Fire Pot Depth? Answer quick

[FieryFurnace]

I am trying to fix my firepot wich is currently too deep. How deep does it need to be. It is a homemade, 4 sided type firepot with no clinker breaker. It is about 6 1/2 inches deep. I am using clay topped with firebrick. I have a demo I am doing in a couple of weeks so I have to start stocking up on everything.

The kidsmith,
Dave Custer

[Frosty]

Try ramming clay into the bottom 1/2" at a time till you get what you like. If the clay is just damp enough a mallet or 2x4 will ram it hard it shouldn't crack when you fire it up.

Frosty

[FieryFurnace]

I already put clay in but it clogged up my air holes. I am now putting a pipe in and putting new mud around it and putting the fire brick in on top. A 1x1/4 flat piece will keep the coal up top while letting the ash fall through.

The kidsmith,
Dave Custer
Proud member of the KAOA

[civilwarblacksmith]

My forge at the Union Mills Homestead is a brick colonial style forge. It had a brick firepot that was the depth of the length of the brick which is about 7". A duck nest tuyer rested under it with the clinker breaker. Much too deep to make the firepot effecient. I had to place a 3" dia. pipe in the middle that was about 3-4" in length and pack clay from the bank of the creek around it to make the firepot about 4" in depth and place a grate over the pipe.

It was ok until the clinker built up and adhered itself to the clay when forge welding. We would have to repair the clay.

Eventually got rid of it and dropped a 13" round coke pot into the brick firepot that was 4" deep.

[Glenn]

How about a photo of your forge pot?
Specifically the air holes.

[blksmth]

You could try to fashion a bottom metal plate (1/4") that fits at the level you want it - maybe 4 1/2 inches from the top. Support it with sides or legs. It should have a grate in it of some type (welded or cut). The exblacksmith at the Warps Pioneer Village in Minden, NE used one like that with a small hole (3/8") in it to make very small fires to do very small work. His forge firepot was a cast Centaur rectangular firepot which he wanted to make shallower and smaller.

[FieryFurnace]

I'll try to post a picture tomorrow. Got to go!

The kidsmith,
Dave Custer

[ThomasPowers]

Dave, without telling us what size work you generally use your forge for it's a bit of a guess how deep it needs to be---40" dia stock, 4", 1/4"????

My demo forge has a firepot that is about 5" down from the table and then I use firebricks on the table to make it as deep as I need it for the task I have.

Thomas

[triw]

I have been told to go from an oxidizing (hope I spelled that right) fire to a reducing fire the fire needs to be 5" deep. (A reducing fire has all the oxygen burned out so you get less scale and a better weld.) Is this correct and if it is wouldn't that dictate how deep to make your fire pot?

Edited June 17, 2008 by triw

[jimbob]

seems like that would depend on how much air your blower puts out.

[Glenn]

Small projects require a fire but BIG projects require BIG fires. As Thomas says, we need more information before we can answer the question properly. Send photos of the forge, and tell us what you plan to make.

[Mende]

im having the same problem . .i built my firepot 2 deep
it works very well but when i need 2 heat long pieces. . .i have 2 put 2 much coal in it. ..and it's wasteful. . .so i was thinking about mashing up some firebricks and mix them with ashes, lime and clay and seeing how that works. I would just pour some refractory cement . .but i can;t seem to find local shops that sell it.

[civilwarblacksmith]

I needed to fill in around my coke pot, I used a high temperature grout.

You should be able to find refractory cement at any place that sells fireplace equipment, wood stoves or inserts.

[Glenn]

I have changed the shape of my fire pot with clay. The hot fire does erode the sides a bit, but replacing the clay is only takes about half an hour, and is put to use with no drying time.

[FieryFurnace]

Thanks for all the answers! I was going to try to post those pictures tonight, but we are having trouble with the "thing" that we use to post pictures.:mad: I'll try later and again tomorrow. The pot is about 2 inches deep now, and it works GREAT. The heat is elevated enough to have half of the fire above and half below the rim of the pot. It makes a compact VERY hot fire now. It works GREAT! I had coke started 2 minutes after lighting the match and was hammering 3/8" round, 5 minutes from lighting the match. That's an improvement from 30 minutes of constant blowing before I had a stable fire. Finally after a year and a half of working with a bad set up (you can't imagine how bad) I have something that is portable and runs like a well oiled machine.:D:D
You folks that are trying to start out: You will probably spend a while with frustrating forges, blowers, hammers, vices, and get-by equipment; then comes the day when you get something that works and it will all be worth it! Trust me and struggle on!

