Cut stock in half the easy way

[Glenn]

To cut a rod (round or square) in half. balance on the hot cut hardy and tap with hammer. You have a mark to use as a guide for hot cutting. rc

[primtechsmith]

Two things I have learned from working with yesteryearforge is: 1. when cutting stock with a hardie use a brass hammer. and 2. NEVER hit cold metal with a forging hammer. Have a "cold" hammer hanging near your vice or close to your work area. That way you will spend more time forging and less time re-dressing your hardies and hammers!

Peyton

[T-Gold]

I use an engineer's hammer (small double-faced sledge) for most of my forging -- one side of it is the "dirty" side and one is the "good" side. Comes in handy for stuff like this.

[Kristopher Skelton]

2# brass hammers can be had from harbor freight for less than $15. Copper hammers are just a few dollars more.

Watch for the dark line to form on the piece being cut (if using a hardy tool) and then use tong or pliers to twist off the piece being cut- no hot metal flying all over. DON'T keep whomping on the piece- that's a good way to send hot metal onto someone's foot, into that plastic bucket in the corner, or somewhere else you don't want it to go or can't find it now that you've cut it off and need it.

[Ralph]

Two things I have learned from working with yesteryearforge is: 1. when cutting stock with a hardie use a brass hammer. and 2. NEVER hit cold metal with a forging hammer. Have a "cold" hammer hanging near your vice or close to your work area. That way you will spend more time forging and less time re-dressing your hardies and hammers!

Peyton

Curious. So do you have a seperate hammer you use with a cold chisel? After all the striking end of the chisel os cold.
I personly only use one hammer for about 99% of my smithing. It is a 2 1/2 lber cross pien that I dressed the face and pein to have the same crown. Also
made the pein's 'face' to be about 1/2 inch across mebbe more.
Either way I usually only have to redress the faces once or twice a year.

Year before lastr I had redress about 4 times but it was due to working until I was too tired and cut thru some stock and hit the hardy.
I also know I do not have the hammer control I would like, but then again I have not had much chance to hammer in over a year so I know I will be very rusty once I start again, assuming the arm and side finally let me.

It is fascinating to hear how so many smiths either learned or just do things. We are all different. nice thing about it is we can help others see it in a different manner.

Ralph

[primtechsmith]

I usually hit my chisels, punches, and fullers with either the 2lb. ball pien(cold hammer) that hangs by the vice, or with the 2lb. brass hammer. I seem to feel my smithing hammers are for hot steel only. Also using a brass hammer on punches, chisels, and fullers (when doing more than a tap for a center punch, or veining on leaves) is more life for the tool. Hardened steel from the hammer will mushroom these tools out and cause potential projectiles down the road, or extra work to grind it off.

Besides, I don't want to go to he** for hitting cold iron!!! :shock: :wink:

Peyton

[ThomasPowers]

When I want to do a through cut I do the last blows with the hammer head to the side of the hardy insted of it coming down on top of the hardy.

Thomas

[Marc]

A few things along this thread:

To get to that balance point quickly (for cutting in half) I put the piece on my hands as they're held out sort of like a karate chop. Then slide my hands together until they meet. That'll be the center. I haven't done it hot, but I would guess any old bar/rod stock would replace my hands just fine.

On my hot-cut hardy - I made it from a piece of leaf spring. I ground the bevel most of the way, leaving something like 1/8" flat. Then I ground the center sharp, leaving a 1/8" wide "strip" on each edge. That gives kind of a stop that a hammer would hit before hitting the sharpened edge. The method also leaves those stops raised a little, and should take into account whatever crown your hammer has.

And lastly - Tom Latane demo'd for one of our meets. He's a big repousse guy. He uses mild steel for his chiseling hammers. Not only does it cut down on chisel mushrooming, but the hammer develops a dish that he feels helps keep the blows centered.

[frogvalley]

You can of course use a cold cut hardy in your anvil. You won't go to H for hitting cold iron if your doing prep work using the right tools.

And hit it with any old hammer. Don't need to be fussy, I have triplicates of all the hammers in my shop and as long as its the right weight for the job, pound away. Spreading the mileage around prevents any one hammer from being worn out.

