pkrankow Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 I notice that you use many many many turns of wire around your bundles. Is that really necessary? Isn't the collar supposed to hold everything...or is that expecting too much from the collar while hot before welding? Would less wire work, or is using a longer wire making it easier to reuse the wire for other work, making your shop consume less overall? On the humming bird did you reverse the wings? While these sculptures are rather simple, the small details make them outstanding. Thank you for sharing Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianbrazealblacksmith Posted July 28, 2009 Author Share Posted July 28, 2009 The wire is mainly used to keep the pieces that are hanging outside of the collar from flopping around while I'm hammering on the welded area, but in some cases where I can wrap it tightly, It can protect the pieces outside of the collar from excessive oxidation. The wire is not necessary, but if I make any jarring blows the pieces would bend away from each other. I do not reuse the wire. I still have over half of the roll that I bought over 3 years ago for about $3.00. I messed up on the hummingbird and put the wings in backwards. These were all made as examples for the class at Yesteryear School of Blacksmithing in November. You are very welcome. Give it a try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urnesBeast Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 It is not clear to me if the collar becomes forge welded with the bundle or not. I imagine it can go both ways. For a 3x3 grid, how many heats to weld this? I can imagine that you get some slightly stuck on the first heat, that you confirm these on the second heat, getting some incidental sticking in the other direction. The third and fourth heat is rotated 90 and similar process. From there, you have the mechanical hold and forge out as one piece. It seems to me that getting two widths of collar and three pieces to stick (four simultaneous welds) is difficult at best. How close am I on this guess of how this is done? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianbrazealblacksmith Posted July 29, 2009 Author Share Posted July 29, 2009 You are very close yet so far away. The weld can and should be done in one heat. It is a simple matter. You have a mass of hot metal that wants to be one, all you have to do is hit it into itself, and it will become one piece. If you hit it in a manner where it is not backed and it skews or slides off itself, you will not succeed. The secret of a forge weld is hitting the metal into it's self........ You can use a hydrolic press with V-dies or a power hammer with the same, ,or just hit it right, or you can do it with your hand hammer which has been my option most of the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy k Posted July 29, 2009 Share Posted July 29, 2009 Brian - On your bundle welded with a collar like you"ve been showing... what and were is the order of the hits during the forge welding? This may help some that are haveing a bit of a problem with the actuall welding of a full bundle like that. - JK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianbrazealblacksmith Posted July 29, 2009 Author Share Posted July 29, 2009 Good, no great question! I leave a slight gap in the collar perpindicular to the first side that I strike, because if it was totally inclosed by a square tube, two sides would bow out as you strike the other two sides. By leaving a gap in one side and striking the side perpindicular to that, you will only have one side bowing out. When using just a hammer and anvil, you can tack the first two sides down then go to the bows and tack them down. Once you have all four sides tacked down, you go for it and make the weld. With such a mass that is smaller than your hammer, all the work goes into your weld. You just have to hit it into itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iwdavey Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 What inspiring work!!!! I usually don't post but had to in this case. I am new to smithing and have a long way to go. You have given me the urge for tomorrows tasks. Thank You! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianbrazealblacksmith Posted August 16, 2009 Author Share Posted August 16, 2009 What inspiring work!!!! I usually don't post but had to in this case. I am new to smithing and have a long way to go. You have given me the urge for tomorrows tasks. Thank You! You are very welcome, and thank you! This is a very good first project. You may have seen David, the 10 year old boy, in an earlier post make a grappling hook with this technique. I also had my 9 year old do the same thing for his first hot project. I do suggest that you start with the simple 4 piece hook first then move on to more complex arrangements. I got an E-mail the other day from some one that was concerned about having enough experience to take this class in November. No experience is neccessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlotte Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 That is a lovely piece in the thumbnail. Very graceful in balance and proportion. Charlotte Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianbrazealblacksmith Posted August 17, 2009 Author Share Posted August 17, 2009 Thanks, Charlotte. The steps for making it are on the 32nd page of General Discussion under Forge Welded Chandelier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Yesterday I picked up a 2# spool of "gas shield" mild steel mig wire with the intention of using it for bundling when I get that far. It has a copper coating on it. Will that cause any concerns? It is very springy, and I suspect it is very work hardened through drawing during manufacturing. I normalized a few feet on the stove and it became quite soft and bendable. I though mig wire was a better idea than galvanized fence wire. Zinc, high heat, and health do not go together easily. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wedwards Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 I haven't tried it yet but it seems to me that the soft iron "mechanic's wire" available at the farm and ranch stores might work pretty well for that. It's not galvanized or work hardened, and when you bend or wrap with it, it stays pretty much exactly where you put it. Plus you get quite a bit for not very much $$. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianbrazealblacksmith Posted September 9, 2009 Author Share Posted September 9, 2009 wedwards got it right. That is what I use. I didn't know it was called "mechanic's wire". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecelticforge Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Very nice! I have not told you but your work has given me some very good ideas. Thanks for sharing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian.pierson Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Is mechanic's wire the same as bailing wire? The wire used for making hay bails in older farm equipment. Brian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
easilyconfused Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 I assume it is. Baling wire works well either way as it's designed to wrap tight easily. I've also heard it called stove wire for tightening up stove pipes to keep smoke from escaping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
primtechsmith Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 The crane piece just came in the mail at the school...I will have it out at the next meeting if anyone is interested in seeing it first hand. That along with one of his hammers too... Peyton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted September 18, 2009 Share Posted September 18, 2009 Well, I stopped at TSC and there on the shelf was a 2# spool of mechanics wire for $7. It was on a plastic roll and had a suspicious gray color to it. The label didn't say galvanized, and it doesn't look like SS lock wire, I have some of that for the boat. Also on the shelf was a 3 1/2# rebar tie wire in an oily plastic wrapper, no spool, with some rust color showing, also $7. I got the rebar tie wire. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillMag Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 That is really great. How have you done the eyes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GiFerro Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 Hello Brian compliments for your works are really beautiful .... Let me ask you a few questions. if well I understand it is important to leave a little space for the collar right? with a tubular framework would be more complicated settle everything? The collar is welded together with the other irons right? uses to put a little borax before putting the collar? What will change if welding with welding the ends to be joined and did not pose the collar? Forgive me if I ask you these questions, I paid only a few times with the molds, but I had never used a collar before. Hello greetings from Italy. Giancarlo (GiFerro) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianbrazealblacksmith Posted March 20, 2010 Author Share Posted March 20, 2010 I guess I missed a few posts on the road trip. Anyway, here is another forge welded bundle inspired by the recent "18th century candlholder" post. '' Glen, I don't think this stuff is in the right forum. This is not sculpture. It is just examples of how to do something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 I like that a whole lot more than what I came up with! Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianbrazealblacksmith Posted March 20, 2010 Author Share Posted March 20, 2010 I like that a whole lot more than what I came up with! Phil You should see the one Lyle,LDW, made. He did a split cross. I think it was the best approach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted March 20, 2010 Share Posted March 20, 2010 You should see the one Lyle,LDW, made. He did a split cross. I think it was the best approach. Got a pic? I am going to try what I came up with next time I get forge time. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianbrazealblacksmith Posted March 20, 2010 Author Share Posted March 20, 2010 I don't have any pics of Lyles, but here's another one that I did with 3/8"x 1" bar.' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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