Beginner blacksmith looking for a decently priced anvil in Florida

[NCHammer]

I started blacksmithing this summer and I’ve loved it. I started out with a 15lb cast iron from harbor freight, which was right for to me to start out to see if I really wanted to do this. And a since then I’ve bought a a single propane burner forge and I am ready to really try this. Im looking to buy a legitimate anvil and I’m willing to spend up to $400 I’ve been looking at some websites like centaur forgeanf anvil brand, which sell decently priced 70lb anvils but they are farriers anvils. There’s also one amazon that weighs 66lb and costs $160 but it is a cast steel face and the rest of it is cast iron. I’d love to get one that’s 100lb but can’t seem to find any old ones. I live in Miami but I’ll be driving up to gainesville in a few weeks and am hoping to come home with an old anvil. I’m willing to drive a couple hours out of the way, if the anvil is not on the way to Gainesville. Anyone have any pointers or know what I should do?

PS I’m looking to pretty much any kind of blacksmithin, from knives, swords, and axes to ornamental stuff

[Glenn]

Have you looked at A collection of improvised anvils?  I know you said a real anvil but these may be in your back yard.

Have you tried TPAAAT? It may take a while but it works.

Have you looked into any blacksmith gatherings in your area or in Gainesville? Hammer ins are where blacksmith and tools get together.  FABA Annual Conference is Oct 27 – 28, 2018.

[NCHammer]

I'll only be up north for one weekend in November so I won't be able to make the FABA Conference. I really would prefer to have to get something that I wouldn't really want to replace for several years, but I have considered some other Improvised anvils. The easiest thing for me to get would be be a large structural steel I beam., though I'm not sure how well of an anvil that would make. Would you recommend the anvil with a cast iron body and a cast steel face? Like I said I'm looking for something that I can be using for he next 5 years.  

[ThomasPowers]

Which would be one of the worst possible things to use as an anvil!   You want solid steel all the way down from your hammer to the stump. I beam just doesn't provide that and it's LOUD and fairly soft.

[NCHammer]

Noted, so which anvil would you recommend?

[ThomasPowers]

http://www.marco-borromei.com/fork.html 

or 

[Irondragon Forge ClayWorks]

From a scrap yard, 110 lb for $35 U.S. bulldozers are anvils on tracks.

[NCHammer]

Thanks for the responses but I think I might go for a new anvil. I am currently looking at these, and would really appreciate some insight on them. 

NC 70 lb. Standard Anvil

 

NC 70 lb. Short Sugar Anvil

 

NC 70 lbs.Knifemater Anvil

 

Cliff Carroll 70 lb. Anvil

If you have any other suggestions, I'd love to here them. 

[kjbarth]

A couple other options for new anvils is Holland Anvil (I have a 190lb and swage block) and Hoffmann Forge (Jymm Hoffmann).  Both make anvils out of H13.

[NCHammer]

Those are a little out of my price range. One question I had about those other anvils is if there is a benefit to having the hardy on the back of the anvil or at the begin being if the horn?

[stevomiller]

NC, here’s something to think about.

Every anvil shown, even the one called a Knife Maker, is designed specifically with feature to work horseshoes. Of course they work for just about anything else, but they are optimized for that use, and also portability since most shoers travel with their tools to the horse owners. They are made of cast and hardened ductile iron, which is good, but perhaps not as good as cast steel (a good ductile iron anvil properly cast and hardened is better than an improperly cast and hardened steel anvil.) If both are manufactured to equal relative quality steel is better.

The sweet spot on those anvils (most efficient area to move metal) makes up perhaps 1/3 of the mass of those anvils, so about 25lbs. 

Thats about the same as a 4x4x5 block of steel.

Folks have been gently guiding you away from spending your money on these towards much cheaper options so yo can get started. Until your skill is sufficient to make your own: Do you have multiple types of tongs already? A couple different sizes of chisels and punches? Some good files? Heavy duty wire brush for removing scale? A good vise?

