andy ebbers Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 This past weekend, I finally got my anvil back from a buddy who ran the working face through a surface grinder to remove a couple bad spots. Someone must have done something repetitive in the same area of the face in years past. it is a circa 1841 William Foster anvil. I might be nuts, many say that I am, but it seems like after the surface grinding, that thing REALLY Rings now when struck--it strikes me that this might not be a bad thing, and the working face is nice and flat too. Just thought this was cool, Thanks, Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highlander Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 andy, you can try wrapping the waist of the anvil with chain to deaden down the ringing and save your ears. i do this and wear hearing protection, but do whatever is best for you, JUST BE SAFE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayco Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Andy, an anvil that rings really loudly can (over a period of time) damage your hearing. Wrapping the chain around the waist of the anvil does work. I have 4 wrapps of chain around my Peter Wright. I'm not sure if it works on all anvils or not, but it works on mine. I have a 2 in. x12 in. x 16 in. chunk of iron I've also been using for small work. It rang so loudly I thought I would have to quit using it.....but I draped a loop of chain over each side of the face........problem solved. Now I just have to be careful not to hit the chain when hammering........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOS Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 I have to agree with using chain to reduce the ring. I have also had some success with a large magnet (part of an old speaker) placed under the back of the anvil. Just don't block the hardy or pritchel and you should be good. hope that helps ya :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutchmancreek Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Places that sell farrier supplies usually have strong flat magnets that the farrier often uses to hold tools. Put a strong magnet under the heel of the anvil and it will make a big difference. Without one , I'd have to wear ear muffs when I use my Hay Budden. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Leppo Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 OK, but it sounds like Andy's saying that his anvil rings MORE now. Why would that be? (I think their's a BP on quieting anvils) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 There is such a Blueprint. Several methods were discussed, magnets, chain, carriage bolts, anvil bases, glue, and even ear plugs. I find the chain, the carriage bolts, and anvil bases solutions work best. A combination of two or more work even better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy ebbers Posted October 22, 2008 Author Share Posted October 22, 2008 Yes, it does seem to ring more after the surface grinding, that was my main point, just thought this was interesting, but I do appreciate all of the good advice on quieting it down a bit, and I am already a firm believer in hearing & eye protection. Thanks, Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Ring is handy at a demo to bring in a crowd; but not a good thing if you end up having to spend a couple thousand dollars an ear for hearing aids later. Protect your hearing from the *START* as it doesn't get better if you wait till you have lost it before trying to protect what's left! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Okay, here's a totally intuitive thought as to why your anvil is louder after surface grinding than before. Ringing is caused by resonant vibrations. The chain, magnets, wood, silicone, felt, etc. used to deaden the ring do so by damping vibrations, they take the resonance out of the anvil. Now, before you had the face ground it had a worn spot or sway caused by years of work. The area that was worn down would've not only been worn down but work hardened, the lesser worn areas less so. Resonance doesn't carry so well across areas of varying density, hardness, etc. For example, bell makers go to great lengths to ensure proper cooling rates as a single hard spot can ruin the sound of a bell. A simple experiment would be to make a dinner triangle from a tool steel, say coil spring. Normalize and give a listen, then harden just one side and see what it sounds like. Maybe? Hmmmm? Frosty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unkle spike Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 I put some of that non-slip toolbox drawer liner under mine, it is on a steel stand bolted down. That quieted it right down. I remove it for demo's as I want to "ring the bell" to bring in customers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutchmancreek Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Frosty.....I have found that if heat up and quench the corners of a dinner bell triangle it rings a lot better than if left alone. Your theory is probably right. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Martin Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 My teacher has like a nose cone thing, that is attached to a spring to his anvil stand which he throws over the round horn when he isn't using that part. It deadens the sound completely. However it makes no different to him and I because we have ear muffs on. