ThomasPowers Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 This ++ especially for the eyes and ears! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 Oh YES! I have poly carb trifocals with side shields are my daily glasses. I have SWEET radio or audio jack muffs. Howard Leight, by Honeywell Synchs. I selected these heavy head squeezers based on good reviews on Iforge in a hearing protection thread. Heck, had I been wearing them when the tree hit me I might not have been injured as badly, they are also impact protection but you have to get whatever to hit you either on the ear or the springy head band. The main dent in my skull is directly under the head band and it's 1.5" wide solid padded spring steel. Good radio reception too and have awesome audio reproduction, best head phones I own. Now if they were a bit ore comfy I'd listen to the TV on them all the time. They're high on my list of GOOD $50.00 spent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLAG Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 There is a common misconception that has cost numerous lives. Leather makes a poor bullet resistant material. Some people make the mistake of testing bullet "proof" vests with a knife thrust and some wearers have died. The vests are NOT knife proof. Leather is not bullet proof. It is useless for stopping bullets. But leather IS knife resistant. The reason why is that the leather is composed of a tangled mat of strands. These divert the thrust of a blade and that tends to urge the blade tip sideways. The Kevlar (& other polymer) fabric forms a regular weave that is great for catching the blunt head of a bullet and that imparts a lateral deflecting force to the bullet tending to pull it sideways. The fabric also absorbs some of the impact over a wider surface. It is like a tennis ball thrown against a taut tethered sheet. You can see the deformation of the of the cloth around the point of impact. Leather is stiffer and does deform very much. Which allows a bullet to punch through. Leather has been used for protection against arrows for millennia. Alexander the great's forces used leather vests for that purpose. And it was used much earlier than that. The Japanese discovered that loose floppy fabric does deflect arrows. The fabric does have a regular weave but the side-ways motion helps to deflect the arrow heads! Talk about counterintuitive facts. The moral of this long-winded discussion is, Leather is NOT good for stopping bullets. It DOES help against knives and arrows. Regards, to all, SLAG. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 Buff Coats anyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 Buff Coats anyone? I'm afraid someone needs to explain "figure of speech" to Slag, I'll have to get in touch with Marge. I"ll even give the gang a break and not tell the story about my ex, State Trooper boss, his bullet proof vest, my hunting bow and betting a paycheck. I also need to talk to Deb about framing and subject but she was having too much fun with the drag you along behind it brush hog and I don't know how to get my stupid software to crop a pic. Anyway below are a couple pics of my apron. The guy who made it didn't make the strap as long as I asked for and the darned thing has shrunk since. Go figure! If it were a little longer the apron could hang lower but in the pics it's covering to my throat. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 Buff Coats anyone? I do NOT recommend smithing in the buff! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 Much too heavy leather unless you are an ECW revenant... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4elements Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 I want one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 But PJs are OK with an apron. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaughnT Posted October 5, 2017 Author Share Posted October 5, 2017 ... a couple pics of my apron... That's a nice apron, Frosty. I was thinking about a long pocket like that for a ruler, but wasn't sure how practical or useful I'd find it. Have you found that you use the ruler a lot since it's there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 I'd use the scale pocket more if the guy who made it hadn't made it almost exactly the size of a ruler so one won't slip in easily. He did the same with the pencil pockets, pencils fit tightly. If you have one made specify sizes and such more carefully than I did, I left too much up to the maker's judgement. I think he was used to making knife sheathes and made everything tight. The breast pocket I have the cell phone in was for my smokes and lighter, he got that one right of course. Like I said, I've had two 9" grinding disks break and taken pieces in the chest in that apron without a bruise. It's heavy but the shoulder straps don't carry the weight it's carried on my waist the shoulder straps keep it close but not tight. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaughnT Posted February 16, 2018 Author Share Posted February 16, 2018 Well, after much back and forth, the Three Rivers Forging Apron is officially underway. I'll have to mail him my current apron so he can get all the measurements from it, and I'll miss her more than you'll know. But, the upside is that I'll have a far better apron delivered to my door in just a few weeks and he might actually keep the pattern on hand if anyone else wants one. At $300 or so, I don't see a lot of people chomping at the bit to buy one, but that's okay. It's there if anyone decides to give it a go. The key points will be proper reinforcement wherever there's something that normally breaks or wears out on the aprons already on the market. I've never used a split-leg apron and I'm not keen to try one now. My anvil is high enough that holding the tongs between my legs is a no-go at this station. My current apron is solid and has worked well when I'm at the anvil or sitting down to do some welding, etc. I wouldn't mind trying a split leg design just to see what it might be like, but not when I'm spending three bills on a design. Better stick to what I know, right? The straps, I'm pretty sure, will be 1" cotton/poly webbing because I like how they feel on my Tilman apron. The material is light and breathable, and doesn't rot through with all your sweat and grime. Even using oil-tan leather, I'm not sure how long leather straps would last since I seem to have a very caustic sweat that eats copper rivets. Something that'll dry out or need constant cleaning.... ugh. After two years of service, my Tilman apron is dying at the leather, not the nylon straps. Can I expect better from a quality leather strap? I really don't have that much confidence in the stuff and don't want to always be scrubbing the things with soapy water. Anyhow, fun times ahead and I'm kind of excited. It'll be a good way to start the year! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLAG Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 I suggest the you periodically coat the copper rivets with nail polish ( = nail varnish for all the G.B. smiths). That should slow or stop any corrosion. SLAG. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaughnT Posted February 16, 2018 Author Share Posted February 16, 2018 1 hour ago, SLAG said: I suggest the you periodically coat the copper rivets... On the new apron, I'm going to spec something other than copper. I'd almost prefer no rivets since they seem to corrode yet don't really provide "support" that's above and beyond what good quality stitching does. Even my Tilman apron, cheap as it is, shows no wear on the stitching. The leather gave way. The rivets died a miserable death. But the stitching is as good now as it was when brand new. Leave me wondering if riveting isn't one of those things people do because they think it'll help... but it's more psychosomatic than anything else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaughnT Posted March 7, 2018 Author Share Posted March 7, 2018 Got the leather sorted out, as well as the hardware. I'm calling this Dragon Hide and it'll go great with the Dragon Fangs I sometimes clean up for public display. The guy who is making the apron says this is about 7-ounce leather and still very soft and flexible. I sent him my old apron so he could use it for a pattern, so he knows what I was using and how much I liked it. This apron, though, promises to be mucho better. No expense has been spared and I fully expect this apron will last me the rest of my days if I show it a modicum of care. Stay tuned, folks. This is going to be fun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc1 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 Hi Vaughn, I hope I am not intruding in your affairs, but for the little I know about leather, those dimples printed on leather are a sign that it is bonded leather and not real leather. I knew a guy who used to produce tons of the stuff, made from leather offcuts, blended into a paste, mixed with glue and rolled out in big industrial size sheets. The printing of pattern on the surface is to hide all imperfections. Then again I hope I am wrong. Check out how to tell the difference between bonded or reconstituted leather and real leather. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaughnT Posted March 7, 2018 Author Share Posted March 7, 2018 5 hours ago, Marc1 said: Hi Vaughn, I hope I am not intruding in your affairs, but for the little I know about leather, those dimples printed on leather are a sign that it is bonded leather and not real leather. Marc, thanks for looking out for me! I appreciate the warning and will be sure to address your concerns with the gent doing the work. I really don't think he'd try to hornswoggle me over the matter since it'll be his name bandied about on the internet when I get it in hand. That, and he's already got something of a reputation for quality saddles and such. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 Okay, couple of things about textured leather. First, Marc1 is quite correct that there is such a thing as reconstituted leather (what he describes his friend making). Sometimes it has a pebbled finish, sometimes smooth, sometimes embossed with an alligator or ostrich pattern, whatever. Depends on what the customer wants. There is also "corrected" leather, which is sanded smooth and pressed between rollers to remove any imperfections. These also have a glossy finish added to provide evenness and shine. "Naked" leathers, on the other hand, do not have a finish other than the tanning and dying process itself (other than a light waxing, in some cases). You can tell the difference between a finished leather and a naked leather by putting a droplet of water on the surface: it will bead up on corrected and reconstituted leather, but will soak in a bit on naked leather, leaving a damp spot. Now, with naked leathers, hides come either smooth or pebbled. The pebbled finish (as shown in VaughnT's photo above) IS a natural effect, and comes from tumble-drying the leather as the final stage of the tanning process. This allows it to shrink slightly, which emphasizes the natural pattern of pores and fine wrinkles. Smooth naked leather, on the other hand, is hung up to dry, often with weights clipped to the bottom edges. This pulls it just tight enough to give a nice, smooth finish. TL;DR: check with your guy, but you're probably okay. (FWIW, the above is stuff I learned from my days selling high-quality upholstery -- both leather and fabric -- at a furniture store in NYC. The boss was very big on extensive product knowledge.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 Don't forget the oil tanned leathers that will bead a drop too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc1 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 I don't think that tumble drying leather would make those raised dimples shown in his photo, but I must qualify my comments as not an expert. As far as i know reconstituted leather is not a bad product and many work boots are made with it. Of course good quality leather could be textured between two rollers to give that appearance of snake or crocodile skin. Anyway, the main thing is that you are happy with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaughnT Posted March 8, 2018 Author Share Posted March 8, 2018 I'm sure that it'll be a good apron as far as smithing aprons go. My only worry is the suppleness and how it rolls and bends with the body. Nothing worse than getting the edge of the bib jammed up under your nose or chin when you sit down! Of course, the downside to a high-end apron will be trying to keep all the fans out of my shop so I can get some work done. Being awesome is one thing, but I don't want to drive the ladies wild by going overboard on the awesomeness. I've no interest in taking Elvis' crown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaughnT Posted March 14, 2018 Author Share Posted March 14, 2018 All finished and ready for work. The grommets make it really easy to get the apron on and off, but also help relieve the stresses put on the side tie-in points as you're moving around. There's nothing as nice as cross-back straps to carry the weight of the heavy leather. Giovanni (the apron maker modeling in the pics) has a long history of working in equestrian circles, so he knows straps and buckles! Reinforced everywhere, the apron won't fail before I fail. Maybe I'll leave instructions that I'm to be buried in the thing! The texture of the Dragon Hide leather is perfect. A custom apron isn't cheap, that's for sure. But if you factor the cost over the life of the apron, it's no more expensive than buying a cheap hardware store apron every couple years as they wear out. The difference that the custom apron looks fantastic and any customers who see you in it will recognize that you take your trade seriously. I'm a happy blacksmith. A poorer blacksmith, but definitely happy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted March 14, 2018 Share Posted March 14, 2018 Very nice. I like the cross back straps. I don't think I'd want it so long but hey, that's just my prefference and its your apron. enjoy wearing it in and not out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaughnT Posted March 14, 2018 Author Share Posted March 14, 2018 Thank you. When I bought my old apron, I opted for their 48" style figuring I could always cut off the excess I didn't like rather than finding myself stuck with something that was too short. Turns out, it was a really handy length. Not only was it long enough to go over my belly, but several times it stopped a piece of oh-so-hot steel from catching up on my boot! Dropped steel a few times, and each time it slid down the apron and onto the floor rather than snagging on a boot lace or whatnot. Since I work in shorts most of the time, it's very easy for hot scale or steel to catch on the top of the tongue and start burning in if the boots aren't covered up. When Giovanni asked me about length, I was real quick to ask for the same thing that'd saved me a burn or three. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted March 14, 2018 Share Posted March 14, 2018 Yeah a handy size if forging in shorts. I only forge in long pants and make sure my pant legs cover my boot tops. I have on the other hand burned my boot laces at the base a few times. I'm still using a cheaper black suede like apron I picked up off amazon. I love the way it fits me and the leather but they really skimped on the neck and waist straps. I've since replaced the waist strap with an old belt and have a piece of leather for the neck strap but you really have me thinking of trying to make a cross strap for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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