Damascus Mike Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 Hi there guys its DM, ive got a question for people who have ever made hammers or know alot about them,anyway my question is what is a common metal to use when making a ball pein hammer?thanx DM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Sells Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 I didn't realize our forum search was broken, thank you for letting us know, I will look into it. Lucky for you there is so much about hammer material you dont even need the search to find it, as the answers are all over this site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
781 Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 Not sure what a ball pein is made of. Probably depends on when and where it was made, us or china old or new ect Last night I watched a DVD from the Saltfork group of Tom Clark and he said he used 1045 for all his hammers. In the same video he talked about about making a hot cut hardy. He used 5160 he got as drops from a closing spring plant. I believe the hill side above the shop still had tons of it when he passed. His heat treating disscussion lasted about 50 minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerkid Posted June 21, 2009 Share Posted June 21, 2009 I use 4140 when I make a hammer, do some searching for hammer materials and you should find lots of info. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damascus Mike Posted June 22, 2009 Author Share Posted June 22, 2009 sorry but i dont know what 4140,5160 or 1045 is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy seale Posted June 22, 2009 Share Posted June 22, 2009 use the "net" lots of steel tables out there, one of them will give you a breakdown of alloys and there you will find your anwsers to your questions....you need to practice your researching habits. do the leg work and learn, jimmy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Browne Posted June 22, 2009 Share Posted June 22, 2009 DM give uncle Google a nudge and search on "steel type 4140", etc. Lots of info comes up which will keep you occupied for months. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damascus Mike Posted June 22, 2009 Author Share Posted June 22, 2009 i just did a search and nothing comes up on these codes,its so frustrating when i cant find the right stuff and then people tell me im not looking good enough but i truely do not have a clue what to be searching for,if somebody could just tell me the name of this "Steel table" i will be so greatefull. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Browne Posted June 22, 2009 Share Posted June 22, 2009 Mike, I just reran my Google search and got the attached returns. Just check your entry into the search engine. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt87 Posted June 22, 2009 Share Posted June 22, 2009 Here you go DM:Let me google that for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Sells Posted June 22, 2009 Share Posted June 22, 2009 (edited) Part of the reason I didn't post any more of an answer was he says he doesn't know what that means. This is due mainly because he wont start at the beginning and learn about steels or hammer technique, also in part becaue of him living in NZ and most of our comments are from US steel designations. HE really should learn about his local types. The problem here is that in one post he states he is not a beginner, then in another says his first attempt smithing was a sword he made about about 5 months ago. In the past 4 months or so that he has been a member he has insisted on jumping in the middle. Regardless of what he says his actions have proven he refuses to learn the basics, would rather we tell him what he wants as he thinks he needs it. Edited June 22, 2009 by steve sells typo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbob Posted June 22, 2009 Share Posted June 22, 2009 lets keep this simple...if you are just learning to make a hammer head use what ever you have, so as not to waste good money until you learn what your doing, that way if it gets messed up you will not have laost much. did you make a drift and hammer eye punch yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlotte Posted June 22, 2009 Share Posted June 22, 2009 A very well known local Farrier/Blacksmith along the Gulf Coast, Buddy Leonard, used to make, and as far as I know still makes, Farriers driving hammers out of 5160. Of hand I cann't think of any reason a small ball pein shouldn't be made out of the same material. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 22, 2009 Share Posted June 22, 2009 stepping down a level to account for DM's location which very well may not use the designations we use in the USA (on the other hand how many american smiths know what EN55 is?) Hammer heads are usually made from a medium carbon steel. One common source is car axles. Ptree who used to work in a factory that made axles posted this on them "industry standard was 1045H below 1 3/8" stock and 1541H for axles above that size, for trucks" Note that you may want to practice heat treating this material before tring it on a piece you have a lot of work in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metalmangeler Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Here I normally use an axel as was stated, the tool you need to think about good steel for is your eye punch which I use H13 for as I normally get it to hot. If you keep a couple hammers around that