TWISTEDWILLOW Posted February 24 Share Posted February 24 Howdy everybody! How’s it been going? it’s been a hot minute since I been on here, been busy busy busy at the new place! I just had a couple of antique swords givin to me about an hour ago, they are heavy on the patina but I can make out Ames MFG (or at least I think I can) lol thats on one side and then some numbers and letters on the other side The only thing I know about swords are that they are pokey on one end and you hold the other end that’s not pokey! Lol im afraid to use anything to awfully abrasive to clean up around the hilts so I can read what they got to say, there’s a lot written there but it’s hard to make out, I’m wanting to do some research on them, what would be the best thing to use to clean up the area with the writing to make it legible? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted February 24 Share Posted February 24 HEY BILLY, good to see your AVATAR again!! If I were wanting to restore or rehab those I'd see what it took to take the hilts and guards off. The blade and tang should be plenty happy with electrolysis just don't leave it too long or it'll start to etch. Cleaning and rehabbing the handle, guard and butt cap shouldn't ge a major job. While electrolysis works well on brass or bronze, NEVER mix metals or weird things start happening say the copper in the brass plates the anode or the sword blade if you do it second. I have no idea if those are worth anything but it'd sure be good practice even if they aren't. How is the new place? The Cochran gang getting settled in? Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted February 24 Share Posted February 24 Glad you & yours are doing fine and welcome to the rabbit hole of sword collecting. I think they are the M1833 model, Dragoon saber used extensively in the ACW so quite old and in very good shape. The words Made by/Ames Mfg. Co/Chicopee/Mass are enclosed within an unraveled scroll, and initials/US/date is stamped on the opposite side of the blade. This scroll mark is usually very weak, and often has been partially worn down by the scabbard—this is a feature that helps in authenticating the sword. Ames has been around since the AWI making swords, bayonets etc. https://www.americanswords.com/sword-identification.html I wouldn't remove the handles as the twisted wire wrapped leather is probably very fragile and it could fall apart. Ask me how I know. A lot of collectors will devalue the sword that has been cleaned up to look like new. I can't control the wind, all I can do is adjust my sail’s. Semper Paratus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 Note: when I said Ames has been around, the family was importing cutlery in the Colonial period, sorry for the confusion. I can't control the wind, all I can do is adjust my sail’s. Semper Paratus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George N. M. Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 The Ames family and company has been around a long time and has been a player in US history. They made lots of tools such as shovels in the 19th century. Between Laramie and Cheyenne at the highest elevation on the transcontinental railroad is 60' high granite pyramid with portraits of Oakes and Oliver Ames whowere brothers who were instermental in financing the Union Pacific Railroad and the laying of the tracks that met the Central Pacific (which was building eastward from Califoria) to meet at Promentory Point, Utah in 1867. Later they were implicated in the Credit Mobilier scandle which IIRC involved bribing members of Congress with UPRR stock and shady dealings with the federal support for the railroad. Here is the wiki article on the Ames Monument. And, yes, I can attest that there is a passage inside that goes around the base. As an old Wyoming caver I have been in it a number of times. The folding entrenching tool I carried in Viet Nam and the one that I carry in the back of my vehicle were made by Ames. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWISTEDWILLOW Posted February 25 Author Share Posted February 25 41 minutes ago, Frosty said: HEY BILLY, good to see your AVATAR again!! Hiya Jerry! Good to be back! 42 minutes ago, Frosty said: How is the new place? The Cochran gang getting settled OH man it’s been a whirlwind and of course knowin my luck everything that could go wrong has! lol we are still settling in, the new garage it still half full of boxes! We got a lot of junk!!!! and I haven’t even started on the steel piles and blacksmithing stuff! I’m not sure I want to actually restore them all shiny or nothin like that just clean them up a bit, I’m afraid I’d mess something up if I tried to disassemble them for super deep cleaning, I just wanna clean up enough to read and maybe get a date, 36 minutes ago, Irondragon Forge ClayWorks said: Glad you & yours are doing fine and welcome to the rabbit hole of sword collecting Thanks Randy! And thank you for the info! don’t worry I’m not gonna mess with the wire or try to remove the hilts, im not sure if they are worth anything but even if they are I’m not interested in selling them at any price, i don’t want to mess with the original stuff i want to keep them as they are and maybe just clean them up a tad 20 minutes ago, George N. M. said: The folding entrenching tool I carried in Viet Nam and the one that I carry in the back of my vehicle were made by Ames That’s so cool!!!! And thanks for the extra information!!! so here at the new place it’s big enough that I’m gonna get MY own room with windows on two wall tons of natural lights light, and I thought it would be cool to make it into a Victorian style study, with a big desk for writing and bookshelves and a big humidor, but I also want to display some antique weapons and some artwork in there, so we come to the swords, I want to display them but I would like to clean up around the writing so I can possibly date them and have the history of them, but probably not go as far as restoring them, anyways thanks for all y’all’s information!!! I’ll have to start reading up all I can about them! it would be really cool if they were from the ACW! There were a couple small battles here locally! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWISTEDWILLOW Posted February 25 Author Share Posted February 25 1 hour ago, Irondragon Forge ClayWorks said: the rabbit hole of sword collecting I would like to find an old Navy sword or cutlass is there any place in our area that you know of where I could start looking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 No places that I know of, about ten years ago I found an original Navy Cutlass on Craig's, list but the seller wanted $1000 for it and wouldn't budge, needless to say I didn't buy it. I used to see them on eBay for less, but most looked like forgeries or some claimed they were replicas. I did buy a replica Scottish Claymore great sword at the Scottish Games in Tulsa a long time ago. I gather the scabbards are not with the swords. I have had some success "cleaning" old blades using dawn dish washing soap on a damp clean rag then rinsing them to get any soap residue off. After drying the blades rub them down with Renaissance wax. I did that on a WWII Japanese Non com officers sword and it looked good without making it look new. If you wanted to go further use some oiled 0000 steel wool and lightly rub the blades until you get the finish you want, then wax them to protect them. That will usually leave them clean but not shiny new. You could also just use the steel wool on the Ricasso to bring out the writing. I can't control the wind, all I can do is adjust my sail’s. Semper Paratus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWISTEDWILLOW Posted February 25 Author Share Posted February 25 45 minutes ago, Irondragon Forge ClayWorks said: I gather the scabbards are not with the swords No Sir I don’t have the scabbards, the swords have been passed down a few times through that family the last owner a Vietnam vet and before him his father a WW2 vet and before him I’m not sure because no one is alive that remembers in that family Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 Just to say, sometimes, Many times cleaning off the patina ruins the value on antiques like swords, bayonets and the like. Just so you know that going in. Not going to say I wouldn't think they would look great cleaned up and displayed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWISTEDWILLOW Posted February 25 Author Share Posted February 25 Das, thank you for the heads up! After some googling i found there’s a book called the Ames sword company by John Hamilton I might try and pick a copy up to learn more on another note while googling swords and whatnot I came across a ww2 Cutlass from a Antique dealer that had bluing and that made me wonder if some swords were blued originally? I guess that could make sense not wanting a shiny flashy blade catching sunlight and attracting unwanted attention on the battlefield, it might have just been that particular model though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les L Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 Twisted, I would start with rubbing it down with penetrating oil and a cotton cloth to see if it would bring out the writing, but leave the patina. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWISTEDWILLOW Posted February 26 Author Share Posted February 26 That’s a good idea Les! I might actually give that a try sometime today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott NC Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 Those are really nice, Billy! I never dreamed I would have sword envy.... On 2/24/2024 at 7:46 PM, TWISTEDWILLOW said: Victorian style study Not to change subject too much but that sounds cool. An old sextant on a hand forged, detailed stand would add a bit of nautical theme. Along with those cutlasses, if you can find them. You could build a chart table, too, as a centerpiece. I better stop now.... Glad you are well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWISTEDWILLOW Posted February 27 Author Share Posted February 27 Howdy Scott! I never thought I’d get into swords either! But now that I have a couple I want more! Lol i like the idea of an old sextant on a shelf, I’ve already been collecting some antique nautical art to hang on the walls! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted March 2 Share Posted March 2 A tip from the art restoration world: first, put a few drops of your chosen soap/detergent in a little water and stir to combine. Then dip the bulb of a cotton swab in the liquid, press it against the side of the container to squeeze out the excess liquid, and then clean a small area about the size of the pad of your thumb. Look at the swab to see how much dirt is coming off and repeat as needed. Make sure to blot off any excess water and wipe each area dry before moving to the next. Continue this process until you’ve cleaned everything that needs cleaning. I would *not* recommend penetrating oil for initial cleaning, as it can sometimes stain leather and it’s impossible to get out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott NC Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 I have no restoration tips, but I will send you some genuine pirate treasure maps. Suitibale for framing or actual use. 3 for a dollar but I will give you a discount. Anybody else interested can send me a PM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWISTEDWILLOW Posted March 5 Author Share Posted March 5 On 3/2/2024 at 2:00 PM, JHCC said: would *not* recommend penetrating oil for initial cleaning, as it can sometimes stain leather and it’s impossible to get out thanks for the tipss? I was wondering what to do about the leather it’s really really dry Scott, That exciting I can wait to see them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George N. M. Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 Billy, for dry leather you may want to try neatsfoot oil. Sometimes leather is so dry and brittle there is no way to bring it back but I have found neatsfoot oil works about the best of anything I have tried. It will darken leather but almost anything will. Trivia factoid: A neat is an old word for a cow. Neatsfoot oil is made by boiling the lower legs (not hooves) of slaughtered cattle and collecting the rendered fat. GNM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 Call a tack shop, we used to buy leather dressing oil for saddles and leather in general. I believe "Neatsfoot oil" is still very high on the list of preferred leather treatments. It will darken light colored leather. WE kept the "special stuff" in the tack room but Mother and Dad tended to believe salesmen so I don't know if it was anything special or what the name was. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWISTEDWILLOW Posted March 6 Author Share Posted March 6 23 hours ago, George N. M. said: A neat is an old word for a cow That’s crazy I never knew that! Jerry, the last saddle shop we had went out of business and auctioned off everything, it was a Massive business they had a huge leather shop and a huge showroom i ment to go to that auction but it came an passed and I totally missed it I was interested in some of the antique leather working stuff As far as the meets foot oil goes I think the feed store carries it but I’ll have to check, if they don’t I can get the hardware store to order some in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott NC Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 Neatsfoot is pretty much available. Check shoe shop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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