CAE Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 This was much simpler to put together than as gas forge. But I'm still working on a gasser too. Nothing special to most I'm sure. Typical Brake Drum, hair dryer set up. But for a retired carpenter who never did anything in steel n metal I was pretty proud of how she turned out. Locol Tractor Supply had Nut Coal last week only thing left was Rice coal so that's what i used today to light her up. I've read that Anthracite coal is hard lighting. I tried the news paper ball in the bottom but being pretty windy today that didn't work even with the make shift wind block. Put a couple pieces of grill charcoal and lighter fluid in the bottom and once that took off topped it with the Rice Coal. didn't take but a couple minutes with the air on low and she took right off. Just a couple things I need to change. Need to get the Drum lower and or cut out a slot for material. I think I need another way to regulate the air pressure. I think the low setting is OK but when on high she's like a blast furnace. Thinking about drilling holes in the cross pipe going to the T and making a sliding sleeve to fine tune air pressure. The drum seems to be too deep and with air on high the hot spot is too big and to deep to. Burning a lot of fuel and can't heat the material in a specific area without a huge fire ball. Can I pack the drum with some kind of clay or refractory to make a smaller funnel to conserve on fuel? The Rice coal seems to create a lot of clinkers too. More than I think there should be. Ran it for about an hour and the bowl had at least a full handfull of them and rather large. 1" to 1-1/2" in size. Is that typical or due to the rice coal? Never even looked into a forge till today. Think I need some shaded glasses of goggles (since I wear glasses). Going from the forge to the anvil.....I'm looking thru an orange glowing spot in my vision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 CAE, welcome to the forum. To regulate your air supply, a blast gate (air gate) is a good way to regulate your air flow when you don't have a variable blower. That way you can manage your fuel and choke it down when you don't need a hot fire. You'll need to pile up your coal to build up a good "fire ball" in which to put your work piece. If your fire gets too hot or too big for you, just throttle back on the air. Anthracite doesn't have as much in the way of impurities as bituminous, so you'll not get the coke like the soft coal. It'll still forge just fine. Lots of folks use hair dryers, but I find them too loud and irritating. I use a fart fan, others use blowers from cars, clothes dryers, hand crank blowers, etc. whatever you can find. Here's a blast gate I made for my forge. Just cut a slot in a pipe connector and use sheet metal for the sliding gate. (I've since added an ash dump which you will find handy). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Ling Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 if you could find a brake roder than that would probably be shallower. one thing that you can also do to make your fire smaller is to wet the area you don't want burning with some water. Just a couple suggestions. Littleblacksmith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 Wetting the coal is OK, just don't pour water on your cast iron firepot or it'll crack like crazy. Your brake drum is fine as far as depth goes. I use one all the time and the depth is not an issue. You don't necessarily want it too shallow or you'll be heating your work down in an oxygen-rich zone...more scale and oxidation. Glenn had posted a great graphic on the forum showing an optimum firepot arrangement. Search the forum to find it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAE Posted February 4, 2016 Author Share Posted February 4, 2016 Found Glenn's post on coal fire management, Very good info for a newbie. That one should be a sticky in the Solid Fuel Forge forum . Your diy blast gate is an awesome piece of Mc Givery. Will see if I can manage that one tomorrow along with some sort of a hood. The $14 blow dryer I got is surprisingly quiet even on high. The blast gate will certainly help managing vol. I'll save the water for an "if all else fails" kind of thing. Last thing I want right now is to replace the cast rotor.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 CAE, I simply sawed the black pipe connector starting with a hacksaw to get going. I found a piece of scrap sheet metal the same thickness as my sawzall blades. I completed the cuts with the sawzall...much easier than the hacksaw. If you find sheet metal the same thickness as a hacksaw blade, it bends too easily when you slide it back and forth. If you wanted to use a thicker sliding gate, the slots could be cut with a angle grinder and cutoff disk. Here's a pic of the plumbing installed. The ash dump is simple to make; like the exhaust cap on a truck. My first fart fan lasted 3 years and quit when one of the wires broke off inside the motor. Replaced it with another...