Dan C Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 A few weeks ago I picked this 4.5" post vise up for $50, gave it a good cleaning, straightened the leg and forged new wedges for it. Yesterday I put it to use and it worked great for the work I was doing. Today I needed it to hold smaller but longer stock that needed more of the jaw surface area and found it was slipping. I looked at the jaw alignment and saw that the right side closed before the left side did, which explained why. If I close the jaws snug, but not too tight and tap lightly on the front jaw from the left side they'll line up and the gaps are more even. Someone stamped their name and year on the hinge, so I know at some point it was heated enough to become misaligned. What I was thinking about doing was removing the spring & mounting bracket, closing the jaws snug, but loose enough that a hammer tap will move then side to side, and then heating the hinge area. One problem I thought of is my only forge is an 11" brake drum that's built into a 2x3' welding table. It worked well when I straightened the leg, but I could rotate it to get an even heat throughout. Trying to heat this large of an area I'm not sure I'd be able to soak in the heat well enough. When I did bump the jaws into proper alignment the hinge appears strained (though not sure you can see that in the picture) Any suggestions? I'm sure this is not too uncommon. From working with the bent leg I can definitely say this vise is wrought iron. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfootnampa Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 That jaw alignment is as good as you're ever likely to get it!! Leave it alone! You could tighten the nut that holds the leg to the other jaw a tad if it needs it but otherwise it is just fine! Clamp something in the tight side of the vise and it will be the loose side next time you close it! They are NOT that precise! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 One of the advantages of post vises is the jaws can close at an angle. this lets you get a good grip on odd shaped objects. If you have to hold something small, say 1/4" rd. put a piece of 1/4" on the other side and it'll work just dandy. Both my 4" and 6" have about that much angle but close and hold fine. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Evans Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 (edited) I agree with Bigfoot and Frosty, I would not alter it unless it is really irksome. My main vice is not quite as pronounced a taper as that but I have always found it more of an asset than a liability. Most of the forged stuff I am holding is tapered so it holds fine. Most of the vices that I have restored had a small amount of over strain distortion from some gorilla swinging on the tommy bar with a tube. The quick fix is to use the same screw thread to un bend it....accomplished by removing the spring and putting a block between the legs and asking your friendly local gorilla to swing on the bit of tube. The block is ideally "D" shaped with the flat portion on the straight leg and the rounded on the bent one to isolate the pressure onto the bit you want to straighten. The block can of course be made from a number of pieces... If you can't do it cold, heat the thinnest part of the moving front leg and twist it to align the jaws, using the screw and a spacing block in the tight side of the jaws, if there is wobble in the hinge you can strip it clean it and squeeze it tighter before you do any heating and/or bending. Alan Edited April 30, 2013 by Alan Evans Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan C Posted April 30, 2013 Author Share Posted April 30, 2013 Guess I was spoiled by my previous smaller vise whose jaws line up perfectly. I'll give spacers a try. Once I figured out the right key words I did find in the forum where others have had a similar issue, though looking at the pictures in this one mine wouldn't even be noticeable. http://www.iforgeiron.com/topic/21925-non-parallel-jaws/?hl=alignment#entry223538 Thanks everybody! Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Coke Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 Greetings Dan, It's a simple problem... I have several and all I do is use a old hack saw blade as a shim on one side of the bolt.. Works fine... See my post on vice spacers under solving problems... Good luck Jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitch4ging Posted May 2, 2013 Share Posted May 2, 2013 I know this topic is well covered in the archives, but I do have a question on one. My name is Dennis, and I am 50 years old, and hope i'm not too old to learn a new craft. I bought a 4.25" similar to the above vise, but mine is off vertical, the top of the jaws touch, but the bottom is about 1/4" gap. (photo attached, I hope). My thought is heat just above the screw box, put the face of the jaw on the anvil, then hit from the back side above the screw box? Or would cold be better, or not at all, as was advised with Dan's above? The vise is in good shape, threads and all, just don't want to damage it. Thanks in advance for any input! Dennis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Evans Posted May 2, 2013 Share Posted May 2, 2013 Leave well alone looks in fine fettle! The legs do not look distorted around the eye to me at all. They are designed like that....When the jaws are about a third open, 75mm (3") maybe, the faces are going to be parallel don't forget...having them parallel when they are closed is about the most useless, only good for gripping the thinnest sheet and everything larger would then be gripped by the bottom of the jaw! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 2, 2013 Share Posted May 2, 2013 "One problem I thought of is my only forge is an 11" brake drum" unless you are in outer space you are standing on a great big forge! Take a shovel and dig a forge in the yard, plumb for air and Bob's your uncle! I once did 2' long box folds in 3/8" steel using a trough forge I dug in the back yard of my old inner city house in Columbus OH. You can also grind the faces even, weld up the faces even. I don't like torqueing them even using the original screw as if the screw/screwbox gets damaged you are in a world of hurt! One thing to do is to make a set of spacers so that when you have an item on one end of the vise the space is the same size on the other end to prevent this sort of torquing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Evans Posted May 2, 2013 Share Posted May 2, 2013 "I don't like torqueing them even using the original screw as if the screw/screwbox gets damaged you are in a world of hurt!" Good point. The screw thread is definitely the most difficult bit to replace or repair, I would hate to be responsible for someone to damage their vice. The vices I have used the "physician heal thyself" trick on had threads in good condition and my block was placed close to the hinge so there was maximum leverage. As