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodeye Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 m brothers (or his teacher) has hit on the simplest most effective method i have yet to come accross. The nose cone I use is made by a spiral of 1/4 rd. I wrapped around the horn. Added a little curl on each end - one to hook on the screen door spring and the other, left a little sticking out, for a handle to slip it on and off. These are truely effective, light and elegant (for a blacksmith). Woodeye Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimenickel Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Alan L. told me to put household silicone under the anvil... and glue it down... then bolt it so it doesn't walk.... - the silicone deadens the high pitch right down.. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironrosefarms Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 I have thought about this question and I believe that Frosty is somewhat right. It is my thought process though that by removing the high spots that I would assume would be at the ends of the face, just before the horn and over the heal that you made the heal thinner. This thinner surface will require less energy to resonate and thus a louder ring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nthe10ring Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Fellas just as an aside here, always wear ear protection. Over the years from exposure to noises such as the anvil ringing can cause tinnitus, and I can assure you that you do not want this. Not from forging but from other exposures over the years it finally caught up with me and I have a constant sound some what like a pork chop frying in grease and the beginnins of a burnt bearing going in my head 24/7. It really takes some time to come to grips with it and I would not wish it on anyone. It is also accompanied by hyperacusis in my case, some sounds sound considerably louder to me and change tone. I have to wear ear plugs in the shower and also at church . Hearing loss would be mild to this. Take my advise and protect your hearing, especially you fellas with the power hammers and ringing anvils. Jerry Fisher Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 I have thought about this question and I believe that Frosty is somewhat right. It is my thought process though that by removing the high spots that I would assume would be at the ends of the face, just before the horn and over the heal that you made the heal thinner. This thinner surface will require less energy to resonate and thus a louder ring. Good hypothesis! If not the reason probably a strong contributor and much more likely than my thought. Frosty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Martin Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Is that your's John? If so, when'd you get that monster? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddog Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 (edited) If you think of the surface of the plate as a drum skin, the flatter and more homogenous it is, the more likely it is to resonate at or around a single frequency. In other words to concentrate all the energy into a single tone. Any dimples or hard spots in a drum skin would break up a wave that tries to vibrate across the whole surface requiring a mix of frequencies and harmonics and so giving more of a thud than a ping. I guess that was a long winded way of saying - yeah I agree :) Edited October 24, 2008 by maddog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 "Thinner = Louder" so small bells are much louder than large ones since they are thinner and can resonate more? I'd go with the "cleaner" looses less energy hypothesis myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welder19 Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 I don't think that thinner nesecarily = louder, I would think it is more of an issue with pitch, the thinner it is = a higher pitch, also combiined with the reduction of high and low spots as well as the work hardend spots. My Dad suffers from tinnitus from too many years working on and around jets for the Air Force and from what he describes it is not something I would wish on anyone and especially do not want it myself, so by all mean protect you ears and eyes, they are two things that are really a one shot deal, once you lose them their gone. welder19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 Thinner does not equate to smaller and overall size is what determines the pitch of bells. So, my larger and thicker Trenton should be both louder and lower pitched than my Sodorfors? Unfortunately for us amateur wannabe acoustic specs the reverse is true. Undamped the Sodorfors will make your ears ring through muffs and plugs while the Trenton is only loud. Not a fair comparison of course, different steels and processes all round. Still no expert me. Frosty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Salvati Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 Andy, an anvil that rings really loudly can (over a period of time) damage your hearing. Wrapping the chain around the waist of the anvil does work. I have 4 wrapps of chain around my Peter Wright. I'm not sure if it works on all anvils or not, but it works on mine. I have a 2 in. x12 in. x 16 in. chunk of iron I've also been using for small work. It rang so loudly I thought I would have to quit using it.....but I draped a loop of chain over each side of the face........problem solved. Now I just have to be careful not to hit the chain when hammering........ Jayco, I'll trade you an anvil for that block of steel........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayco Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 Sam, it's just a rectangular piece of mild steel I found one day at the steel recycler's yard. I placed it on an 'extra tall' stump to put it at proper height. You would need the stump as well.......can you imagine the shipping charges?!? James Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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