MouaChan Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Hello, I was wondering if any of you would happen to have any knowledge of how I would go about learning blacksmithing as a college student. I want to have my own shop but I do not own a house only renting in my college town. Are there a such thing as a portable forge or something like that? could it be fashioned out of something? stuff like that would be nice know how for me. Then there's the thing about if any of you are in the Wisconsin Badgers Blacksmithing and if you could share some information about that with me I emailed them and have not received a response for a week or so now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Acualy there are portable forges, are you rent a house or appartment? One can build, scrounge a "kit" that will fit in the trunk of yout car. If you get the idea of a 150# londan pattern anvil and brick forge out of your head a small neo- iron age set up will work well somthing as small as a popcorn/cookie tin with an air bed inflator and a large sledge hammer head would serve you for most viking area type rorge work (or begener prodjects) i can forge 1 1/2" stock in a 4" fire ball, tho 1" is better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Perhaps Patrick will chime in; He started smithing while living in a dorm room! For a small set up you can have everything fit in a 5 gallon bucket and yes that is forge, anvil and tools! Look up "1 fire brick forge" and "Bean Can forge" Does the website for that group have a members list? Better trying to contact members from it than form many times quite out of date websites. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSW Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 You would be amazed what I managed to do in college out of a dorm room or efficiency apartment. My freshman year I was one of only two students on my dorm floor with any tools and I had a full set of hand tools as well as the basic corded tools ( circular saw, drill, sawzall, belt sander and palm sander). I had all sorts of people stopping by to borrow stuff. The next year added the 12" bench top bandsaw. 1" belt sander, 6" disk/4" belt sander, 12" planer ( ran it in the hall way of the design studio) small table saw... 2 100' extension cords let me toss the cord out the window from the 2nd floor if need be to run tools in the quad ( they got a bit cranky about all the shavings in the hall way after running the planer for some reason... ) 3rd year saw the addition of the 110v mig and OA torch ( I welded/brazed together one of the models for my design class)... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njanvilman Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Do you have any basic skills? Have you wielded a hammer on hot metal yet? Do you own any blacksmith tools? Go on line and look at some of the videos about 'primitive' blacksmith all over the world. You do not need an anvil, a truck axle standing upright will work. A couple of hammers and tongs, and a heat source, and you will be forging. There are many blacksmiths in Wisconsin. Perhaps someone on this list will chime in and offer you some forge time in exchange for help of some sort. Getting tutored will save you a lot of time trying to figure it all out yourself. Go to a hammer-in and watch and take notes. And spend many hours searching and reading some of the 400,000 posts on IFI. There is a wealth of information here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim S. Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 Don't overlook your options on campus- smithing facilities may be present in the Art or design departments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibrariaNPC Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 njanvilman brings up a good number of questions to ask yourself: you'll want to have some of the basic skills before you get started (but experimenting can be fun!), and you should be prepared for some trial and error, even if you prepare with plenty of researched (I'm learning THAT part the hard way). If it helps, I'm in a similar situation with renting a small apartment with strict rules (township wants a picture-perfect suburbia, for example), so I feel the pain. Depending on what you want to make and how you feel like going about it, you can get away with a bucket or you'll need to move up to a shop. I have a five gallon galvanized steel tub that can hold everything I need and acts as my water quench bucket (I have a turkey fryer for oil quench) and a tool belt mounted to my "stump" to allow easy access to the tools I use most often (3 hammers, 2 tongs, wire brush and punches). My tools consist of the aforementioned stuff on the tool belt, a cordless grinder, a cordless drill, a small table and anvil stand I built with my uncle, a 134# Hay Budden anvil, a drill press vice, infrared thermometer, turkey fryer, bucket, and a forge (commercial). I've heard of people starting with much less and getting the same results. Primitive Blacksmithing is an interesting approach and makes you get creative with what you have; I was looking into the option of stump/stake anvils as a low-cost, low-space alternative before I was given a really good deal on a Hay Budden anvil. I'm still considering the investment for a portable anvil for whenever I do hammer sessions with some friends out of state. There are a number of ways of making a forge that fits into the "primitive" criteria (viking forges are pretty cool, honestly), but it's a matter of preference and what you can get away with. Before you start building, do you research, know what you want to make smithing-wise (at least for now), and most importantly: know what you can get away with in your area. For example, if you are renting property owned by the university (like a dorm), they may not allow you to have anything that generates heat, could be a weapon or could be explosive within the building. If you are renting off campus, you just have to worry about noise ordinances (look that up ASAP), space (for fuel and where to store the forge), and other environmental issues (will people complain about lots of coal smoke?). Knowing your projects helps with what you are making. A single brick gas forge is great for small projects (letter openers, knives, tapers/spikes, chisels, snakes and the like), but has a number of limitations (limited space for heating for scrolls, limited overall space for material). My first and second forges were variations of the two-brick forge with different internal spaces, but they weren't big enough for railroad spikes, not long enough for heat treating, and too fragile for my taste (one severely cracked while in use and made the burner too loose to be safely uses). Personally, if I were making another gas forge, I'd do the coffee/paint can forge. Gives you a good size, easier to mount the burners and would have probably been cheaper in the long run. Granted, you'll probably need to make a burner (prepare to need more tools) or buy one, but trust me on this: it's MUCH better to get a proper burner than to use a burnzomatic torch (I spent a good $200 on just torches/burners before I finally had one that worked). A friend mentioned getting a weed burner, but I can't tell you how well that'll work. . . I may not have the same experience as the others here, but I'm hoping you can learn from my recent mistakes and experiences as a fellow beginner. Good luck and happy forging! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 Break down the "forge" in to the 4 basic compnents, heating apliace, or foge. Iron age/Viking era forges typicaly heated a 4" section with charcoal. Hard wood lump works, but I prefer soft wood. So somthing to contain a fire ball about the size of your two fists put to gether and an airsuply (if your using solid fuel) a 20 dollar batery operated airmatrise inflater (i have a hand pumped one) a bit of pipe and the grill at the local park, or a hibatchi or... The one or two brick forge is an option as well. Then what to rest the hot seel on, or anvil. Again in the steel/iron poor past anvils were small, a large sledge hamer head, a broken (over the road) truck axle, a 6" section of heavy gage rail, a 4" block of steel etc. you do need to think about a stand/ mount but for small projects a milking stool or setting on your butt, your tools, small forge and anvil all with in arms reach works. But often a landscape retaining wall presents itself as a work bench. So now we need somthing to hold the steel and somthing to hit it with, starting out a 2# hammer will get you into plenty of trouble. Look up how to properly face it, and what profile(s) to look for. Tongs beet vice grips all to heck (unless you radicaly rework the jaws and instal a long bolt as a longer handle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 As the grimlins wont let me edit, let me ad, if you have a pick up then finding a place to forge and store tools becomes some what simplified, as farriers (horshoers to the unwashed masses) have been working out of our trucks and trailers for years. Tho a small anvil on your tailgate is less than ideal (mounted in your receiver hitch tho...) Remember to practis extream safty measures in public spaces. Baricades to keed bystanders at a minimum safe distance is a requirement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGGUNDOCTOR Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 I agree with Tim, check on campus first. Welding,and art departments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouaChan Posted February 8, 2015 Author Share Posted February 8, 2015 sorry i havent been replying but i just got done reading all the tips. I'll get more specific with my needs sorry i didnt do this the first time aha. so I did look on campus and im sure they wont let me play around with a forge and start forging knives because thats what I really want to learn to do is handforge knives and weapon. As of right now I have no other application for forging yet cause like I said I do not own my own home im renting and constantly changing houses and im pretty sure they wont let me have a forge in the basement or nothing like that. Another thing is Im not looking for an anvil and furnace and what not I just wanted to know if there are things I could pick up to use as a anvil and furnace. I drive a 05 camry so i wouldnt want to put too much weight in my car it'll kill the shocks i just need something easily moveable in the case that I pick up and move to another house or apartment. Thanks again for all the help i will keep in mind all of what you guys have said. oh and my experience is none and i have tried to contact the close by blacksmiths and dont seem to get any response any of you know the WI blacksmiths? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Okay, go back to the arts department and see if they have a forging setup. If you wish to be successful forging knives you might want to learn to forge first. Would you want to enter a NASCAR race before you learned to drive a Camry? I could load most of my kit in your Camry and not hurt it, provided I kept it dirty side down that is. A perfectly serviceable propane forge can weigh as little as a couple lbs. Then add a couple Bernzomatic cylinders and a torch you got the forge. The passenger side floorboards will easily support my 206lb. Trenton without damaging the car. Just be aware a roll over accident is likely to be fatal with that size chunk of iron tumbling around in there with you. Hmmmm, let's see a piece of carpet to protect the seat and seat belts to hold it in and a moderate anvil will ride shotgun with you safely enough. I still disccommend rolling the car on general principles. Hammers, tongs, chisel, hacksaw, files, brush, etc. some stock, says . . . plastic bucket to me. How are you going to keep seat belts on an anvil size piece of steel? Duct tape the belts to it after giving it an extra wrap. Or belt it in and tie the belts to it with rope, wire or a couple hose clamps. Ah, I'm just funnin with you there really isn't a good way to keep a seat belt on something like an anvil, block of steel, etc. in an accident. Pick up a child car seat for a couple bucks at a thrift store, yard sale, church rummage sale, etc. Just remember to face the seat backwards and cinch it in really close and tight. And don't hit anything. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSW Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Looks like they have some sort of Makers space where you have your location listed. Some of these places have a fair selection of tools and equipment available for use. You'd need to see what sorts of equipment they have available for use where you are at. I doubt a forge is available, but OA torches or other tooling that might be useful like welders grinders or sanders might make your need for general equipment easier to deal with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 You can never tell; I know the one in Columbus Ohio has both forge and foundry---friends of mine teach there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njanvilman Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 I have carried 250 lbs of anvils in the trunk of my Corolla without hurting the car. They are always just above the axle oak board across in front of them. Think of it as two kids sitting in the back seat. No harm to the car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John McPherson Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 A quick search of your area shows that UW-Stout has a BFA program including metals, as well as a Welding program at Chippewa Valley Tech. Go in person, be polite and talk to the Instructors and Lab Facilitators in both programs, they certainly know most of the players in the area. Any skills that you pick up in any type of metalwork can be scaled up or down as needed. Once you get past the blade forging, finishing, handles and sheaths are more art than brute force. