First post, first forge. Need help!

[GrizzlyAdamz12]

Hi guys, I'm new to the site. This is my first post. I'm very interested in making my first forge. I've watched a few videos. The one that intrigues me most is this one https://youtu.be/vQN7EqGMTuo. I was told that the refractory material he used for the insulation wasn't very good as the sodium silicates melting point is around 1900 degrees, any ideas on stuff that I should be able to pick up at a local hardware store? There is also a Menards close by so I can go there as well. Any ideas on the burner that he made as well? I can get most of the parts for it, just not sure where he got the adapter from for the blowtorch valve to thread on to the hose that runs in to the 20lb tank. I would like to keep the forge fairly simple and fairly light on the wallet as this will not be a full time gig for me like I'm sure it is for a lot of you guys. Thanks in advanced.

GrizzlyAdamz

[ThomasPowers]

Remember saving $20 on building a forge only to spend an extra $200 to run it is false economy!

Have you read through Wayne Coe's site on forge building?

Note that not telling us how you plan to use the forge makes it a bit like us asking you; "Should I buy a dumptruck or a 15 passenger van?"  Without telling you if we need to haul coal or haul people!

[GrizzlyAdamz12]

13 minutes ago, ThomasPowers said:

Remember saving $20 on building a forge only to spend an extra $200 to run it is false economy!

Have you read through Wayne Coe's site on forge building?

Note that not telling us how you plan to use the forge makes it a bit like us asking you; "Should I buy a dumptruck or a 15 passenger van?"  Without telling you if we need to haul coal or haul people!

I'll just be using it sometimes in the evenings and on the weekends every now and again to "try" and make knives! I'd like something cheap and simple to stick my toes in the water without spending a lot of money.

[ThomasPowers]

Solid fuel forges burning charcoal can be free save for time.

Knifemaking need some skills before you start; it's sort of like you saying you want to drive in Formula One races but have never driven a car, how do you start racing on the cheap?

There has been a couple of shows on TV lately about forging blades; but some of the folks on them have been doing it for *decades*.  I taught one fellow that was on there back in the early 1990's...

You might like to watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxLpbgT3HFg

to see how much can be done with so little but experience and skills

[GrizzlyAdamz12]

Great video, I've got a basic knowledge of knife making. Would just like to get an idea of what I could do to make the insulation material a little better on the forge in the video I originally posted. I don't have a ton of garage or driveway space, hence why I would like to build a forge around the size in the video.

[Buzzkill]

I started out more or less the way you are.  I wanted to build it myself from easily available local sources.  I did have what I'll call limited success making my own refractory mix and my first forge.  A couple years and a couple forges later I can tell you that for me at least it's better to buy the materials that are designed to handle the conditions in a forge than it is to try to make that material out of things that aren't really well suited to the task.  For a small forge (and most of us want to start way bigger than needed) the cost of ceramic fiber blanket and proper refractory material for a lining is fairly reasonable.  The gas forge section is one of the most active on this forum.  Grab some snacks, a cold beverage, and a comfy chair and spend a few hours reading through that section.  Frosty's T burner topic and Forges 101 would be good places to start.

As Thomas indicated, Wayne Coe has good instructions on building a propane forge as well.

 

[GrizzlyAdamz12]

What do you consider proper refractory material? Would like to build one the size of the stainless steel trash can in the video. Just not sure what to insulate it with. Could you point me in the direction to Wayne Coe's instructions? 

[Buzzkill]

You'll find a lot of that information in the various gas forge building topics on the forum, but lately it seems the general consensus is high alumina insulating refractories, such as the  Kast-O-Lite brand are preferred.

[JME1149]

Google Wayne Coe, should be the first thing that pops up

[C-1ToolSteel]

I strongly suggest The $50 Knife Shop book if you haven't read it yet.

[Dylan Sawicki]

I second that. that's the book that got me hooked on bladesmithing/blacksmithing. Very good book

2 minutes ago, C-1ToolSteel said:

I strongly suggest The $50 Knife Shop book if you haven't read it yet.

 

[GrizzlyAdamz12]

Thanks Buzzkill, I'll look into that. I've got the Backyard Blacksmith book that I have read. Is the $50 Knife Shop book better?

[Buzzkill]

"Better" is a matter of opinion.  I'd say both are good and worth reading. Ms. Sims doesn't focus on bladesmithing though, and if that's your goal then reading material specific to your interests can't be bad.  We can also recommend all the books written by Jim Hrisoulas and Steve Sells, both are members here.

[Frosty]

Welcome aboard Grizz, glad to have you. If you do some reading in the gas forge section here you'll find a number of much better forge designs. The video you linked has good enough construction practices but there are better materials to use.

Providing more details in your questions makes it a lot easier to provide good answers and this is where reading up a little first comes in handy.

Good thing I'm so wordy Buzzkill's post said what I was starting to ramble about in a much more clear way so I deleted a bunch of unneeded wordage.

A small knife forge like the one in the video is a decent choice though It's going to end up on a shelf or somewhere else gathering dust after you figure out what you really need. I think most everybody here has at least one forge gathering dust, I have several and am in the process of retiring my shop forge.

The current good balance of propane forge construction is two layers of 1" 8lb. "ceramic blanket insulating refractory" as the outer liner. 1/2" of high alumina castable hard refractory layer as the flame face. Followed by an IR reflective or reradiating Kiln Wash. these are all pretty well covered in the gas forge section here. forges 101 being a Star thread on the subject.

http://www.waynecoeartistblacksmith.com/

Will take you to Wayne's web page there's a menu on the left.

Frosty The Lucky.

[JHCC]

2 minutes ago, GrizzlyAdamz12 said:

Thanks Buzzkill, I'll look into that. I've got the Backyard Blacksmith book that I have read. Is the $50 Knife Shop book better?

The Backyard Blacksmith focuses on basic skills and general smithing; $50 Knife Shop is specifically about making blades. Which is "better" depends on the kind of work you want to do. Frankly, if you're planning on forging blades, a good background in general smithing (that is, knowing how to move metal with a hammer) can be extremely useful.

[GrizzlyAdamz12]

Thanks for the kind replies! I'll do a little more research on everything. I've pretty much got everything I need to start besides the forge.

[JHCC]

3 minutes ago, GrizzlyAdamz12 said:

I've pretty much got everything I need to start besides the forge.

If you're looking to save money and you're okay with solid fuel rather than gas, it's hard to get more affordable than a JABOD forge. 

[GrizzlyAdamz12]

I don't have a ton of space, so a smaller gas forge would be ideal for me.

[Mikey98118]

"Smaller costs less"; but that must be balanced with too small, as Frosty mentioned, quickly ends up collecting dust in a corner by most builders.  Numerous people have found the two-gallon forge from a non-refillable Freon or helium cylinder, or a half  muffler from a car seems to be made for cutting construction costs to the bone, starting with one of these three choices of free shell. The balance is that you will never stop using the forge, even if you make a second larger one.

Next; not everything you wish on, or in, a forge must be purchased in its beginning. Silica rigidizer can be had cheaply, so that you can wait a little while before adding a seal coat to the ceramic blanket insulation; this is available in smaller amounts, which are still large enough for a two-gallon forge. The burner port allows you to make a simpler more economical burner at the beginning; giving you plenty of time before dropping money on tools to make an advanced burner, which you may never need.