Nate Friesema Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 I recently purchased this 209 pound anvil and (Has 1 3 13 markings on it, though they are fading) looking to hopefully ID a maker? I tried to clean it up, but still didn't see anything that could be clearly defined as a maker's mark. Also can't see the underside without un-mounting it (which I plan to do because the angle steel used to mount it doesn't provide a solid mounting option), but I'm hoping the flat-top helps make a positive ID. Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 Flats on the feet, CWT weight stamps; I'd go with Peter Wright. Has the face been milled down or is that one of the variants of a London Pattern? (Check with the ball bearing test please.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 The face is suspiciously flat and level with sharp edges where it's not mushroomed a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 Note where the horn looks like it sticks up a bit at the horn/face interface? My guess is milling and a destroyed anvil. Sure hope they tested it before getting it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate Friesema Posted June 5, 2018 Author Share Posted June 5, 2018 22 minutes ago, ThomasPowers said: Note where the horn looks like it sticks up a bit at the horn/face interface? My guess is milling and a destroyed anvil. Sure hope they tested it before getting it! You betcha! For the price, it was worth the potential that it was salvage-able. Seemed like a worthwhile cause at the time; seeing it in daylight has me wondering if it's worth/capable of being fixed now. 41 minutes ago, Daswulf said: The face is suspiciously flat and level with sharp edges where it's not mushroomed a bit. Definitely ground down - was hoping the remaining steel was enough to salvage it. 46 minutes ago, ThomasPowers said: Flats on the feet, CWT weight stamps; I'd go with Peter Wright. Has the face been milled down or is that one of the variants of a London Pattern? (Check with the ball bearing test please.) Tested when picked up - got a good 80% rebound on "most" of anvil (where plate remained). Significantly less when the ball was dropped on the few wrought iron pieces showing through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 Oh, dear. I hope you didn't overpay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 Well the entire hardened face plate is gone leaving only wrought iron. It Can be fixed but not inexpensively. There are many ways to do it wrong, I have heard the Robb Gunther method is a good way to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 You haven't put your location in your profile settings, so we can't recommend anyone near you who does anvil repair. Please do so now, and while you're at it, READ THIS FIRST!!! Welcome to IFI! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate Friesema Posted June 5, 2018 Author Share Posted June 5, 2018 6 minutes ago, JHCC said: Oh, dear. I hope you didn't overpay. Was reasonable enough that I didn't mind having a 200 lb paperweight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 You must have strong winds where you live. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate Friesema Posted June 5, 2018 Author Share Posted June 5, 2018 5 minutes ago, JHCC said: You haven't put your location in your profile settings, so we can't recommend anyone near you who does anvil repair. Please do so now, and while you're at it, READ THIS FIRST!!! Welcome to IFI! Thank you, I believe I have fixed it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 Last time I was present when an anvil that had been face milled was repaired it took over 5 hours of welding by a professional welder using industrial equipment and a lot of grinding media---don't forget the preheat too!. So not cost effective to have it done professionally. If you can do it yourself and get a good deal on consumables you can have a good anvil but there will be substantial costs involved in the repair: electricity, rod/wire, grinding media, TIME, propane for preheat, etc...(the one I mention above was done at an ABANA affiliate "anvil repair day" a great way to get expertise at a low cost! My 400#'r was the other anvil at that workshop. It had air arc gouges on the face after abuse by a copper mine maintenance crew. I only paid for the consumables for my anvil...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate Friesema Posted June 5, 2018 Author Share Posted June 5, 2018 2 minutes ago, ThomasPowers said: Last time I was present when an anvil that had been face milled was repaired it took over 5 hours of welding by a professional welder using industrial equipment and a lot of grinding media---don't forget the preheat too!. So not cost effective to have it done professionally. If you can do it yourself and get a good deal on consumables you can have a good anvil but there will be substantial costs involved in the repair: electricity, rod/wire, grinding media, TIME, propane for preheat, etc...