they were amongst the first bits of kit I bought I did mine in the days before I had presses, a solid floor to tie anything down to, or any other tools that would have enabled me to do it any other way. I reckoned it was a self aligning jig and if the screw thread was strong enough to twist it cold then it should be robust enough to untwist it hot. In every instance it was. Luckily? Alan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caotropheus Posted May 2, 2013 Share Posted May 2, 2013 Greetings. I recently made a new stand for my old post vice (post #35) http://www.iforgeiron.com/topic/32659-where-is-your-vise-mounted/page-2 The jaws where misaligned in all directions you looked. The centre of the front jaw closed 15 mm to the side of centre of the rear jaw! I started making lots of plans on how to straighten the vice. I disassembled the vice and had a brilliant idea: What if I replace the bolt that connects the front jaw to the rear jaw? Twenty minutes return trip to the hardware shop, bought a 5/8 inch bolt and nut and voilà. Now the vice's jaws are perfectly align. The old bolt was not round and straight but grooved by excessive/abusive wear and use by previous owners and the front jaw was a bit loose in relation to the rear jaw. I couldn't even tight further the old bolt. Good luck with the repair Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caotropheus Posted May 2, 2013 Share Posted May 2, 2013 Greetings. I recently made a new stand for my old post vice (post #35) http://www.iforgeiron.com/topic/32659-where-is-your-vise-mounted/page-2 The jaws where misaligned in all directions you looked. The centre of the front jaw closed 15 mm to the side of centre of the rear jaw! I started making lots of plans on how to straighten the vice. I disassembled the vice and had a brilliant idea: What if I replace the bolt that connects the front jaw to the rear jaw? Twenty minutes return trip to the hardware shop, bought a 5/8 inch bolt and nut and voilà. Now the vice's jaws are perfectly align. The old bolt was not round and straight but grooved by excessive/abusive wear and use by previous owners and the front jaw was a bit loose in relation to the rear jaw. I couldn't even tight further the old bolt. Good luck with the repair Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan C Posted May 2, 2013 Author Share Posted May 2, 2013 "One problem I thought of is my only forge is an 11" brake drum" unless you are in outer space you are standing on a great big forge! Take a shovel and dig a forge in the yard, plumb for air and Bob's your uncle! I once did 2' long box folds in 3/8" steel using a trough forge I dug in the back yard of my old inner city house in Columbus OH. You can also grind the faces even, weld up the faces even. I don't like torqueing them even using the original screw as if the screw/screwbox gets damaged you are in a world of hurt! One thing to do is to make a set of spacers so that when you have an item on one end of the vise the space is the same size on the other end to prevent this sort of torquing. Hi Thomas, Yes, I've straightened 6' rock bars with my forge no problem. My concern wasn't the width of the area to be heated, it's more the thickness and concern that I wouldn't be able to get the pivot area and leg thoroughly heated to make an adjustment without having to be worried about causing it to crack, but I suppose if I really piled on the coal and air it would do it just fine. I'll take another look at the bolt, but I think on mine it's the side brackets that make the hinge that would need adjusting. I think making spacers or using a hack saw blade will do though. It's kinda like my anvil, the edges are worn, there's some belly. At first I thought it'd be nice to restore it, fix up the edges... Then I decided there isn't enough time for the things that I have to get done, much less the things that I'd like, so I just use it as is and have found it works just fine. That is a very nice vise stand Caotropheus. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitch4ging Posted May 2, 2013 Share Posted May 2, 2013 Alan, thanks. Makes since now, realizing these open with an arc pattern, I am use to a bench vise i guess. Caotropheus, i do like u'r mount, may steal your pattern!? Dan, i hope your repair goes good, great help here at ifi! Glad i came. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan C Posted May 2, 2013 Author Share Posted May 2, 2013 Mitch glad you're here as well! Duh, a bench vise would work just fine for the small stuff I'm doing! Sometimes you get so focused on one thing that you miss the obvious solutions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 2, 2013 Share Posted May 2, 2013 I once had a vise with a terrible vertical misalignment. Rather than mess with the cheeks I hot shrunk and riveted a plug in the original pivot hole and re drilled it so it would align. Been using it a decade so far... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitch4ging Posted May 2, 2013 Share Posted May 2, 2013 It certainly is s good mindset to be able to improvise what you have to make it work, or make it work better! That is the good thing about this forum, full of folks like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 4, 2013 Share Posted May 4, 2013 One of the mindsets of a blacksmith is to make or modify what you have into what you need. Today at the fleamarket I saw a pair of tongs with one side made from a large old bolt and the other from an old heavy rasp---one of the 1/2" thick ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitch4ging Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 That is improvising with what you have on hand! Which flea market did you visit? I am originally from Silver City, settled here in Oklahoma where my wife's family is. We use to go to the one in Deming, but it's been a long time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surf ox Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 My first very old four inch vise straightened easily with a friends large hydraulic press and a few strategically placed blocks. He said my vise was made out of "butter iron". We worked it cold while disassembled and I trued the faces with a six inch horizontal belt sander as I thought I needed a little finer grip for gunsmithing. Looks good and works well, but have a newer, tougher four and a half for heavier work such as in blacksmithing. My first post....have been reading the site a lot since I found it. Surf Ox Rust is my favorite color. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 Welcome aboard Surf Ox, glad to have you. If you'll put your general location in the header we won't have to bug you about it. You also may be pleasantly surprised to find out how many of the IFI gang live within visiting distance. You just never know when another blacksmith might come in handy. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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