ornametalsmith

Hi Devi, I work in both mediums. AND although my latest glass attraction is Lampworked elements, which I'm working on incorporating into my sculpture......I've done a few ornamental metal projects that incorporated both fused and stained glass components. I think that they really go well together. The glass has a great way of adding some serious "eye candy" to a design. IF the glass isn't "backed" and enables light to Play with it....the effects can be stunning, IMO. One thing I'd make a point of.......when you install fused or stained glass components in a metal frame......you should use a flexible adhesive/caulk.........to compensate for the different expansion and contraction of the two. small free standing piece scuptural elements 4"x4" fused tile element

That is "variegated bronze leaf" applied just like gold leaf. It's availabel with different "colored" highlites....red, blue, green and black. It's applied over aluminum in that piece.

Just found the Cold Worked section........which I think is a GREAT idea. I'll toss out a few cold worked forged items I make. They are forged aluminum and copper. All forged cold.....(fwiw, .without even being annealed) I've been surprised how far you can forge these non ferrous materials without annealing or working hot. I do have some large scaled fold formed pieces that I do....that are also forged cold......but need to be annealed to open, so they may not be appropriate of this section. Hope it adds something interesting to this section. I really love the new LOOK of IFI, top shelf. Been to long since I've spent a LOT of time on here.........I need to check out all the NEW stuff. WELL.......I just noticed that these images are HUGE.........I can resize them.......but it does let you see more detail LOL :blink:

:).......I do feel a lil fancy..........and considering I joined in '06...........I need to do some serious posting to catch up with your post count. I appreciate everyone's feedback. I had my doubts bout the double headed nail........but as some have stated........guess it's possible. BUT the fact that the majority of the ones found DON'T have the double heads....makes me think this ones just a Modified version.....or as one said.....an upgrade at some point. No doubt it would make em easier to remove I guess....... Have you started that embossing project yet? Hope you've quit picking on the local trees.......and aren't throwing snowballs at'em anymore. Later Frostilio..............ta ta for now. bill

I'm learning more regarding the history of these spikes/nails. And I'd like to run this by everyone here. And see if anyone else can verify this info, which was forwarded to me by client. Specifically a "double headed nail" similar to carpenter's double headed nails.I know this gets into some sensitive territory..........I'm mainly interested in the "forging challenge" and being accurate. Appreciate any help. IF this turns out to be factual info.....I'm thinking a "spring swage tool" will make these possible. Any ideas regarding that are also appreciated. "I also found out another historical/archeological fact that is interesting as I am trying to be relatively historically accurate. These nails were used over and over because the metal was too valuable to throw away a nail after a single use (macabre I know!) Thus the nails had a ridge on them like modern ridge carpenter's nails. I have attached a photo of the only archeological evidence that exists in terms of type of nail actually used found intact in an ankle of a crucified individual. In that case the nail was bent and may have been driven into a knot in the wood so it would have been hard to immediately extract so the Romans probably just passed it over. Most crucified individuals were not allowed to be buried by the Romans and left out for wild animals as further humiliation so there is not much actual archeological evidence. "

As usual........IFI has come to the rescue again. I just got a request to make some Crucifixion nails. At first the client thought they'd be 9"-10" long. And to be "correct"....they should be forged from wrought or bronze. Well I made a few from mild steel and without a header......just to give her an idea what they'd look like. Because I had no photo to go from....the first one I did was started w/ 3/8"sq. .........she then sent me pix.....and it was apparent that I needed to start with at least 1/2" sq. stock. So I whipped out two other samples. Thought I'd toss out this photo of what I made. AND......I'm now wondering if I under quoted these........told her they'd be in the $15ea. range........but only from mild steel. I do have a 2" sq. bar of wrought....that I could draw down.......but it would cost her MUCH more lol. I may do a few in wrought just for me........I NOW want to make one of the crucifixion crosses like you see made from cut nails. I have one I bought in MX.......back in the mid seventies for a guide. This thread has been invaluable. You guys rock. :)

ahhhh the roast is goin fine......pass the birch beer over HERE. Where's that line forming for the tree huggin dance lessons?. Frostilio........do I need to lead.........of just kick back and wait till that birch puts her limb on my shoulder an winks?

fwiw, here's a clay forging video......about horse heads. YouTube - Horse head-working out the forging w/Clay

I've been surprised how far you can forge copper....and aluminum.. cold......without even annealing it first. The "secret" if there was one......for me anyway. Was that I did it with a set of tight radius'd fullering dies on the powerhammer. Most impressive was ...a 1/4" thick piece that I forged down to about 1/16" .....before it even BEGAN to split. And I've done a video on youtube of cold forging aluminum, not annealed first......to extremes.. the only annealing done....was to soften the Fold Formed elements to OPEN them. I've posted this on here before.....but'll add it again for anyone that hadn't seen it. YouTube - Large Scale Fold FormingFULLresVID

Frostilioooooooooo , great to have you back...........is an understatement.

Thoughts and positive vibes on their way to both Jer and Deb. Hang tuff you two.........get well soon my brother, we need ya.

Che, I just gave your contact info to a young 15 yr. old that is VERY interested. He should be in touch soon. His name is Ben. He's in Ottawa. He's on a mission to find some coal and an anvil in Ottawa. He's gonna freak when he meets you. I think it's great that you eagerly help the beginners. happy hammering......

don't ya just love it when the "smilies tripped me up". the only thing better is when the smile shoves your ears to the back of your head. Well I hope you didn't bring my name up over at AM.......wouldn't want you blacklisted. LOL And your 100% correct .....it does forge very similar to copper. But with 65% copper content..........to be expected. That's also why I took a shot at forging it cold. I think I was able to forge it even a lil further than copper......I don't think I've ever forged copper "razor" thin without a lil split. That NS didn't split at all, much to my surprise. so much to learn.........so little time

I heard back from Frosty.......and the fella was interested in forging nickel silver(german silver). I'd never forged any before but I had some 1/4" plate that I cut off a chunk, and did a lil YouTube vid of forging it. Because I've never forged it, I thought that it would need to be forged hot ...BUT..... because I've also learned that you can forge MANY non ferrous metals cold..thought I'd give it a try cold...before doin it hot. Forged so nice I never got to the hot part LOL:o Much to my surprise I couldn't make it split, from work hardening, no matter how THIN I forged it. When I was done......the NS was so thin......it would almost shave hair, LOL and it NEVER split. here's a link to the vid: YouTube - forgin Nickel Silver IF there is a trick to forging non ferrous COLD......it's BEST to use hard penetrating blows. Softer, less penetrating, blows only effect the surface of the metal and it work hardens and "flakes off". This "trick" is relevant to another thread on forging aluminum, fwiw. Personally.......I LOVED the way it forged. Hope that was some help to your friend, Frosty. Great question, IMO. I learned something........again :cool:

Jer, love what you've done with Bobbie. Looks great. congrats!!!!

LOL.....checks in the mail, Frostilio. ;) I don't check in here enough.........glad I did today. I do have a lil info that might be helpful to this thread. Let me start by saying I've been forging aluminum since '89. And I TOO was taught that you "had to forge it hot". I've found out through a LOT of experimentation......that "generalization" is false. Like Jer said......you'd be surprised how far you can push the material cold. Of course there are exceptions to every rule......SOME alloys will NOT let you forge them cold(one example 7000 series will work harden and split). I normally use 6000 series(6061, 6063)but have also used 5000, 3000 and a few others. I haven't finished reading this thread.......but noticed that someone has already said that you WON'T see any RED when annealing aluminum.... until it's to late. Maybe I should read the rest of this thread before I add anymore. I'll be baaaaaaaack.....oh........and I want to thank Youngsmith for the kind words.

So.......once you've forged the blade to shape. AND then you take it to a normalized temp.(non-magnetic) ..........to harden. What happens to the "grain" size and structure at that elevated temp.? Does it grow, stay the same, become more refined?

fwiw, here's the foot operated "Smith" gas saver that I've been using for years. Don't know how I got along with out it. Paid for itself many times over. and a lil video of it being used to make some BOO. YouTube - Makin' Steel BOO FULLresVid gas saver starts at 1:29 if you want to skip ahead :D

twisted rebar is beautiful, IMO. food for thought :cool:

FWIW, Citrisurf is the NON TOXIC stuff that Frostilio mentioned. Stellar Solutions and to see some amazing forged SS.......check out Giusseppe's work. He gets some killer "temper colors". He doesn't always passivate. Metalgarden | where to bend next... and Ries': Ries Niemi Industrial Artist happy hammering,

Hi JT, FABA is a great group and I think you'll get a lot out of joining. They have monthly meetings in four different regions of the state. Your closest would be either the SW or the NE region. Florida Artist Blacksmith Association you JUST MISSED a killer meeting at the BOK tower(local for you). Which houses many wonderful examples of Yellin's work. AND as a bonus...George Dixon did a demo. fwiw, he worked at the Yellin shop. look forward to meeting you at a future FABA meeting. happy hammering, bill PS....if your ever in the Ocala area, give me a call come by the shop.

Might be of interest to some. Considering how much of a mess these saws make.......I took an empty 55 gal. drum and fab'd a drop in shelf out of expanded metal....then positioned my chop saw in the center...now ALL of that MESS ends up in the drum. And if/when it gets full......I just dump it and get a new drum.....drop in the expanded metal shelf......and viola. I'll have to see if I've got pix of it....to share.

fwiw, here's a youtube vid of making bamboo with steel pipe. Two different methods. YouTube - Makin' Steel BOO FULLresVid Must admit......I've never heard of anyone filling tubing before forging. BUT I have used that technique many times when I'm twisting or bending hollow forms. goatman's advice if VERY important.

forge it hot and cold, fwiw. I've never had a problem going from forging non ferrous to ferrous.....on the same anvil. Not sure how it would effect forge welds, though. 2 centavos :cool: