Angle Grinder

[Dom]

There's currently a good sale on a nice angle grinder from a reputable company and I'm wondering how often this is used in blacksmithing.

I don't have one and I'm slowly starting to accumulate some tools of my own. Should I go for it on keep the money for something more useful?

Thanks!

[Frosty]

Right angle grinders are very useful and very dangerous. I have several, used 3 of them this afternoon in fact though I'm building a forge rather than using one. How much experience do you have using right angle grinders? If it gets away from you it'll eat your lunch so fast it'll be done before the pain registers. No fooling. My 9" Milwaukee can literally throw you across the floor if you jam a disk. The 7" may not be able to toss you very far but it'll wrap itself up in your clothing so completely it may take a hospital to get it off you.

The 4-5" peanut grinders are tremendously useful but they'll grab and climb you just like the big ones, just not as far or hard. Wire brushes are extremely dangerous I'd recommend you take a shop class or two before messing with wire brushes in an angle grinder.

How much hands on shop experience do you have? Do you know somebody who can show you how to use one safely? I LOVE my disk grinders but being around someone else using one scares crap out of me.

I'm not trying to discourage you except maybe getting in over your head without knowing what you're getting into. The above are some things to think about.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Glenn]

Read what Frosty said one more time.

The 9 inch grinder is serious stuff, as is the 7 inch. They can erase metal very fast, and clothing and flesh even faster. The 4-1/2 inch grinders are just as dangerous but a bit easier to control. You MUST learn to grind in the direction of OFF the stock. This way the grinder will leave the metal. If you grind ONTO the stock the grinder will grab and what happens next is not pretty no matter how you look at it.

Wire brushes have been discussed before. They are just dangerous and you need to be on top of your game before you even plug in the tool.

Always wear more personal protection that you think you will need. NO loose clothing, or frayed jeans. The grinding sparks are a fire hazard, and will travel 20 feet or more. The sparks love to embed into glass. Loose wires from the wire wheels get thrown 20 feet or more and become little darts. This means other people, the dogs and animals are not safe when grinders are in operation.

You do know about the bad air the grinders produce. Lots of fine dust in the air and in your lungs. The dust settles on everything and next time your in the shop you stir it up and get it airborne again.

Wire brushing galvanized puts zinc dust into the air and your lungs. Look up heavy metal poisoning, or fume fever. Nasty stuff. There are other coatings and alloys you want to avoid. Enough said.

Grinders are great tools and very useful. You must learn how to use them safely.

[Dom]

OK, it is a 4.5" angle grinder not one of the bigger ones but I get what you mean.

This is a bit discouraging but I understand that this might might not be the answer I'd wanted but the one I needed.

So, until I get more experience, I guess I should save up for a bench or belt grinder?

[Frosty]

I don't want to discourage you but I don't want to read about how you lost body parts either. I return to my suggestion you find someone who can show you how to use it safely. You might ask someone at the welding supply. Tell them you got it as a gift or they aren't so likely to help you as much as if you bought it there. Still all the welding supply guys I've known over the years are good guys and don't want to see folk get hurt. It's a place to ask, be nice maybe take a box of doughnuts. Nothing says please help me like a box of doughnuts in the hands of a polite person with genuine safety concerns.

Buy some grinding disks from them, that'll ease the way with their boss.

Stick with hard disks till you get the feel. They turn clockwise as you look down on the disk, It will throw sparks and debris to the right from the contact point, So, if you let the right side of the wheel do the work it will throw the sparks at your right hip. This seems like a bad thing but it's not, if it binds the grinder will be jerked out of your hands and fly AWAY from you, this is GOOD. If you use the front edge sparks will throw to your right and a bind reaction will throw it to your left but you'll probably be able to hold onto it. If you use the left edge it will throw sparks away from you but if it binds the grinder will come straight at YOU. This is a B-A-D thing.

Use the blade flat on the work whenever possible, the edge will cut grooves. Don't use it like you see everybody on TV use them and move it back and forth real fast. They're using the edge's edge to cut faster but it's grooving and scaring the work. Just let the disk lay flat and let it float on the work, slowly move it back and forth to prevent the grit from scratching the work. This actually moves more metal and does a much nicer job while not burning up disks faster.

Wear a leather apron, leather boots, long sleeve shirt with buttoned cuffs and safety glasses, goggles are better, under the face shield. I don't recommend you wear gloves they're more likely to get caught and pull your hand into the disk. Touch the disk bare handed and it'll scuff heck out of you but won't pull you in and you'll remember to NOT DO THAT AGAIN.

