Mr Volcano video

[Mikey98118]

Frosty,

I came across that video you wanted to watch again. I think conclusion are about half right and half wrong.

 

Well, I posted the address, and a second later it pasted the video, and then it all went away

And now it's back

[LeeJustice]

Is that single burner the Hero Mikey?

Edit:  Just took a couple clicks to answer my own question, they only have two propane forge models.  Thanks Mikey, please excuse my laziness.  I am taking your advice, thank you.

[Frosty]

I think he suffers a terminology issue here and should have rehearsed a few times.

Maybe taken a look at the video he would've had to change his "conclusions" about the length of dragon's breath, it didn't lengthen significantly until the choke was closed almost completely. At a more questionable settings rich vs. lean is visible i the dragon's breath by it's transparency. You can't see the dragon's breath standing where he was making the video though. 

Pick a terminology and stick with it, of course that's a bit of a quest of mine, I like being able to tell what a person means when they say something without having to quiz them. For example is the interior of the forge an atmosphere or environment? Either works though I prefer atmosphere but that's a matter of choice and doesn't change the meaning. Sticking with one makes things more understandable, it doesn't leave the listener trying to figure out what the difference in meaning is. Hmmm?

The sound of a burner is turbulent atmosphere? I suppose that could describe a type of sound but certainly isn't what causes sound or the orchestra playing Beetoven's 5th is the generating turbulence? Turbulent sound is a symptom if you're dealing with a harmonic, say a torn speaker cone in your Hi Fi. If your burner is producing a harmonic sound it has a problem. Eg some of the home built ribbon burners at low psi or startup. 

I don't think Roy's actually wrong about much but some of his conclusions make me wonder what he's looking at. I'd love to talk to him face to face and find out. 

One thing I'm happy to see in the video is NO GAUGE, he tunes and makes his arguments with examples without one time referring to psi. When he gets (got) his new hose and gauge it believe the educational value will decline. 

Arriving at the correct air fuel ratio had ZERO to do with psi but people get hung up on the "right" psi and all it does is retard their learning curve. Gages do more harm than good in the real world. Recently I was trying to help a forum member tune his burners and no matter how many times I told him to ignore psi. all he could talk about was PSI. PSI was NOT the problem. I don't think there was a problem but I was getting too frustrated to be of any help and had to back out of the conversation.

Frosty The Lucky.

 

[Mikey98118]

I think you had the same overall impression I did about the video. Frankly, I like the guy, and think he is trying to do something worthwhile. But we are both looking at a newbie trying to discuss a subject at we are experts on. I need to watch what I think more closely then to watch for his mistakes

[Jeff68]

If I was looking to purchase a two or three burner forge, something that would be capable of doing forge welding and damascus and maybe swords down the road would the volcano two burner forge be a good forge or is there a better on let's say on amazon?

 

I was originally thinking about building a three burner forge but for that price it might be quicker to order the two burner model?

[Frosty]

Yeah Mike, I'm trying to think of a way to approach him and perhaps give him a more clear idea of what he's trying to say. It's hard to explain something if you don't have the vocabulary or know what effect is masquerading as something else. I really don't want to put him off, there's nothing like getting a blacksmith's back up to bring out the stubborn. 

Welcome aboard Jeff, glad to have you. If you'll put your general location in the header you'll have a better chance of meeting up with  members living within visiting distance. Lots of information is pretty location specific. It's also helpful to read the, "Read This First" post, it's linked at the top of the page. This forum isn't like most forums and nothing like a social media site. Read this first will help you get the most from the thousands of pages of information archived here.

As has been said repeatedly the Mr. Volcano is a darned good forge, the best bang for the buck out there right now. Even a 2 burner forge is generally too much forge even if you're making swords. You can only forge maybe 6" at a time and any high carbon steel heated and  not forged tends to suffer for it. Forging breaks up the grain growth preventing embrittlement so you really don't want to heat more than you can forge. Heating steel to forging temperature causes rapid oxidation on contact with ambient air which causes scaling and burns the carbon from the surface. 

A 2 burner Mr. Volcano will reach welding temperature, especially if you don't use a heavy split fire brick and buy a Morgan Ceramics K-26 insulating split fire brick or heck split one yourself a carpenter's saw will hardly be dulled splitting one.

A Plistex 900 kiln wash will greatly improve it's efficiency and effectiveness. 

Frosty The Lucky.

 

[Jeff68]

Thank you Frosty!

I think I am leaning towards the two burner knowing that most of the time I will only need 1 burner unless maybe doing damascus or forge welding.

I have filled in the location info in my account, I assume that is where you were talking about placing it?

Jeff Burt

Auburn CA

[Jeff68]

I assume the Plistex 900 kiln wash would go  on last, after all of the other setup steps?

