Vise not gripping

[Charlie M]

I've had this old attwood Stourbridge  vise for a while now and have always had problems with it not holding work that I am upsetting, like riveting pieces together. I pulled it out 2day and on looking at it, I have noticed that the back leg seems to be bend backwards. I'm wondering if this would affect the gripping power, and if I should heat it and bend it forwards? Though at the same time, the jaws seem to be flat to each other with no gap..

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 27, 2022 by Mod30
Remove duplicate photos

[Irondragon Forge ClayWorks]

I would start by welding on a new leg & acorn. In the first picture it looks like the moveable jaw is bent back slightly so when it's opened to accept stock, it would rock back and only grip the stock with the bottom of the jaw. Also the bottom picture looks like the jaw has dropped down some so I would check the pivot pin for wear.

[anvil]

Also reforge or make new plates at the bottom where the hinge is. See how its bent and the bottom drop is pretty close to the jaw drop and angle. Then a little filework on the jaws and done. or you will know whats next.. Or you could draw out the leg to make it longer. 

[Charlie M]

Hmm, the pivot screw has no wear on it, and is holding the front jaw in place with no movement.. and also the hinge plates are just a weird shape, they aren't actually square in shape they are a trapezium. By my eye they r where they should be- I hope haha.

I have a piece of 16mm bar for a leg, could I weld mild steel to wrought iron? And also what is an acorn? Is that the bottom of the leg?

Also I put boiled linseed oil on the vice about a year ago. It's dry now, can I stick that in the fire or would it go up in flames?

[anvil]

Pics are deceiving. If the jaws are not flush at the top, you could make jaw protectors of differing thickness to compensate, unless they just look that way because of the pic.

[Charlie M]

The actual height difference in jaws is the middle picture

[Daswulf]

I would straighten the stationary jaw length first and see where that gets you. 

 

[Stash]

Ignoring the missing part of the leg, I would definitely straighten the static leg. I think once that is done, the elevated top of the jaw will be pulled down into the proper alignment. I straightened both legs of a vise that were bowed in to the point where the jaws weren't touching. I got them hot, hooked the 'ski slope' over the tail of the anvil so the concave section was flat on the face, and placed a flatter on the high spot and gave a few good whacks. Quick  and easy, it did the trick. It more than likely is wrought iron, so you can get it yellow.

As far as the missing leg, I offer another thought. Don’t bother. I have a vise with a missing leg mounted on my workbench. I simply 'raised the floor' by bolting a 3x3" block of wood to the bench so it was a tight fit under the mounted and bolted vise. If it gets towards the top of my 'to do' list, I might repair the leg, but this treatment put me in business quick and easy.

Opinions and options abound, they are all valid and sound. Your call.

Steve

[swedefiddle]

Good Morning, Charlie,

If you use a Ruler or a Straight Edge on the back side of the stationary part of the Vice, You will see where your Bend is. This is normal, from Normal Use. You can straighten it warm (not Too Hot) laying on a fairly flat surface and give it a wallop using a Flatter to spread the load. or What I quite often do, is set it in my Hydraulic Press using a couple blocks and give it a push to go back to straight. Your Jaw will magically align itself with the other Jaw.

Don't overthink the problem, Just do it!

Neil

[Charlie M]

So I went for it today, and I straightened the back leg, it now looks symmetrical with the other leg. The only problem is the jaws don't line up well now... I don't quite understand why as they are even on both sides. It looks like the movable leg is 1/8" bigger than the other.

I'm near tempted to get the grinder out, or is that just bad on this piece of history?

[Frosty]

That is because the jaws on a leg vise swing in an arc unlike a bench vise which moves on a "track". Leg vise jaws align better with something in them, try putting a piece of 1" sq. bar in it and seeing how they align. The shorter the legs the shorter the radius and more narrow the size they fit.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Charlie M]

Yeah, I get that. But surely they would need to line up a few mm open for making rivet or nail heads?