$17 at HD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAE Posted February 4, 2016 Author Share Posted February 4, 2016 LOL..... been to HD, Menards, Tractor Supply and Wally world twice this week already. Next time I head that way I'll have to pick me up a xxxx Fan for when this Blow Dryer takes fails. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 Get a piece of 3 inch flexible aluminum dryer vent. Leave an air gap between the pipe and the fan. For more air, aim closer to the pipe, for less air do not aim so close to the opening. Simple works. Add a lot more coal to the fire, enough to spill out onto the table. When the fire goes out, look where the ash has accumulated and that is where you want to put the clay. You should find that there is little ash so the clay is not really needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy seale Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 for lighting the forge I use news paper dipped in wax. cut n/p up in about 1 1/2- 2" strips roll up several strips into a 1/2- 3/4" dia. rolles tape/ tie up and put in melted wax, let it dry and then your ready to lit er up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAE Posted February 4, 2016 Author Share Posted February 4, 2016 8 minutes ago, Glenn said: Get a piece of 3 inch flexible aluminum dryer vent. Leave an air gap between the pipe and the fan. For more air, aim closer to the pipe, for less air do not aim so close to the opening. Simple works. Add a lot more coal to the fire, enough to spill out onto the table. When the fire goes out, look where the ash has accumulated and that is where you want to put the clay. You should find that there is little ash so the clay is not really needed. I've seen so many vids on brake drum forges I knew it wasn't properly stoked. I guess I was just trying to see if everything worked and when it did get a pretty good heat going I made a very poor attempt at half of a pair of tongs that I started in a coffee can forge that lasted all of about 6 firings. So much for homebrew refractory. Got tomorrow to cut a material slot in the drum edge....play with air management. make a hood of sorts and maybe even try to finish that pair of tongs. I'll put up some pics of a better firing and the whole forge when I get a chance. Thanks to everyone for all the advice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 If you add a couple of gallons of fuel to the fire the sweet spot will be above the rim of the brake drum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAE Posted February 4, 2016 Author Share Posted February 4, 2016 I'll give that a try before I go cutting. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDarkNebulah Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 Thats a pretty nice looking forge. I also wanted to limit my fuel area size, so my solution was just two peices of steel plate to make kinf of a trench, and it worked out nicely. I also am using tractor supply coal, and I am also getting alot of clinkers. I don't know if I'm getting more than normal or not, because I've never really forged with coal, but it seems like there are a lot of clinkers. Heres a picture of my forge set up with the plates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 Forges that require continuous air tend to produce more clinker as they go through fuel faster and tend to range a bit more oxidizing and the scale is a component of clinker too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAE Posted February 5, 2016 Author Share Posted February 5, 2016 Arkie Took your idea and made a similar mod to help control air supply. Just cut a slot in the cross pipe and made a sliding gate. Saved me another trip to the hardware store for a coupling and nipples to replace the existing pipe. Push rod with notches at full open, half and full closed. Will probably add 1/4 notches as I found today it seemed between closed and a quarter open it ran pretty good. Still seemed to create a much larger diameter hot spot than I needed and the sweet spot was still too deep to heat the middle of a 1/2" round without adding a bunch more coal to raise it. Tried this once and it just seemed to burn as wide as the drum itself. Seems a waste of fuel. Going to try to raise the bottom an inch or so with some fire brick to see if this helps. This rice coal is on the smallish size. 1/2" at best. Packs in pretty tight and when burning, grows all the way to edge of the drum. Don't need that big of hot spot. Don't have a clue why the pics are spun 90 deg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted February 5, 2016 Share Posted February 5, 2016 Lost post again... CAE, your blast gate looks like it will work ok. I open mine only about 1/4 to 1/2 for most forging, rarely wide open. My opinion, for what it's worth, is that your drum is too deep. You might find a fix like claying, firebrick, etc. to raise the bottom, but instead you might consider finding a regular automobile drum which would be shallower, around 2" or so. With that deep drum you are just going to be wasting a lot of coal, and the rice