[Irondragon Forge ClayWorks]

Correct it is the last layer. Also your location now shows with every post so we won't have to dun ya for it.

[LeeJustice]

I took Mikey's advice and so a single burner Mr. Volcano is on the way to me.  I got 30+ pounds of the waste YSZ powder home and will have to sieve it to remove unwanted material.  It was more contaminated than I had expected.  Following that, I will sometime begin experimenting with the YSZ as an additive to Plistix and perhaps a top dusting, hoping that it will stick.

[Mikey98118]

On 8/23/2022 at 7:49 AM, LeeJustice said:

dit:  Just took a couple clicks to answer my own question, they only have two propane forge models.  Thanks Mikey, please excuse my laziness.  I am taking your advice, thank you.

 You're welcome; all that matters is that you found a way forward. Happy forging to you.

[Jeff68]

I just took Frosty's advice and also ordered a Mr Volcano.  I ordered the double burner Mr Volcano Hero 2.

Where is the best place to order the Plistex 900 kiln wash from?

[LeeJustice]

You can get Plistix right here.  Check IFI store.  I need to PM Glenn soon myself (gotta get paid first) to order some for mine.

[Mikey98118]

You can also order a BXI Ceramic Fiber Thermal Insulation Board(2732 F) - 12'' X 8'' X 0.8'' through Amazon.com for $20, to use a a floor, so long as you put a few coats of Plistex or Kast-O-lite 30 over it (both would be even better). The kiln brick can then serve as a back wall for the forge.

[Jeff68]

Wouldn't I still want to have a sacrificial brick to protect the floor from welding flux?

[Frosty]

Plistex is high alumina and not susceptible to caustics like molten borax based flux. If you put a brick on the floor I highly recommend you use a Morgan Thermal Ceramics K-27 Insulating fire brick I'm not sure but Morgan may be offering slit bricks now as well as standard size. If not you can split it easily with a carpenter's saw and not dull the saw. 

Another good choice for sacrificial floor is kiln shelf.

My forges have Kastolite 30 flame faces and NARB has a Plistex kiln wash as well.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Mikey98118]

Though I have recommended high alumina kiln shelves for years, I don't like the price asked for them these days. A Morgan K26 brick, or small bag of Kast-O-lite 30 gives more bang for our bucks; especially when coated with Plistix.

[Jeff68]

Thanks for the help and reconendations!!

It looks like the Morgan bricks are out of stock until October. It's sounds like Mikey recommended the BXI Ceramic Fiber Thermal Insulation board with a couple coats of Plistex as the floor?  Since I'll be doing Plistex in the forge anyway maybe that's not a bad direction to go??

 Would it make sense to try to use the fire bricks that came with the Mr. Volcano as my back/front walls and see if I can get a coat or two of  Plistex on those also?

Looks at like that board only comes 12x8 inches, my forge is 16 inches but I would think that would be plenty long enough for the floor?

[Frosty]

That'll make a fine floor and using the bricks that came with it for the door baffles is a good use for them. Yes coating them with Plistex ices their cakes nicely. 

Frosty The Lucky.

[Mikey98118]

19 hours ago, Jeff68 said:

It looks like the Morgan bricks are out of stock until October. It's sounds like Mikey recommended the BXI Ceramic Fiber Thermal Insulation board with a couple coats of Plistex as the floor?  Since I'll be doing Plistex in the forge anyway maybe that's not a bad direction to go??

Yes, that is what I'm recommending, and I have bought my own board; it is in the cupboard, just waiting for the next forge build. Remember that it is only rated to 2750 °F, so, Plistix, or Kast-O-lite 30. topped by Plistix is a good idea. Must you have Kast-O-lite 30 beneath the Plistix? Of course not. I'm a well known perfectionist

[Jeff68]

Since I'll have extra refractory from the initial order of the Mr. Volcano I was thinking about putting a layer of that on the board 1st followed by my final coating being the Plistix kilm wash?

[Irondragon Forge ClayWorks]

That would work.

[Mikey98118]

What he said

[Mikey98118]

On 8/25/2022 at 11:14 PM, Frosty said:

Morgan may be offering slit bricks now as well as standard size.

They do, and sellers on eBay offer them.

[Purple Bullet]

After reading all the raves AND ESPECIALLY after learning about the new insulation (low bio persistent, non carcinogenic) I ordered a Hero 2. My original gas forge had cera-wool, which is why I trashed it after damaging the coating and never getting that circular thingy (the round tuit) to repairing it. 

I'm going to try it first as per instructions, with the only change in that I cut off the overhanging bottom firebrick and used it to make a plug for the burner hole that I will probably rarely use. I ran the idea by Mr Volcano tech support and they don't see any problems with that.