4 lb cross pein is my primary hammer, 2-3 lbs next, 2-3 lb ball peins next and then as needed for other 50 or so hammers.

Of course I like my power hacksaw for cutting best. :D

[yesteryearforge]

Maybe im guilty of teaching bad habits or if not bad habits perhaps useless habits, but I use different hammers for different uses.
Such as
I use a brass hammer to cut off with and to hit the chop fuller with which pretty much eliminates any damage to either.
I have what I refer to as cold hammers that I hit punches , chisels , and cold metal with.
I use a wooden mallet for straightening spirals and twist if they get out of shape
I go to the trouble to dress the faces of my hammers very nice and want to keep them that way.
Besides I have a plethora of hammers.
Most smiths that I know have a lot of hammers , and whats the point of aquiring multiple hammers if you intend to use only one hammer for everything.
I take efforts to keep from marring up the face of my anvil and think it only reasonable to do the same with my hammers.

MIKE-T

[keithh999]

When twisting square stock and it comes out with that funky kink in it, rather than hit it with your regular forging hammer you might try a lead hammer...it doesnt ding up your fancy twists and is actually heavy enuf to drive tent pegs if needed. I cast my own out of old wheel weights in a soup can and punched a hole in the side for a piece of pipe. I had all the weights given to me to use in my blackpowder guns but only use pure lead for that. the hardest part was tearing the can off of the hammer after it cooled but perseverance conquered that obstacle....eventually..LOL. a note on safety about lead melting...please do it outside so that you dont get heavy metal poisoning.
Now git out there and make some noise...

[Thomas Dean]

Hey man, welcome to IFI! Good idea with the lead hammer. I had a 4x4 piece of oak that I drilled a hole in and went out and cut a sweetgum sapling for the handle. Used my old draw knife to shape the handle to fit. Have an old stump and lay the twists on the stump and use the oak hammer. Works great for me. I can think of several things to use a lead hammer on but I don't have the lead...not yet anyway.

Now, hows bout heading over to the "introduce yourself" and give us a little tidbit about yourself. Hope you enjoy the site and don't forget, we LIKE pictures! :)

[Blacksmith Jim]

When scoring cold stock with your hardy, be sure you know what the stock is. Cold coil spring can mar a hot cut pretty quick...

[Glenn]

Why mess with lead hammers when a 2x4 or piece of firewood will do almost as well. And you don't have to worry about OHSA running tests for lead and turning your property (or the rental unit) into a super-fund site.

Regional, you can use a piece of leaf spring or angle iron hardie for scoring. You are correct not to ruin a high dollar store bought (or valuable) hardie.

[Donnie]

I have one hammer dedicated for cold use. I never use a forging hammer to strike anything but hot iron. About a week ago, my 12yr. old son was helping his sister make a drive hook. I was close enough to keep an eye on them. I got tickled when I overheard him tell her "You make sure you don't hit the anvil with your hammer, cause if you hit anything but HOT IRON daddy will get your goose"........and I thought he never listens!

[Glenn]

Kids do listen, but somehow translate a hour long lecture into the boiled down version so even another kid can understand. " if you hit anything but HOT IRON daddy will get your goose" LOL


Warms your heart don't it.

[Ted T]

Wow, what a great discussion. I could not agree more about when Ralph said "It is fascinating to hear how so many smiths either learned or just do things. We are all different. nice thing about it is we can help others see it in a different manner".
Although I believe all the points of view that have been expressed here are well worth consideration for your use, Peyton and Mike have reflected back to what my beliefs are about hammer use. I am sure it is because the concepts were instilled into me when I was young and in training as a blacksmith.
So, I would like to repeat some of what they said, that I think are valuable points that I feel are worth repeating over again, Knowing that the mother of skill is repetition.