size will burn fast. Maybe try nut size or slightly larger. Glenn's suggestion about piling up the coal is a good one. I usually mound my coal up about 3-4" deep over the firepot. Here are some pics of my drum during installing a grating in the bottom. It's not nearly as deep as yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAE Posted February 5, 2016 Author Share Posted February 5, 2016 Yup that's whats on the tomorrow list. What would you think if I drop in a 1" or so ring of 2-1/2" in pipe and fill the rest of the void with sand or perlite or dirt. or whateve won't burn just to save the time I'll spend cutting and fitting fire brick?. Just in case that's not the problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted February 5, 2016 Share Posted February 5, 2016 That might be worth a try. You will have to place a grid, plate, cast iron grate or something on top of the pipe and filler, maybe covering the entire diameter of the drum to keep things from moving around when you tend the fire. Perlite would probably burn up. Sand might be a usable filler, or refractory clay, it might not get hot enough to melt (the sand)...just have to try what works. I know that my 1/2" bar steel grid gets red hot sometimes with heavy forging. Maybe someone has a suggestion for an annulus filler that would work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picker Posted February 5, 2016 Share Posted February 5, 2016 You can also regulate the airflow by installing a rheostat to your blower. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Olson Posted February 5, 2016 Share Posted February 5, 2016 CAE. DO NOT stare at your fire. Coal produces Infrared radation and can damage your eyes. Order a pair of shade 3 clip on Welding glasses from amazon. 10 bucks. They will block the IR and save your sight. I have some and they work great. DO NOT use sun glasses. Heres a pic of my brake rotor. Its 2.5 inches deep and 9 wide. Sides are not tapered and when im coking coal around the edge of the fire the klinkers form down in the bottom corners and not over the air grate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quench. Posted February 5, 2016 Share Posted February 5, 2016 CAE, if you find your holes plugging, you can easily open them up a lot more. Below is a link to my drum forge example. Also gives another example of the plates that MrDarkNebulah showed, to reduce the size of the pot. If they are removable, you have your choice to use them or not... Brake drum forge with trough plates and larger grate holes. Still a work in progress. I've cut back the rim to make it easier to rake coal and now my plates don't fit, but that will be fixed this weekend. My air control is on the inlet of the blower. I read somewhere that controlling on the inlet sometimes works better than controlling on the outlet. Maybe not as hard on the blower? But definitely harder to fabricate, and I'm not sure the motor likes it any better. I might try the tube slot as well, but I'm also considering a diverter so I don't have to switch off the fan to completely idle the air (air still gets in through the inlet cover). - Q Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAE Posted February 5, 2016 Author Share Posted February 5, 2016 Solved some problems today just by buying Nut Coal instead of Rice from Tractor Supply. Couldn't get it started with charcoal like the Rice coal so I used a hand full of Rice to get the Nut going. Managed a horrible pair of Tongs and a poker. A Poker to manage the coal forge and Tongs because I don't have one pair. Both tools I really needed to even get started. A couple Fire Brick at the back helped pile the coal to a height where I was able to pass material through to heat the center park for forging. Ran the forge for almost 4 hours on less than two gallons of fuel. Considerably less than when using the smaller stuff and much more manageable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted February 5, 2016 Share Posted February 5, 2016 Quench, some blowers work best when the air supply is regulated on the fan exhaust, others will work OK with the air supply regulated on the intake. Restricting air on the intake may cause some motors to not be sufficiently cooled and thereby overheat. Big question is....how does one determine if a blower/motor will overheat if the intake is restricted...with so many of us using repurposed blowers??????? Probably only if you buy one new and the manufacturer specifies the parameters. CAE, you're making good progress. It doesn't come overnight! I've modified my forge several times and am about to make a new hood. The first one was made from sheet metal that was too thin. Next one will be heavier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WL smith Posted February 6, 2016 Share Posted February 6, 2016 The other alternative to your blower is to keep looking for a hand crank blower They are infinity adjustable. Nice looking forge keep up the good work! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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