I wish I could show you how to use a disk grinder safely. We could start the session by me showing you the scars and telling you the stories. The gist of my grinder scar stories goes like this. I got over confident and it bit me. Period.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Michael Cochran]

I use a 4" on a semi-regular basis and I still have a healthy fear/respect for them. I only have one scar and that's too many. Mine was from cutting off old railing without someone helping hold the railing, the weight shifted and I was cutting the wrong direction and the disc got in a bind and came at me hitting my ankle. I had another incident with one that could've ended with a missing appendage and again it was from cutting the wrong way disc got in a bind and here came the grinder. I also watched helplessly as one with a diamond disc leap from a guys hand and flew ten feet behind and to the side of him hitting another guy in the chest tearing up his shirt and scratching him up really bad. I think we have a discussion here somewhere about the safety of these little monsters and there's some good examples to take note of.

[Kevin Olson]

They do alot it work but you have to treat them like holding a loaded gun by the barrel. 

[Glenn]

Scars from a grinder, I can show you mine if you like. (grin)

Each time you pick up the grinder your heart should skip a beat while you put your brain in gear and go over the rules of use. ALWAYS clamp your work so it does not move and reposition your work early and often to keep the grinder from doing something you do not expect, like kicking back at you. A comfortable stance and body position is very important when using a grinder.

You are already playing with fire, with white hot metal, etc so a grinder is just another tool. You should not be afraid of it but you should be respectful of what it can do if you do not control it. Would I be without one, no. I have 4-1/2 inch grinders at point of use locations, as well as a 9 inch grinder.

All this is starting to sound like scare tactics, but in fact it is just trying to keep you safe and in one piece. Much like work bare handed and if the metal gets hot, then turn it loose, or the continuing safety cautions on galvanizing or zinc. 

If a name brand grinder is on sale at a good price, get it. Learn to use it BEFORE you put it to actual use, and then go slow until you build up some hours and get to know the tool. ALWAYS remove any distractions (dog, falling objects etc) and put your brain in gear before you activate the switch. Did we mention ear protection?

[notownkid]

I have a half dozen of them spread between 3 shops and use regularly but the Wire Brush talk here is very real and can be very dangerous if no properly attired.  My son use to laugh when he saw me wearing an old pair of logging chaps when grinding on the side of a trailer.  After he pulled some bristles out of his leg he stopped laughing and uses them as well. Never short sleeves, always heavy gloves and face shield usually a face mask depending on what I'm grinding.  I really hate the wire brushes and try to sand blast if possible instead, just as dirty by safer in my book. 

all of mine are HF and not expensive and When not IF they stop working out they go and I keep spares on hand in each shop.  As I'm consolidating down to 2 shops soon I'll have more spares.  All of mine are 4 1/2" as well. 

That is my opinion for what it is worth.

 

 

 

[Glenn]

The grinders come with a shield. Be sure to have the shield in place before you turn on the grinder. It is always best to let the grinder run for a minute or so before making contact with your work. This lets the grinder reach maximum speed and if the disc has been dropped or damaged, it will come apart during the process. ALWAYS stay out of the plane of destruction if anything happens and pieces start flying. Another reason for the shields.

[Dom]

Thanks everyone for the advice. Still pondering what to do. There are gonna be other sales, I could wait for another opportunity.

I'm slowly starting to purchase tool and I wanted to get something with which I could do some work while away from the forge.

[Frosty]

Another thought  for you. Stick with sanding disks on the rubber backer pads till you get some experience using it. This is a good learning device for a few reasons, sanding disks will do good work up to and including putting a polishing pad on though save that one for later they're pretty grabby. Another excellent trait sanding pads have a learning disks is they're about as fragile as it gets and they come apart like a hard disk but they're much less dangerous, normal PPE will prevent serious injury.

So there is is you need to treat them kinder in use so you'll develop a light touch and careful feel. When they come apart they're as violent and scary as a hard disk but only sting and scrape you up if you're adequately protected. If they bind they give a good jerk and tear so you learn what causes disks to bind without having the grinder fly across the shop or climb your Levis.Just because I tell you sanding disks are safer does NOT mean you should sluff off on the other rules of safe operation of a disk grinder. Work securely held, clamps vise, welded on  bolted or riveted down, etc. ALL the safety gear, etc. No exceptions!

Stay away from the buffs though they are almost as grabby as wire brushes and can do you a mischief. Save shining things to a mirror polish till you've been using disk grinders a while, it's a different feel and touch.

Frosty The Lucky.

[b4utoo]

I have 4 of them... I think they are priceless in some projects.... Just can't do without....

That being said...DANGEROUS ...like others have mentioned...

Take your mind off what you're doing for even a millisecond you are going to regret it...either ruin your project or ruin your body...