Two things I have learned from working with yesteryearforge is: 1. when cutting stock with a hardie use a brass hammer. and 2. NEVER hit cold metal with a forging hammer. Have a "cold" hammer hanging near your vice or close to your work area. That way you will spend more time forging and less time re-dressing your hardies and hammers! Peyton

Quote: yesteryearforge "Maybe im guilty of teaching bad habits or if not bad habits perhaps useless habits, but I use different hammers for different uses.
Such as
I use a brass hammer to cut off with and to hit the chop fuller with which pretty much eliminates any damage to either.
I have what I refer to as cold hammers that I hit punches , chisels , and cold metal with.
I use a wooden mallet for straightening spirals and twist if they get out of shape
I go to the trouble to dress the faces of my hammers very nice and want to keep them that way.
Besides I have a plethora of hammers.
Most smiths that I know have a lot of hammers , and whats the point of aquiring multiple hammers if you intend to use only one hammer for everything.
I take efforts to keep from marring up the face of my anvil and think it only reasonable to do the same with my hammers".
MIKE-T, end of Quote:
I also just use a 2" x 4" to bring a finished piece of stock back into shape so I will not mar the surface with unwanted impact marks, just like Glenn. I also kinda like the burned pine smell, if ya know what I mean?
If you do Repousse, watch out if you don

[yesteryearforge]

Ted
I use wooden hammers / lead hammers and rawhide hammers to straighten or bend things that I dont want to mess up the finish or forge work on. Those and boards instead of my anvil.

Mike Tanner

[arftist]

When I use a hardy hot cut, I quench the work after I cut most of the way through, and then it just snaps off, in the pritchel hole or over the side of the anvil

[KYBOY]

When I hot cut I usaly go most of the way thru on all sides then snap it of. I cast a lot of sinkers and have a large electric smelting pot. I also have about 300 pounds of lead Ive planned on making a lead hammer for months. I just havent got around to it yet:rolleyes:

[Glenn]

When I use a hardy hot cut, I quench the work after I cut most of the way through

You do realize that this hardens the metal by quenching it. If you use this piece of metal later, will you remember that the end was hardened?

[arftist]

Yes Glenn I do realize this. A few points though, if you don't mind. After being being hammered most of the way through on a hardy cutter, with a hammer, the steel is no where near critical temp, and does not get that hard. Second point, at .2% carbon, mild steel doesn't get very hard anyway. Third point, Most of the stock that comes out of the forge goes back in again anyway, where it is normalized or anealed depending on what happens to it next. Forth, if I am drilling a piece of steel and it doesn't go right, I usualy know pretty fast. Fifth, I do most of my cutting by other means. I do keep track of spring, tool or other hard steel and aneal them before machining anyway. Finaly, try it sometime, it is much faster and easier.

[ThomasPowers]

Note most of the steel smiths are using these days is not 1020 but rather A36 which can have a very varried carbon content. Getting a spec'd 1020 is expensive.

Most steel sales sell you A36 as "mild steel" which is just not right.

[Glenn]

1)After being being hammered most of the way through on a hardy cutter, with a hammer, the steel is no where near critical temp, and does not get that hard.

2)Second point, at .2% carbon, mild steel doesn't get very hard anyway.

3)Third point, Most of the stock that comes out of the forge goes back in again anyway, where it is normalized or anealed depending on what happens to it next.

4)Forth, if I am drilling a piece of steel and it doesn't go right, I usually know pretty fast.

5)Fifth, I do most of my cutting by other means. I do keep track of spring, tool or other hard steel and anneal them before machining anyway. finally, try it sometime, it is much faster and easier.

1) Not always, I sometimes do not wait for it to cool that far down the temp scale.

2) Take a piece of *mild steel* and make a chisel. Harden then temper to a cutting tool. Now use the chisel to cut the parent stock.

3) I place hot steel on a forge table to cool. This table is beside the forge and I can protect the steel from being grabbed by others. The steel that goes to the work table is ALWAYS placed into water and then transferred to my bare hand and only then placed on the work (public access) table. This way there are no surprises and no one gets burned. There are times when it goes into the water still quite hot and some quenching may occur, but it is usually a finished piece with no additional work being done.

4) been there, did that.

5) I will, thanks for the input and the idea.

[ThomasPowers]

#2 is how I learned about A36. Rob Gunter demo'd that at Quadstate: taking a bar and cutting a piece off it and making it into a chisel then heat treated it using super quench and used to cut the original bar *cold* with no problem---I still have the piece in my "that's interesting" pile