All of those items are almost a necessity, a “traditional” shaped anvil IS NOT.  Not saying don’t buy one of the ones you’ve shown, but I am saying think of where you spend your money, and at what point in your smithing journey. Maybe Save up and get what you said you really wanted, a 100lbs or larger anvil, whether used or new.  

[NCHammer]

You have an excellent point and one that I hadn't thought about before. I don't have tons of money to spend on this and would really like  a decent setup. I found this anvil on amazon, it weighs 66 lb and costs $150.It has a cast steel face and a cast iron body, would you recommend this over the ductile iron anvils.  It is a little lighter than I wanted but it would mean I have more money to spend on those things you mentioned.

[Glenn]

Do you NEED an London pattern anvil, or double horn anvil for what you want to do? 

[ThomasPowers]

There you go making value judgements without any knowledge about the subject.  A decent set up would be a 150# block of steel---perhaps a used die from a stamping plant; much more decent that a light farriers anvil of ductile iron.

Please watch the swordsmithing section of National Geographics "Living Treasures of Japan"---can be found on youtube and pay attention to the anvil they are using.  A renowned Master of the sword forging art able to get whatever he wants to use  and he chooses NOT to use a London pattern anvil.

I still think that trying to duplicate this would server you well for many years getting started: http://marco-borromei.com/fork.html

[Marc1]

When folks ask about their new anvil, sensible advice comes in the form of improvised anvils of different descriptions.

Usable? Sure. Desirable? Not for a minute. I for one, wouldn't bother working on a forklift thine to make a nail. But, conceded, that is just me.

$400 will get you a decent anvil if you look diligently in the second hand market, and not necessarily online, in fact better not online.

And it will get you a nice new farrier's anvil.  

Then you will need everything else and most likely the good part of another $1,000 just for starters. Then you will most likely end up spending another $10,000 in the next XX years.

 The good thing is that you will be buying tools as you need them, and as you can afford them. It is the process everyone goes through when building their workshop. There is a special satisfaction in the hunt for a particular tool, then the question "which one is the best " etc. 

My suggestion is to buy a anvil, whatever you can find, and get busy working on it. It will not be the best, it will perhaps not even be suitable, and you will buy 3 or 4 more after that one and none will be ideal nor perfect. Make sure your satisfaction comes from your work not from your anvil, make nice stuff you are proud of and eventually you will be a blacksmith

 

[FlatLiner]

Use the

That is how I found a 125 lb sodofors for $100. Is a little banged up but rings like a bell with a 90 percent rebound.

[stevomiller]

NCHammer,

Really there is no right or wrong way to approach what you want to do - unless you wanted to buy another cast iron ASO at a true anvil price. 

If I was you, which I’m not, I’d do my best to envision what I really honestly thought id be making and working on for the next couple years. If it’s smaller artistic items, knives, and I just had to have a typical shaped single or double horn anvil NOW, with your budget, and I needed a known quality brand, then out of what you posted I’d prefer he NC Knifemaker, the heel is a little thicker, or the Cliff Carroll. 

Kanca has a forged steel double anvil in the same weight class that would be about $100 more shipped, it’s a known maker and sold thru smithing outlets. Again still lighter weight than most shop anvils but a material and shape I would prefer, but it’s pretty much a preference.

As for the anvil you showed last, I have the same one bought off of EBay, I’m happy with it. It was worth $140shipped. Picture and info click HERE . It does NOT appear to a composite cast steel/cast iron, it is all steel. Another person on either this site or Bladesmithsforum has one, we’ve both posted about them. For what I paid it’s great for a light blacksmith pattern anvil. However, they’re made in China and sold by multiple non-smithing retailers. If you get a dud, you might be on your own and out your money. I didn’t mind gambling, again that’s ME and I have other bigger anvils already. One good thing if you did get one that wasn’t quite as hard as ideal, but was a decent casting you still have the horn and hardy hole to use.

Consider if you need a horn for your work, or might a separate cone/bick etc work for what you imagine you will work on.

And as TP mentions, if you landed a big hardened mold or die block cheap, it would be really tough to beat for bladesmithing. A block anvil is what Japanese swordmakersand cutlers did and do use. Check out the fellow that makes GS Tongs and tools, he does very nice work using block anvils and variations there of.