The kidsmith
Dave Custer

[Frosty]

That's a major part of what makes this thing fun. Nothing boosts the moral like problem solving, overcoming difficulties or just having the light come on.

You try and try and try and then one day something goes click and it begins to work. The feeling just can't be beat.

Frosty
GCOA

[T]

I would like to show my forge. It was built before I knew enough about forges and fire...unfortunately. But now it works pretty well. The fire gets air from everywhere and not from one hole so I think it is a bit wasteful and if it goes wrong I will rebuild the firepot.

[Glenn]

T

[ThomasPowers]

Why I *STRONGLY* suggest a new smith spend an afternoon with someone who knows what they are doing---show them what it's supposed to be like rather than trying to troubleshoot things over the net! (I claim that a Saturday afternoon working with a good smith will save you over 6 months of trying to learn it by yourself and make smithing much more enjoyable!)

[Frosty]

You have that right to say the least.

Take it from someone who is mostly self taught. I can show you more in an afternoon than I figured out in the first couple years. Partly that's because I KNOW the things it takes the longest to figure out and can cut to the chase.

Frosty

[T]

Glenn: the firepot is 15x15cm and 5cm high. I made it in this design because I couldn't get good material for a normal firepot.

ThomasPowers: Unfortunately it is not so easy to find a blacksmith who can take time off for me. I spent a week looking for a smith. I found one, a farrier and I could met him once in his workshop. Blacksmithing isn't his main job and I realized that he doesn't like teaching beginners. But I showed my forge to him and he said that it's good for me. Now I have heard about an artist blacksmith so I'm planning to visit and ask him to teach me.

And now I have bigger problems with my skill than with my fire. But I'm on the way and if it is necessary I will rebuild my forge millions of times to make it better. And I will take photographs, of course.

Frosty: If you have learned nearly everything from experience it must have been very hard. I'm doing it for 3 months but I think I could learn these 3 months' knowledge in 3 days with a master and good equipment.

Sorry for the grammar I hope everything is clear.

[Frosty]

Your grammar is fine, lots of folk living here do worse.

15x15x5cm is in the ballpark (close enough) for a working fire pot.

This isn't an exact science the way we do it, it's an art. Everybody does it a little (to a lot) differently. Having help will speed things up for you but the most important thing you can do for yourself is build fires and beat iron/steel.

Even if you don't know what you're doing or how to do it every blow of the hammer will give you a better feel for the craft. You can NOT underestimate the importance of feel, your eye can tell you only so much. Every time the hammer meets the metal the sound and feel from the hammer and tongs or bar end will give you necessary information.

Your most important tools are your brain knowledge and experience. You can gain experience without knowledge by doing. You can NOT gain experience by gaining knowledge.

Heat it and beat it, you'll get there.

Frosty

[Michael]

Now I've got the opposite problem, my firepot, brake drum forge really, isn't deep enough as I use charcoal rather than coal. From the grate to the top of the drum is just about 4 inches and with charcoal that's hardly deep enough to get out of the oxidizing zone and weld. I've come close a few times by putting a piece of quarter inch plate over the top of the brake drum but its very hit or miss for forge welding. Future plan is to fabricate some sort of angle iron and plate table with a hole I can drop the drum into, then stack fire brick around the drum to make a deeper firepot. That will also give me some table space around the fire, which would be nice as well.

[Frosty]

You can bend up a rim extension from light steel strip stock, say 1/8" and clamp it around the rim. Once you determine what width makes the best depth for you bend one up from 1/4". make it so it slips over the edge of the drum and rests on the ridge.

Personally I'd build the table though. My first "real" forge was a brake drum let into an old washing machine top resting on cinder blocks. I packed the lid with adobe clay to the top of the drum, hooked the thing to a hair drier, (the old style with a hood attached to the heater blower by a hose)

I was 10 or 11.

Frosty

[R W]

Saw a good blacksmithing demo recently, blacksmith said the firepot needs to be around
4" deep.