pkrankow Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 My Dad, a now retired mechanic with over 40 years at Firestone, had his toolbox insured for more than the house and the house's contents were insured for (I don't know the number). He also has a 20+ page of typed inventory to account for this level of insurance. The cheap junk tool kits my brothers and I gave him as little kids are also on that typed list. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marksnagel Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 hobbyists are usually plain old CHEAP becaus to them it's a hobby, they use they're spare dough from the rest of they're life to fund they're fun. Rings of a little truth Sam. It is a hobby that I would like to actually make a profit from as the spare dough is pretty much non existent. I make mostly what I need from what I have. Some of us have little to no surplus cash. We are funding our hobby from literally spare change. Should we quit and take up a different hobby? Sorry, I couldn't afford the rehab or the withdrawl process. Cheap? Label me whatever you want so long as I can keep on forging. Mark<>< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainely,Bob Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 Cheap? What do you call someone who can turn scrap into whatever he chooses,from high quality tooling to works of art? Most would call somebody who can do that a magician.Ever see a cheap magician? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KYBOY Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 Ive been a gun collector for many years..Bought and sold more than I can remember. Owned more than 50 at one time on many occasions..One one occasion I went around buying up high capacity mags before the brady bil went into effect..Paid $10 a piece of italain berreta mags..Sold them for $60 each after the bill passed..Another time I sold three particular guns for enought to pay for our marriage, our honey moon and a months bills..I dont sell much anymore. Im holding on to everything now but I use to spend $500 on guns one week and sell them for $750 two weeks later regularly..Never lost money on a gun...My gun trading more than paid for my gun collecting..Your hobby can pay for itself if work at it.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thingmaker3 Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 As the metalworker walks out of the bar smiling with the anvil under his arm, Blacksmith from the PNW who can carry 150# under ONE arm? Must have been Geronimo Bayard.All characters appearing in this work are fictitious. Any resemblance to real persons, living or dead, is purely coincidental. Oops. Okay. Must have been a fictitious person with purely coincidental resemblance to Geronimo Bayard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunsmithnMaker Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 I confess to NOT being a cheapskate. I have made it a point to scrimp and save to buy the very best I could, brand new. I did my research, I never researched price until the last minute, I researched QUALITY, hence I have a KMG grinder that will last me my entire life, my sea robin forge bladesmith anvil that will last me my entire life, my anyang 33 which will last me my entire life. I paid 4$ a pound for the anvil, worth every penny I didn't bat an eyelash at the price. I'm not naive so as to be taken and ripped off, I know a fair price i'm willing to pay for something. If it's something I want, I got the dough, and it's a great product (I wouldn't want it if it wasn't) i'll pay. Money comes and goes tools are forever working blacksmiths need to be cheap because it's they're livelihood that is based on getting a good deal, and expect alot from something because they have an appreciation for tools that are 50 pounds of dung in a 10 pound bag. hobbyists are usually plain old CHEAP becaus to them it's a hobby, they use they're spare dough from the rest of they're life to fund they're fun. Sam, You're just like the rest of us. When you scrimp and save you're taking the time to get what you want. Some people would whip out the credit card and buy the first thing they saw and worry about paying for it out of their salary. Those people wouldn't care about their tools being quality and they wouldn't care about what happened to them. They are the real Hobbiest. I don't exactly have that luxury. I make some money to help pay the bills and hopefully buy a few things to point me in the right direction for my real career. I haven't really said it here before, but I am recovering from a heart condition that I have had problems with for 20 + years and haven't had a "real" job in over 8 years. I drive "chauffeur" for a local organization making trips to the VA Hospital 100 miles away with another Veteran. I had an operation in July 2009 to repair my faulty heart and yesterday I saw my surgeon who says as far as he's concerned I'm cured. I'm too independent to last long in a job where I work for someone else, so I have to do something to make it on my own. That means scrimping and possibly working for a while for other people to buy what I need or make what I can. Both options have their drawbacks because I have very little space right now and it's hard to make my own equipment, but I do what I can. Believe me, I'll gladly accept anything given, and I appreciate the fact that we owe it to others when the time