[Frosty]

Ah HAH! that's why I made rivet and nail headers. Nails lay over the pritchel hole on the anvil and rivet headers go in the vise. My first couple rivet headers didn't work very well, they were hard to clamp in the vise without applying a cheater to keep them in place. Then after trying a flange I didn't like I cut two lengths of 3/4" sq. bar 4" long though they could've been longer but that's the vise I had in mind to use. Anyway, I cut one side off the center 8" of a 12" length of 1 1/2" (because that's what I had handy) angle iron and bent the single side center around a piece of 1 1/2" round. That makes a spring with angle iron flanges that rest on top of the vise jaws. Yes?

Then I clamped the 3/4" sq. between the flanges in the vise and welded them up. Now I could drop it in the vise and it stayed, I opened the spring slightly so there was a gap when the vise was open. Visualizing with me so far?

Lastly I put a piece of card stock between the halves, clamped it in the drill vise and drilled a series of holes between the halves. It turned out I've only ever headed maybe 3 sizes but I have a bunch anyway in case. 

That's it, drop it in the vise and it rests on the flanges, place the stock you wish to head in the appropriate hole give the handle a half turn and take your hammer to it. Of course cheating is perfectly acceptable, heating the rivet or whatever stock with a torch takes the HURRY out of it. 

Frosty The Lucky.

[JHCC]

Heating the head with a torch also means that the header grips the rivet shanks more securely.

[Daswulf]

If in use you find that difference to be an issue then it is your tool and you need it to work to what you need it to do. 

I don't think it would hurt it to grind them even and the jaw faces to meet evenly as long as it is done in knowing the tool and knowing it would improve the tools function.  It can mess them up when someone just does something for looks rather than knowing the function and how it was made to work. 

[Frosty]

Das is right Charlie, if that misalignment means it won't do what you need then it needs correcting. Grind it, heat and bend it, whatever. A tool that  doesn't work for you is not the tool you need.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Charlie M]

Frosty I don't quite understand still after a few reads.. would u have a pic? I have been doing a few things that have involved mortice and tenon rivets, stuff with odd shaped ends on it, that is what is making me think of using the vise.

I decided to give the outer leg a wee bend, and it seemed like a good idea at the time, but it has put a crack in it... I am sure it is wrought iron now. Would this crack affect it, or can I use away?

Before someone says forge welding. I have only tried it once before and it wasn't successful.. and to top it off it's a pretty awkward place to forge weld together again.

[Frosty]

I'll see if I can find it next time I'm in the shop but it's -8 and not looking like it's warming up for a while. I'll make a sketch and see if that works. 

That crack doesn't look like wrought to me, it looks more like a malleable iron casting. That looks like a job for brazing rod or grind it out and arc weld it. Just remember if you braze first you can not arc weld it if that doesn't work. If it IS cast iron you'll want a cast iron or nickel rod.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Charlie M]

You could very well be right, the thing that made me think that it was wrought was a small crack on the hinge plate. It looks like it is layered, a bit like a grain on the left side.

[Charlie M]

If anyone is curious the outcome of the vice was it didn't seem to forge well and it cracked- tho I have had a few similar old tools that did the same thing.  Maybe I am forging that specific material wrong.

The attwood vice was weldable, and I was able to get the leg and cracks welded.

I also forged out the mounting bracket, wedges and spring for it.

I also decided when I was waiting to get it fixed, as I can't weld.. I would buy another. Alot bigger 125lb, 6" jaws- it gets more use than the wee one now.

[anvil]

nice vice. Also, smaller vices don't hold as well as larger ones. That very well could have been your problem. 

You said you were making tenons and came up with the vice problem. Heres a pic of mt tenoning tool. I use it under my 25# lil giant, but you can hand hold it and use a stand and a weight to hold your pickets level and secure on your anvil face to free up your hammer hand. Theres multiple holes, not only for different size tenons, but when you make them, start at the largest and use each to step down your tenon. On the longest tool, the holes are 5/8" to 5/16" in 1/16" increments. So a 3/8" tenon out of 5/8" starts at the top and is forged down a 1/16" at a time. If you need pics of the setup with a stand and a weight, let me know.

[Scott NC]

  Anvil, I can imagine it mayby, but I for one would like to see that set up, if you would be so kind.

[anvil]

I just saw your post. Ill do a setup and pics tomorrow.

[Scott NC]

  Shoot, I wouldn't bother Anvil, I can see it in my minds eye, now.