb hammers then i would certainly look for something heavier, but people just lurning and hammering be hand then 150 is perfectly fine. The anvils have a few little dings here and there but all are vary minor, and im quite surprised at how well they have help up from the abuse. Personally i dont really like the shape, and having the hardy hole next to the horn is just stupid in my opinion. But all in all they work fine every day, day in and day out, and there cheep too! I would certainly stand by Euro anvils, and am sure they would hold up fine in any full time professional shop

[Dragons lair]

First, I have to say that I am NOT soliciting bids. If I were asking for bids I would contact Glenn first about the subject. Second, to submit a bid the sales rep must be familiar and enrolled in the North Carolina E-Procurement. One of the many hazards when dealing with a state supported school.

I have funds to purchase ~ six anvils and ten heavy firepots. Price is the deciding factor on the actual count.

Before I decide on which brand and from whom to purchase I would appreciate personal opinions about NEW anvils. I cannot purchase used or needs repair due to the NC E-Procurement.

Approximately five years back I purchased four 110 Kg (260 pound) anvils. I will NOT consider that brand again. All four have thumbnail sized divets raised or broken out or a crack from one side to the other on the faces. One of the anvils has three of the divets broken out in the middle of the face. However, the edges are decent and not sevierly chipped. I must state that the supplier was super nice and I did not hold them responsible for an import.

I viewed the Ozark Anvil. I like it. The price is the stopper. I've looked at the Peddinghaus at Kayne's. I could get five of the #9 model. I'm attempting to get at least six anvils, as big as possible and keep it under $9000.00, tax, tags, title and shipping.

Same thing with the fire pots. I have a cut off at $4000. Not a penny more. When the new smithy is complete I'll have 10 forges, so I need ten coke burning firepots, providing that the funding doesn't suddenly get diverted elsewhere or trimmed down to the size of a Sears lawn mower shed.

Your recommendations and the reason why you like whatever will be helpful. Don't be afraid to make a suggestion. All suggestions will be oggled if I can locate them on the internet.

Thanks a bunch.

Steve, Just a thought. In Dillsboro all the anvils were in the 100-150lb range. Angle iron stands with 3-4 inches of adjustment. Students come in all sizes( I know you know that) I like my stumps but it would be nice to
change the hight for visitors. Or students.
Ken.
Ken

[Sask Mark]

Regarding the firepots, IFI member JNewman manufactures them and sells them in the U.S. through Blacksmith's Depot.

I believe this is his product:
http://www.blacksmithsdepot.com/Templates/cart_templates/cart-detail.php?theLocation=/Resources/Products/Forges_and_Parts/Fire_Pot_with_Tuyere_and_Ash_Dum

[OddDuck]

Rutterbush, I just sent you a PM.

[Rutterbush]

Sask Mark,
I have two of these fine firepots at the school. They sure are much better than the student built steel firepots. The student built units last about eight months. That means that each welding class gets to fabricate new pots for the next year.

[bigfootnampa]

I'd try to work out a deal for the Ozark anvils too. They are listed at $1,500.00 each times six = $9,000.00 = your budget. Now I imagine that you might wangle a bit of discount for an order of 6 and that might be negotiated to include tax and shipping and then you'd have what you need in a top quality high end item. Is it possible that someone from the Ozark school store might even deliver them? Maybe they could even be convinced to tape a little demo on their set-up and use and various features while they are in town? That could help them to sell a few to graduating students and might be satisfying also. Times are kind of tough right now so it's a good time to negotiate... seems a shame when you are so close on the price not to get the good stuff! I'd give that a try FIRST if I were in your shoes. Sadly I do not own one of these anvils but I have heard/read ONLY great things about them from people that I trust to know whereof they speak and note that they are S-7 tool steel which is, as far as I know, about the toughest steel ever put in an anvil. They are a larger and heavier anvil than the Peddinghaus #9 and $150.00 less (list) than the Peddinghaus #12 which is the same weight as the Ozark anvil. A great many businesses will give schools discounts and certainly an order for 5 items as costly as these deserves some extra consideration too. If you do not feel comfortable negotiating I'll be glad to help as I know (a little bit) some of the people involved and also am near the Ozark school. I'd look at it as being helpful to both parties. There could also be someone at your school who is a natural negotiator that you could call upon for service to their school and students.

I might even be so optimistic as to think that if shipping is a stumbling block that some of the smiths here or a BAM member or someone from one of our many IFI affiliated organizations might decide to take a drive in your direction and drop off a few anvils as they pass through. IME that's the way Blacksmiths are! I cannot begin to tell you how much or how often the Clark family has helped and donated to the BAM organization over the years!!! Consider that I am a relatively new BAM member and you'll have just a clue as to the VAST generosity of this family.

[Wesley Chambers]

My Two Cents:
Coming from the Kentucky Horseshoeing School as a student and employee I used a number of different anvils but the ones we had the most of were JHM's. Mostly Journeyman 125# or Competitor 250# and I must say after over a year of seeing a ton of students bashing out homework with little to no hammer control these anvils can take a lot of abuse! The competitor 250# start around $1000.00

Personally I love my 340# trent but I wouldn't let a student "play" on it lol

[thecelticforge]

I am a fan of Euroanvils. I have a 300 weight and love it!

http://euroanvils.net/

[Frank Turley]

I'm presently using a Fontanini 250# anvil. I like that they are cast in the U.S. and hand finished by Steve in Wyoming. They are a Continental pattern except the horn has an "American belly" to it. The upsetting block is on the far side of the anvil, when the horn is on your left. The hardie hole is 1 1/8" so I forge my own tools to fit. Steve and I like to mount the anvil sitting in a sand box which gives good rebound and is not excessively loud. I first learned about the sand idea in Schmirler's book, "Werk und Werkzeug des Kunstschmieds." www.fontaninianvilandtool.com

http://www.turleyforge.com Granddaddy of Blacksmith Schools

[Timothy Miller]

I highly recommend the the Robert Lorash Fire pot. Not sure if the spelling is right. I bought one last year. The price is better than the blacksmiths depot and it is a super heavy pot. I think i paid about 270 with shipping. This should save you some money and leave with more money for anvils.

[Frank Turley]

Sp. Roger Lorance, Canton, Illinois. Firepots.

http://www.turleyforge.com Granddaddy of Blacksmith Schools

[clinton]

I would also recomend the Roger Lorance fire pot I recently purchased one at the ABANA conference and this thing is heavy duty
Roger Lorance
(309) 475-9012

[ThomasPowers]

I teach an "Intro to smithing" course here for the NM Tech college students and so get a lot of folks whose brains are more exercised than their brawn. Often they hammer like lightening---never striking the same place twice!

I think I would go with 150 pound anvils for the majority and then get a bigger one for the last one. Most of my students are working on smaller anvils but we have an old bridge anvil for them to use when the sledges come out to play!

One of the reasons I bring a variety of anvils and tools is so they don't get hung up on having to use a particular anvil and hammer; but learn that anything that works is *good*. (I've been bringing my 25# Roman- F&I war travel anvil too and they are amazed when I tell them that for nail making, one of our projects, it's the best one there!)

[brianbrazealblacksmith]

For the price and quality, I'd go with the Roger Lorance fire pot and the JHM Competitor for anvils.

[Brian C.]

Check with Bob Cruickshank of the Southern Ohio Forge & Anvil Group about firepots.

I imagine you can contact him indirectly through the www.sofasounds.com website.

Bob is currently providing the heavy cast fire pots for that crew. Two different sizes and shapes I believe.

[Timothy Miller]

I highly recommend the the Robert Lorash Fire pot. Not sure if the spelling is right. I bought one last year. The price is better than the blacksmiths depot and it is a super heavy pot. I think i paid about 270 with shipping. This should save you some money and leave with more money for anvils.

This is why I should not post after I just woke up.

[HWooldridge]

http://www.hoffmansforge.com/anvils

Jymm Hoffman carries a couple of nice patterns but they are a bit on the smallish side compared to your initial weight requirements. I also tag along with the rest on the Lorance bottom blast pot (although side blasts could be made for next to nothing from stainless pipe).

[Bob S]

Is there any reason to get such large anvils, If its all beginner students then i would think something in the 150 range would be just fine. We have EURO Anvils at our school, have held up just fine for the past six years with lots of striking and pounding from beginners. I think there in the 150 range. As long as there secured well to stands and maybe fixed to the ground then that size should be great. If students will be striking all day long with 18lb hammers then i would certainly look for something heavier, but people just lurning and hammering be hand then 150 is perfectly fine. The anvils have a few little dings here and there but all are vary minor, and im quite surprised at how well they have help up from the abuse. Personally i dont really like the shape, and having the hardy hole next to the horn is just stupid in my opinion. But all in all they work fine every day, day in and day out, and there cheep too! I would certainly stand by Euro anvils, and am sure they would hold up fine in any full time professional shop

Agree with all that. I remember hearing that Francis Whitaker worked his whole life (80's) with a 150lb anvil. He also had a 25lb Little Giant.

Today beginning blacksmiths have to have massive anvils and Nazel powerhammers. Could it be that they are overcompensating for something?



Bob

[Rutterbush]

Looks as if I need to give a bit more 'splainin'.

The school is about 25 miles from Blacksmith Depot, so this is the first place I started to look. First thing I went for was the Peddinghaus, of which, there is a 77#, a 250# and then the largest whatever poundage. This is why I spoke of the 250 pound anvil. I'm not sold on that size. I was giving what I had already seen and not giving it much thought except that I finally have funding and need anvils.

Thanks to all of the more thoughtful folk for suggesting the 150 pounder. Personally, I have two 100 pounders that I use at home.

Thomas Powers,
I was hypnotised by the large face area of the big anvils. More for a student to swing at. Best excuse I have.

Bob S,
I can't carry a 250 pound anvil in my Masera... Maser...Ferrari. I am not compensating for any short comings by getting large anvils.

I submit to the wiser folk. I will persue 150 # anvils or equivelent and may have enough cash left over to get an extra.

If there are other suggestions I have not spent my money yet.

[Rutterbush]

HWooldridge,
Sent you a PM.

[stuartthesmith2]

my philosophy is "in for a penny, in for a pound"...........I have used a 700 pounder for three decades, and LOVE IT!

[Mark Emig]

Hi All,
I bought a 250 lb Fontanini about a 15 months ago. I really like it-it's a really good looking tool also. The european style horn is really great to use on the smaller stuff. The side shelf and upsetting block work very well also. I got mine delivered to the shop for $1222. Steve is a great guy to deal with, and best of all buying one SUPPORTS AMERICAN CRAFTSMANSHIP! We need to keep our dough moving around in our country first. American made to work in america-can't get much better than that.
Mark Emig