are not heat treated they are good to let the learners use as they won't reck your anvil.:rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 I have been to New Zealand many times, the south Island just as many, been through Westport just about as often. They have a hardware store there that I do not doubt sell small ball pein hammers. Probably even have a choice of cheap chinese ones for a couple of $NZ, through to name brands for a few more dollars. Why would you want to make one?????? I guess I'm saying make your hammer out of a nickel bronze alloy, readily available in your pocket, the big ones are $2, the small ones are $1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damascus Mike Posted June 23, 2009 Author Share Posted June 23, 2009 yes i have made those tools from ships engine bolts but we call them square and round punches ,as to the designations of steel or wateva you call it im not asking about one kind of steel like 1045 what i wanted to get is something where i can learn ALL these codes(eg:1045,1080,15N20) so that i know them of by heart,i have already read throught and leant the hammer control and moving metal to where and how you want it,and all i wanted to know was what you would suggest as a good metal for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Browne Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Mike, I don't know of a list like that so I just do a Google search for each code as it comes up Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damascus Mike Posted June 23, 2009 Author Share Posted June 23, 2009 I have been to New Zealand many times, the south Island just as many, been through Westport just about as often. They have a hardware store there that I do not doubt sell small ball pein hammers. Probably even have a choice of cheap chinese ones for a couple of $NZ, through to name brands for a few more dollars. Why would you want to make one?????? I guess I'm saying make your hammer out of a nickel bronze alloy, readily available in your pocket, the big ones are $2, the small ones are $1. why would i wanna make one you say?because im a blacksmith and thats what we do,we make our own toolsMike, I don't know of a list like that so I just do a Google search for each code as it comes up Cheers thanx thats all i needed to know,if there was a list or not.thanx for the help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Russell Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Mike , after spending a better ( if i can call it better ) part of an hr in the chat with 3 other willing people " trying to show you where to look up these magical numbers your after & failed to get you to understand we ain't gonna hand you this stuff on a silver platter & that you NEED to do YOUR OWN RESEARCH " i've decided hence with to ignore all of your posts from now on I tried & failed , not once , but up to 5 time to get you to do some research for yourself , each time you came back with some whinny excuse . You ave the BIGGEST search tool at your fingertips " THE INTERNET " & say you don't get the info you need off this site , in that case " goodbye " we've all tried our best to help you , but this little black duck wont fall for that trick again I feel i've failed Mike , not through my lack of trying , but his lack of wanting to do something for himself , & for that i feel sorry for you Mike All the best in the future projects you attempt , just don't ask me for any help Dale Russell p.s , some of you out there may think this is harsh , but you didn't ave ta put up with his pityful excuses in the chat like in did ( info was supplied & was total ignored ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbob Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 (edited) here's what you want Chemical Composition Min.% Max.% Carbon 0.38 0.43 Silicon 0.15 0.04 Manganese 0.75 1.00 Chromium 0.80 1.10 Molybdenum 0.15 0.25 Phosphorous 0 0.04 Sulphur 0 0.015 this works really well for hammers...we call it 4140 here in the states; it could go by any of the below Germany DIN 17212 W.Nr 1.7223 Type 41CrMo4 DIN 17200-1654 W.Nr 1.7225 Type 42CrMo4 Japan JIS G 3441 SCM 440 TK USA AISI 4140 ASTM A519-96 4140 SAE 4140 UNS G 41400 Edited June 23, 2009 by jimbob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 The ASM Handbooks will go into massive details on what's in each alloy including allowable tramp elements. Their heat treating handbook will go into detail on how they should be heat treated. They are large massive and very expensive *new*. For most of my work the old ones are just fine and MUCH MUCH cheaper! Machinerys Handbook has a shorter description explaining the number code and may be easier to find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Browne Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 He could just go to a junk shop and get a few old hammers and modify them to his requirements. Works for me and save LOTS of work. While I take pride in making my own tools we don't have to make work for ourselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quenchcrack Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 Try this site: STEELYNX It has links to about 7500 sites related to steel. Gotta be one in there that will keep you busy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Browne Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 This thread has ran its race IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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