comes to lend a hand and contribute to their education and collection. When it comes to the time used in making something for yourself, you can put that under the column for education and experience, and if you're really lucky the column for invention. Nothing is wasted. The spirit of individualism and creation is what we all share. Some of us just know how to put it to use better than others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arete Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 I am not trying to pick on anyone but it never fails to amaze me what a lot of cheapskates we are.. There is always some thread going on about how much something cost or how crazy someone is for paying 6 bucks a pound for an anvil... I have noticed selling tools that a working blacksmith is the toughest customer to have... They expect more for less than just about any other group I have ever dealt with... Why is it that as a whole we seem to be this way (I have my own cheapskate habits, although I dont mind spending money on tools) Perhaps it has something to do with the ability/tendency to make something out of nothing. I was blown away when I made my first center punch out of an old truck spring from my teacher's scrap pile. "You mean I can make tools from stuff that's just laying around? Sweet!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 And how many people look at something and say "I do not want to pay $X.xx for that when I can go home and make the same thing myself." Six months or a year later and the price has increased on the same item (due to materials cost) and the people still have not made, or even started to make theirs. Then there is the other fellow that looks at an item and pays the asking price because he knows it is cheaper to buy one and put it to immediate use making money for him. Couple of projects pays for the item and the rest is pure profit due to the time he saves using that tool. I am not saying either is right or either one is wrong, just an observation based on that individuals needs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 There are some items that buying the most expensive one *is* the cheapest way to go! OTOH, I always look out for good name brand "consumables" at "china junk" prices. Picked up an unused Norton flapwheel for my 7" grinder the other day for $2.50. Don't need it yet but it will be there when I do and that will be soon enough not to age it much... OTOH my hacksaw blades are cut from band saw blades and mounted in a 30" bow saw handle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macbruce Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 Things that cut ie saw blades,chopsaw blades,taps,dies,grinding discs,etc,etc and consumables in general seem to be near the top of the list to avoid when buying Mr Wang Chung's goods, (Bruceism and counterpart to Uncle Sam) Sorry, I just can't help myself.............mb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGGUNDOCTOR Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 Nothing wrong with being frugal to save money, as long as it isn't taken too far. I have bought several tools, and consumables at garage sales , flea markets, auctions, Craigslist, newspaper ads, etc. One of my better scores was a #57 Dumore tool post grinder with a bunch of the attachments, and wheels for $30 at a garage sale. It was actually in nicer shape than one I bought for $200 at a machine shop auction. They were over $1,300 new at the time. At the machine shop auctions I was averaging 10 cents on the dollar. A used tool dealer I know was buying Bridgeports for $500 when the used CNC's started getting low enough for small shops to buy one. No one wanted a manual mill anymore. Why pay $12,000 for a new Bridgeport when you can get a good used one for $2,000, or a CNC for the same price or less? It gets down to perceived value for anything. Blacksmithing tools are not complicated, made of exotic metals, or that rare (in some areas), so they may not be thought of as being that valuable by many. They look simple, and easy to make by the ones who use them. I have machine tools, and have access to a CNC VMC so I can make a lot of what I want. I can saw, and mill out a hardy faster than I can forge one. Do I? No, because I have found all of mine for $3-$5 each. If I don't have what I need then I may look at making one. Now if I had a shop, and needed tools to do a job, then I would look at things differently. The tools then would then be used to make me money. The Dumore is a good example. I didn't need one at the time, and have only used it a couple of times since buying the first one, so I couldn't see paying retail for a new one. As a hobbyist who gives away what I make the tools are currently an expense, not an income generator. Yes, some folks will want an item for free, and for you to thank them for taking it off your hands after you haul it home for them. You just can't please everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainely,Bob Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 That`s what I like about being self employed.The only person that absolutely has to be pleased is me. More than once someone was being a PITA about something and I told hem it was free,just take it and leave. The catch was they could never darken my door again unless they had the original payment in hand and an apology on their lips. Either way,I was always pleased. The