Marc1 gives good advice about not necessarily using online sources to locate a used anvil, word of mouth and networking etc will more likely find you one that isn’t crazily priced.

[NCHammer]

Thanks for all the great advice, I think what I’m going to do is go with the cheap acciaio anvil. It’s fits my situation well because I would have to move the anvil before and after each use so the light weight will actually help make that easier. And looking for an ASO or an old anvil will take up time, time that I can use for forging. I usually don’t get more than a couple hours of free time a week, if that.  

[MC Hammer]

Wow, you are one letter off from my avatar name   I guess there's room for 2 hammers here.  

It seems you have $400 burning a hole in your pocket NC   Why are you in such a rush?  It takes a lot of time to find a decent used anvil, but it is time well invested especially since it's just a hobby.  Think about how much time you'd take looking over new cell phone options or a new car.  It took me over a year to find my first anvil and I only paid $300 for it.  It weighs 179 lbs and will likely be my main shop anvil for life.  I had an ASO to forge on while I looked for a good anvil.  You could follow Thomas' suggestion and find a scrap piece to use until you find a good used anvil.  It's not instant gratification in the sense that online you click a few buttons, give them your credit card number and it's on it's way, but you pay for that convenience in the sense that you might not get a quality anvil or it weighs too little.  If finding anvils was easy, everyone would have one and they would be trying to pay you to come get them out of their way.  

One thing that concerns me NC is that you seem rushed to get into forging.  Blacksmithing skills take time to learn, so even if you can press the fast forward button acquiring your anvil you will have to slow down and still learn the skills required to make things like blades if blades are your goal.  I'm not trying to burst your bubble, but you will need to make a lot of other lesser cool things before you can competently make a blade or axe (or at least a proper one).  Take your time in all aspects of this craft.  Some of the best blacksmiths I've seen work are the ones with 30 years of smithing that seem to never be in a hurry and glide efficiently from forge to anvil and make things so effortlessly (or so it seems).  

[stevomiller]

NC, did you get your $142 shipped anvil yet? Curious when you do if the quality will be the same level as mine and Jeremy’s. Another poster on the other board, who’s never forged before, recently got his, seems to be happy with it. They have their limitations as all light anvils do (especially ones that aren’t a block or post type), but they’re shaping up to be a nice starting point for new smiths doing light work that want an anvil NOW. The money saved by getting one of thes vs say an NC etc will buy a lot of tools or fuel for those smiths.

[NCHammer]

It arrived a while ago but I haven’t had the chance to use it yet, it arrived in good shape, rings well, and the hardy hole seems to be pretty much square

[Frosty]

You expect US to believe it without posting a picture? 

Frosty The Lucky.

[NCHammer]

Ill share my setup now that I have the anvil. I’m planning on making an anvil base made of 4x4s within the next day or two before I start using the anvil

[stevomiller]

Congrats, I hope yours is as nice as Jeremy and mine! Too bad the online auction house isn’t selling the 110lb and 165lb version for equal price per pound.

Is your hardy hole 3/4””? Mine is, I’m assuming same maker but the Chinese copy everything, including themselves. I had to knock some slag and sand out of mine, not bad, but when done the square was nice and true and the solid wall material was smooth enough.

Did you try either a small hammer rebound or the bearing drop test? Curious how yours turned out.

You might want to CAREFULLY us a flap disc and put a radius on part of the edges, or at least break them, I cleaned the vertical right next to the edge as well so it was pretty straight and any minor glitches or hollows were reduced so the edge would be more robust.

Have fun be safe

[NCHammer]

Yes, the hardy hole is 3/4” and it also has some junk I gotta clean out of it, but beside that is looks pretty good. I haven’t done a ball bearing test but I did test it with a couple light blows with my 3lb cross pein hammer. The rebound is pretty good, but not as good as some videos I’ve seen. The ring after the impact is not sustained for very long. But I assume that has something to do with the table it’s on. I’m guessing doesn’t allow the anvil perform as it should, not having solid mass all the way to the floor