(the one I mention above was done at an ABANA affiliate "anvil repair day" a great way to get expertise at a low cost! My 400#'r was the other anvil at that workshop. It had air arc gouges on the face after abuse by a copper mine maintenance crew. I only paid for the consumables for my anvil...) Good to know! I'm new to the forum and smithing as a whole, so I appreciate the ABANA affiliate advice! Based on convos with various folks around me before purchasing this, I was lead to believe if it was ground down to just the wrought iron it could still be used for some light work - is that "fake news"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the iron dwarf Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 maybe some light work on pewter or lead but be careful not to miss or you will mess it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 Sure you can use it; it just won't be as good as a 200 pound chunk of steel from the scrapyard. The hardy hole, pritchel hole and the horn will still be useful tools. I might have gone as much as US$1 a pound for it and hope to hit up another repair day some year. (Of course I have a number of good anvils in good condition already and have an allowance to spend on my vices/vises/stuff I want!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the iron dwarf Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 imagine a level area of loose sand or dirt with a half inch thick layer of concrete on it now imagine hitting that all day with a 14 pound sledge hammer what do you think will happen? this is what happens when you have a thin hard layer over soft wrought iron, your ball bearing was not enough to damage it and it still bounced. a thin layer of hardfacing will do the same. repairing this will cost a bit unless you only want a garden ornament Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate Friesema Posted June 5, 2018 Author Share Posted June 5, 2018 Just now, the iron dwarf said: imagine a level area of loose sand or dirt with a half inch thick layer of concrete on it now imagine hitting that all day with a 14 pound sledge hammer what do you think will happen? this is what happens when you have a thin hard layer over soft wrought iron, your ball bearing was not enough to damage it and it still bounced. a thin layer of hardfacing will do the same. repairing this will cost a bit unless you only want a garden ornament Very good analogy! Helps make my decision to throw it up on Craigslist as a lawn ornament or something someone else can pay to repair much easier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 If I had it I'd use it for the horn and hardy hole and find a chunk of steel to use as the anvil until something better came along. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlblohm Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 Forge welding a new face on would be the best way to repair it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 Well as much trouble as they had forge welding the face on with decades of experience smithing and superb support; perhaps not the "best" way for someone starting out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlblohm Posted June 6, 2018 Share Posted June 6, 2018 It is the best way to do it none the less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 6, 2018 Share Posted June 6, 2018 I believe a full penetration arc weld is better given how many forge welded faces have failed over the years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tanglediver Posted June 6, 2018 Share Posted June 6, 2018 With proper heat control, and good consumables, arc welding is certainly doable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC Hammer Posted June 6, 2018 Share Posted June 6, 2018 Yup, first thing I was told by a farrier friend when he saw pictures of my anvil was "Nice anvil, you need to take it to a machine shop to get the face milled and edges ground to sharp corners." Thankfully, I'd been reading everything I could find on this forum about anvils and knew his advice was a death warrant for my new anvil. I say this because it's likely the person who had it before you was given the same advice. What a shame, but what is done is done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 6, 2018 Share Posted June 6, 2018 I've seen an amazing number of anvils seriously damaged or with their usability destroyed by "Master" Machinists or Weldors. I've decided that being master of a different craft does not mean you know SQUAT about blacksmithing and how anvils were/are made (I know about half a dozen ways anvils have been made just in the last 200 years...); or used. "Practical Blacksmithing", Richardson, published over 120 *years* ago says: "For my own part I am satisfied not only that sharp edges are useless, but they are also destructive of good work. I cannot account for their existence except as a relic of a time when the principles of forging were but little understood." Vol 1 page 111 Folks get all tied up into what they think rather than taking time to learn what is correct...so my basic take on working on a new to you anvil: "FIRST: DO NO HARM!" In 37 years of smithing I have actually seen several anvils where I would advise milling the face; I think the count is up to 3 now; vs the thousands of other used anvils I have seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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