Dustin Quade Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 I had just finished making my first punch and decided i wanted to put it to some use. I have a ton of spikes in my shop and i also have some small pieces of scrap damascus from various knife projects and while i have seen this project before it is the first time i have attempted such a thing. This project marked alot of firsts for me. I made my first punch, used that to punch my first hole in material, used a drift for the first time to shape the hole how i wanted and my first forge weld of high carbon to low carbon steel. The forge weld was the real trick for me here. I did a forge welding seminar with my local group this summer and was like one of only 2 people who brought out a propane forge for the job. Everyone acted like i had lost my mind and like forge welding in a propane forge like mine was next to impossible and ever since i have had this worry in the back of my mind that no matter what my worge welds would not work. But this one was very successful. I used the head of the spike to hold the damascus bit instead of upsetting the the pointed end of the spike. Im really happy with how this has come out so far although i still have some work to do on it including the handle obviously. I will post some final images once i get it all done but i just love how it looks when its etched so you can see the different materials. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Cochran Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 That's a cool way to go about doing that. I can honestly say if it's been done before, I've never seen it but I do like it. Still seeing the spike head really makes it obvious what you used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustin Quade Posted January 3, 2017 Author Share Posted January 3, 2017 12 minutes ago, Michael Cochran said: That's a cool way to go about doing that. I can honestly say if it's been done before, I've never seen it but I do like it. Still seeing the spike head really makes it obvious what you used. Thanks, the truth of it is that leaving the RR Spike head also just makes for a more practical tool in the end because it gives you a hammering surface to the tool. But that said, I do like the fantasy look that a nice big spike gives to the piece and the fact of the matter is I just really dont like upsetting, im not good at it and for this exercise the forge welding was honestly the main skill i wanted to test. I might try another with an upset face at some point. This was fun and good practice at alot of things, adding upsetting to the list of skills used in this project makes it even better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Is that stress cracking around the eye? If so I'd be a little concerned about breakage in use. I like the idea. not bad for a first punched hole. The more you punch the more you get to know how the metal reacts and moves. You might have had the metal a little too cool while drifting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latticino Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 You beat me to the punch on that design for a spike hawk. I had planned on doing something similar, but with a bit of a change in the "behind the eye" area. Hopefully I'll get one done and will be able to post it. Consider use of a slot punch to make the original hole in the spike to minimize the loss of material. I think you still may have to upset it some to add mass to the eye. Great effort for an early forge weld. Did you get the Damascus billet elsewhere? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Funny thing a lot of the big name knifemakers only use propane forges for forge welding. If you have it designed and set up properly no problem! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustin Quade Posted January 3, 2017 Author Share Posted January 3, 2017 47 minutes ago, Daswulf said: Is that stress cracking around the eye? If so I'd be a little concerned about breakage in use. I like the idea. not bad for a first punched hole. The more you punch the more you get to know how the metal reacts and moves. You might have had the metal a little too cool while drifting. Yea i was worried about that as well. Most of the marks on the side dont travel to the top like as it rounds the corner and the ones that do dont make it all the way accross so im hoping it is not as bad as it looks, Im going to try to grind away at it and hope the problem solves itself . I wasnt going to sell this piece anyways simply keep it around as an example but i will try to be more mindful of the heat while drifting in the future. I mean it looked right whie i was doing it and tried to get the piece off while it was still a good red but maybe i should have stopped around orange? 35 minutes ago, Latticino said: You beat me to the punch on that design for a spike hawk. I had planned on doing something similar, but with a bit of a change in the "behind the eye" area. Hopefully I'll get one done and will be able to post it. Consider use of a slot punch to make the original hole in the spike to minimize the loss of material. I think you still may have to upset it some to add mass to the eye. Great effort for an early forge weld. Did you get the Damascus billet elsewhere? Thanks for the suggestions. I will try to impliment some of them in my future attempts especially the upsetting to gain some mass for they eye. I honestly had not even considdered that. I got a giant stack of damascus from a local guy getting out of the trade and i have been slowly working through it. It was cheaper to buy the damascus than it was for me to buy regular 01 from the metal supermaket. The piece i used here was a leftover piece from a few wedding bands i made earlier this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 I hope it works out for you. It looks like a cool hawk. You'll make more . Couldn't hurt to practice punching and drifting a bit so the next ones turn out better, thicker, and stronger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustin Quade Posted January 6, 2017 Author Share Posted January 6, 2017 Ok so i got it all cleaned up and mounted on the handle. Most of those ugly cracks on the side dissappeared after a bit of grinding so i guess it was just surface stuff. Really happy with how it looks though. What i need to do is get some practice attaching handles to things though. I replaced 2 hammer handles but they are grabage and need to be replaces again because the head is too loose and the wedges have flown out the top while i was working with them. This axe here fits amazing on top but it got a tiny split in the side from driving in the wedge. But i guess practice makes perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C-1ToolSteel Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 Looks like it cleaned up nicely. I'm a little worried about that crack where the head meets the shank though. Can you tell how far it goes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustin Quade Posted January 6, 2017 Author Share Posted January 6, 2017 7 minutes ago, C-1ToolSteel said: Looks like it cleaned up nicely. I'm a little worried about that crack where the head meets the shank though. Can you tell how far it goes? Yea that one is weird and i was looking at it this morning with my friend. It doesnt actually go around behind the piece it just shows on either side of the piece. So i think its not a crack... i think i folded over the metal of the head onto itself when i tried to flatten it so i think its a cold shunt. I know those are also bad but because it doesnt show around