2 days ago I was using my big Makita and it nicked me....As in WENT THROUGH MY THICK LEATHER GLOVE AND MY SKIN ON MY FINGER LIKE A PLASMA CUTTER GOES THROUGH SHEET METAL....I'm just happy I only lost under a inch of skin though it went deep...

SPARKS FLY LIKE CRAZY....I left a shop rag about 4-5 feet from where I was grinding on my welding table....and sparks were hitting it for a second...AND IT CAUGHT FIRE!

I think I might be a good example of what NOT TO DO on some things...

I have 2 smallish 4" grinders Dewalt and Milwaukee...1 Medium Dewalt and 1 Big Makita.....each are good at different things...I leave different stones and cutters on each because I use each so often...IT HELPS HAVING MORE THAN ONE!

MAKE SURE ITS COMPLETELY STOPPED BEFORE LAYING DOWN! YOU CAN SLOW IT DOWN FASTER IF YOU WANT BY TOUCHING A DESIGNATED OBJECT FOR IT FOR STONES ONLY..

If it doesnt have a guard, watch your fingers where you hold it, if you're using wider stones or cutting wheels...you can still hit your fingers...

I kind treat the grinder like when I'm welding....sparks fly...so protect yourself..

[Juc]

If you don't have an angle grinder, what would be the alternative tool you'd choose to use to do the same thing?

[Michael Cochran]

Depends on the task at hand. Either a hacksaw/bandsaw for cutting, a bench grinder for grinding, files and sandpaper for cleanup and smoothing. 

[b4utoo]

Go to harbor freight and get a cheap one....you're looking to do more work without one

[Kozzy]

If you get an angle grinder, it's worth going with a better quality unit (for your sanity).  They're already ridiculously loud and the cheap ones sound like the gears have a handful of rocks in them.  In addition to the good one, I keep a cheap (ultra chinese cheap...if you get the drift) one around for those knock-around jobs where the grinder is a bit abused and save the good one for the extended-use fabrication jobs:  Rusty bolt cutting in the field is a good use for the cheapie for example.  Almost annoyingly, I can't seem to kill the darned chinese cheapo  If it'd just die, maybe I wouldn't have to listen to it scream any more.

[b4utoo]

I have good ones, I just mention harbor freight if the cost is a issue.....

Ive been lucky acquiring them....

 

[JHCC]

I'm on my third HF grinder: the first was a couple of bucks at the flea market (and then it burned out), the second was on sale (and then the arbor stripped out, so I swapped out the arbor from the first one. And then it burned out.), and the third was one of their mid-range models massively on sale with a good coupon (Hasn't burned out yet, but I somehow suspect it will before the extended warranty runs out). I still haven't spent as much as I would have for a single pro-quality grinder.

BUT!

If I were anything other than an occasional hobbyist, I would definitely spring for the professional quality tool. That would be worth every penny.

Stay safe.

[TwistedCustoms]

I don't do enough fab work to need a big grinder but I have three Makita 4.5" Big box price is $70.00 to 80.00 USD. They are under sized and under powered for some of the cutting I've done with them but they work great. The oldest one is now ten years old and the other two were purchased three years ago. I can't tell which is which now so the older on is still going strong. I keep a thin cutoff wheel on one, a flap disc on another and grinding wheel on the third. They are handy to have around for sure. 

[Frosty]

I'm REALLY not a fan of using a cut off blade in an angle grinder, it's just dancing too close to the edge. However I use cut off blades but I put them in a yard sale skill saw. Carbide vernier blades cut surprisingly thick steel too but cut aluminum like butter. No, the "secret trick" of turning the blade so it's cutting backwards doesn't work, it is (no offense if you believe this myth) just plain stupid, saws are directional tools.

Be aware if you use composition (hot saw) blades in a skill saw the grit will shorten the saw's life considerably so buy them at yard, garage, etc. sales. The skill saw application doesn't make them "safe" but it does make them SAFER. Heck, it's easier to make straight square cuts and the blades last longer. Just don't do what everybody does and try cutting a stack of sheet, it'll eat the blade like a stone dressing tool can eat a grinding stone.

Frosty The Lucky.

[TwistedCustoms]

The 4.5 cutoff wheels I use are mesh reenforced silica carbide. I haven't had one break appart but I don't get them in a bind. I use a 14" chop saw for bigger stock but I prefer the thin wheels in the angle grinder for small diameter stuff. I have used 7" wheels in a circular saw as well, usually because it seems like a better choice than purchasing a bigger grinder for a small project like re-roofing the shop etc. The skill saw with the thin wheels does a good job on high rib steel roofing.