trick is recognizing the PITA folks early on and pointing to the door before any work starts.I`m getting pretty good at the recognition part of the show. I have found that the crowd with the multi million dollar yachts,the thousand dollar suits and the Rolex on the wrist are the ones to watch very closely. <_< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willis Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 I'm not cheap, I'm poor, and I take it as a challange to see if I can do more with less. A habit I picked up after spending twenty years in the USAF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted January 17, 2011 Author Share Posted January 17, 2011 Hey Bob. I was at an ol guys body shop once when this younger guy came in and started raising a stink about his project taking too long, he got out of line in my opinion. But the old boy just listened. When the guy was finished with is rant Doug said how much did did you put down? Guy said $500. Doug reached in his pocket pulled out a wad of bills and counted out 10 hundred dollar bills and handed them to the guy and said get your parts and get out, I work on my own time and don't need your money.... I was shocked buy the whole deal but the guy changed his tune in a big hurry cuz Doug was the best in town, the guy must have said sorry 20 times and told Doug to take as long as he needed and left with his tail between his legs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marksnagel Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 I'm not cheap, I'm poor, and I take it as a challange to see if I can do more with less. A habit I picked up after spending twenty years in the USAF. I hear you! Mark<>< USCG retired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AK Arkie Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 If I can make it myself I rarely will pay for it. As a blacksmith there is just not much that I cannot make or believe that I will be able to make in the future. The best way to get past that is for it to cost less than I think my time is worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 I tend to factor in the learning curve in the "make it yourself" equation as I know I will have to make a bunch of them to get as good as someone who specializes in something. (but I use the "make it yourself" a lot to squelch purchasing as I am a cheapskate blacksmith...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Salvati Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Hey Bob. I was at an ol guys body shop once when this younger guy came in and started raising a stink about his project taking too long, he got out of line in my opinion. But the old boy just listened. When the guy was finished with is rant Doug said how much did did you put down? Guy said $500. Doug reached in his pocket pulled out a wad of bills and counted out 10 hundred dollar bills and handed them to the guy and said get your parts and get out, I work on my own time and don't need your money.... I was shocked buy the whole deal but the guy changed his tune in a big hurry cuz Doug was the best in town, the guy must have said sorry 20 times and told Doug to take as long as he needed and left with his tail between his legs Good story :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Countryboy39067 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 My brother-in-law taught me a great lesson many years ago. There is cheap then there is inexpensive. Cheap breaks after the first use. Inexpensive is a good deal on a quality product. Just thought I'd share that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGGUNDOCTOR Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Back when my uncle was working retail he had a woman ask him what was on sale? He responded "Everything is on sale until it is sold." Things on sale vs specials. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bentiron1946 Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 My children are not "cheap", "frugal" nor "inexpensive" minded, they have no concept of it what so ever. After living with me all these years I'm beginning to think they were switched at birth. When I talk with the parents of their friends I find I'm not alone in wondering where they got the idea that money grows on trees. My wife and I are frugal, we shop for bargains, deals and sales. Our favorite place to buy clothes is Goodwill. I wear good brands of clothes and my wife wears some of the best brands there are at below wholesale prices, shoes too. My children however can only wear the most current types of clothes, big bucks there. If they want me to pay for it, well you know where I shop for clothes. I like to read so I buy my paperbacks a Goodwill for fifty cents each, some near new condition, I never knew anyone to wear the words off with their eyeballs reading. My one son will make ten trips a day to the mall, one trip to buy a book, another trip to buy a sandwich, then back again to fill out a job application and then he has the gall to ask me to buy him a tank of gas. I tell him to plan better and the next tank of gas comes on Monday, this is only Wednesday. I tell his he should have saved his allowance from when he was little. Cheapness and frugality is a life style not easily learned, it is an acquired habit. I know that when I was in the Navy I was a lot like my son, money was like water, but after I was on my own I had to budget. I had to pay the bills and make it all last from one payday to next. When you have to rely on yourself it soon becomes a way of life. When there is no one standing behind you and it is sink or swim, you start swimming. Well I guess not, my sis and her husband are still sinking, coming up for air and getting a life line thrown to them and they are in their seventies. :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marksnagel Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Don't feel bad about your kids. I have found that no matter how much we teach our children about life the biggest influence on them is outside of our realm. They are bombarded by the media. They can't do anything without being plugged in. Cell phone, Ipod, TV, internet, movies, friend networks (like this one), etc. Everything out there tells them how to walk, talk, act, eat, wear, etc. All we can do is put forth the best possible example of how we feel they should live and hope (pray) for the best. I agree about the early years of our lives. Being single at the time and living aboard ship we had a lot of extra cash. Room and board was taken care of. Then along came the wife and the trolls, I mean darling children. We had to learn to be good stewards of our earnings if we wanted to survive. Same thing applies to blacksmithing. As a hobby blacksmith, if I want my hobby/habit/obsession/addiction to survive, I must be frugal and aware of my limits when it comes to expenditures. Luckily two of my three youngins are pretty good at being frugal. My youngest at 22yrs is the most frugal. She looks at the goodwill as a challenge. What can I get for the least cash. Bless her little heart! Mark<>< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poleframer Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 I've been really lucky in putting my hydraulic system together, no way I could afford buying this stuff new. There's a guy I know that does a lot of heavy equipment trading, he buys stuff at auction, rebuilds and sells it, has bins of parts he lets me go at. Last I was in I picked up two 4" cylinders, and a cessna motor for $25. And being used (sometimes well used) I get to learn how they goes together. Sometimes it's just a matter of seals, sometimes internal surfaces need lapped to get things going. I think part of what keeps us in this kind of occupation, or hobby, is the constant and enjoyable learning curve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 My children are not "cheap", "frugal" nor "inexpensive" minded, they have no concept of it what so ever. You know what this reminded me of.. We have to remember first off that we are not here to save anyone. We often do people a disservice by helping them. Im not saying we should turn a blind eye to suffering but in the case of the kid making ten trips to the mall... well when his car has no gas and he has to fill the tank its pretty well the answer Another thing is some people just dont handle money well, what ever a "good" money person has they got short changed on... And I think there is more than one kind of "good" money person... My example would be my grandparents and I... My dads folks where real penny pinchers... Now keep in mind my reference is when I was younger and my perspective.. They were not rich folks but had more than enough to enjoy life. My Granddad owned several successful businesses which did millions of dollars a year... But my grandma would bring home the little salt and ketchup packets from a fast food place and squeeze them back in to her jar... Once she wanted me to drive 30 miles round trip to get her 5 lbs of sausage that was $.03/lb cheaper at that store... (I was driving a company truck and on the company payroll at about $8/hr so I figure it cost my granddad about $20 to save him .09 cents) She made most all there attire, thought it was a ridiculous waste of money to eat out if you where close enough to get home... So anyway they where very thrifty and fugal, saved and did without.... Now I think I am pretty good with money these days (maybe not so much when I was 18) but I am nothing like them... Money flows from me as fast as I can get it... I buy buy buy... But I feel like the things I buy are better than money in the bank... They are an investment in my future and wellbeing.. I hate buying things that are not for the most part but still dont have any issues with spending $5 a day of a latte or going out to a nice dinner once a week.. My thouhgt is hey if I need more money, I'll just make more money and its pretty much always worked out... I am always just right at edge of not being able to pay my bills, but I always get them paid.... And I have enough saved up that if I couldn't get them covered I can fall back (I dont even consider the money I have set aside in day to day stuff, its not there to spend) Anyway I dont think I did a very good job getting my point across... Pretty much what I wanted to say is dont judge others money situation by your own criteria. If they are happy being broke and eating out ever day then let them be broke and eat out every day, just dont offer to buy them dinner... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KYBOY Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Theres a big differnece between watching what money you have and being a cheapskate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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