the back i dont think it will be a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latticino Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 Not completely sure, but I've always made the distinction between hawks and hand axes as relating to the type of eye and handle configuration. By my definition that would be a hand axe as the handle isn't a full taper and assembled from the "top" of the tool with a friction fit, rather than from below with a wedge (like many hammers). Regardless of semantics though, nice first effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustin Quade Posted January 6, 2017 Author Share Posted January 6, 2017 11 minutes ago, Latticino said: Not completely sure, but I've always made the distinction between hawks and hand axes as relating to the type of eye and handle configuration. By my definition that would be a hand axe as the handle isn't a full taper and assembled from the "top" of the tool with a friction fit, rather than from below with a wedge (like many hammers). Regardless of semantics though, nice first effort. Yea your probably right about that. Semantics are important though especially when its a specific tool. Its like confusing a saber and a talwar similar but different in key ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 Looks like it cleaned up well. Now you can take what you learned to the next one you make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustin Quade Posted January 6, 2017 Author Share Posted January 6, 2017 4 minutes ago, Daswulf said: Looks like it cleaned up well. Now you can take what you learned to the next one you make. Yea thats true. When i first thought about doing this project i had no intention of taking it this far. I intended it to just be an exercise but the further i went the more i wanted to see it cleaned up but there are alot more flaws in this piece than other recent projects i have done. But what i keep reminding myself id that this was my first of its kind and my recent knives and things are like the 20th. Just reaffirms you just get better and better with practice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 Exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swedefiddle Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 Happy New Year, Everyone has a starter line-up. It is lessons on what to do different next time. Keep it so you can inspect it in 20 years, "This is my progression"!! There is not enough meat around the Handle Hole to keep a firm grip on a handle. I am not being negative, you did an excellent job with what you were working with. I would upset some material into the center, before you punch the hole. You need a double taper or hourglass shape, to be able to stay on a Stick/Handle. I have been where you are and I am not ashamed to say it. Keep up the 'Learning', it never ends until you take your last breath. Enjoy the Journey, there is no Destination other than the smile on your face!! Neil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustin Quade Posted January 6, 2017 Author Share Posted January 6, 2017 54 minutes ago, swedefiddle said: Happy New Year, Everyone has a starter line-up. It is lessons on what to do different next time. Keep it so you can inspect it in 20 years, "This is my progression"!! There is not enough meat around the Handle Hole to keep a firm grip on a handle. I am not being negative, you did an excellent job with what you were working with. I would upset some material into the center, before you punch the hole. You need a double taper or hourglass shape, to be able to stay on a Stick/Handle. I have been where you are and I am not ashamed to say it. Keep up the 'Learning', it never ends until you take your last breath. Enjoy the Journey, there is no Destination other than the smile on your face!! Neil Thanks for the tips about the eye. I do need to work on upsetting. I will definately attempt to get some more material around the eye next time. Even as i was working on this i was worried about the eye splitting open as i made it because the material was so thin there (1/8" at the middle and 1/4" at the corners) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C-1ToolSteel Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 Glad to hear it's just a cold shut. I don't think you will have problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustin Quade Posted January 6, 2017 Author Share Posted January 6, 2017 2 hours ago, C-1ToolSteel said: Glad to hear it's just a cold shut. I don't think you will have problems. Yea i guess i need to pay more attention when im flattening the head next time. Im sure i wont see any trouble with the piece though mainly because i dont intend to use it. The item is crazy scary to swing around because of the spike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Ling Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 1 hour ago, Dustin Quade said: Yea i guess i need to pay more attention when im flattening the head next time I use spikes when making my longhorn head spatula/BBQ fork sets, and to get the head back in without cold shuts takes A LOT of heats. Or at least more heats than I would like on an item I'm trying to make a profit off of. But for like the tongs, I don't care a flip if it folds over. I typically take one heat, flux it (borax) and beat the snot out of the head, which creates a lot of BIG cold shuts. Then I take about 3-5 welding heats and forge weld it back into itself and seems to work great! afterwards you cant even see the cold shuts, but that part depends on your forge welding skills. Littleblacksmith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustin Quade Posted January 9, 2017 Author Share Posted January 9, 2017 On 2017-01-06 at 6:34 PM, littleblacksmith said: I use spikes when making my longhorn head spatula/BBQ fork sets, and to get the head back in without cold shuts takes A LOT of heats. Or at least more heats than I would like on an item I'm trying to make a profit off of. But for like the tongs, I don't care a flip if it folds over. I typically take one heat, flux it (borax) and beat the snot out of the head, which creates a lot of BIG cold shuts. Then I take about 3-5 welding heats and forge weld it back into itself and seems to work great! afterwards you cant even see the cold shuts, but that part depends on your forge welding skills. Littleblacksmith Its good to know that having those shuts in there is a common occurance. If i try another where i fold the head into itself like this i will try to flux it up and weld it shut. I know that for decorative applications they might not be a big deal but for something like this are cold shuts a real problem or is there enough mass that its just an ugly asthetic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibor Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 Great job!This towahawk is similar to the Scythian ax from Ukraine, has only a smaller beard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustin Quade Posted January 10, 2017 Author Share Posted January 10, 2017 19 minutes ago, Ibor said: Great job!This towahawk is similar to the Scythian ax from Ukraine, has only a smaller beard. Thanks. That is actually really interesting. I have never done any research or anything into the shape but i had assumed this kind of shape to be more something fantasy based than history based. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 Few folks over here are aware of the depth of design choices available from central Europe and east. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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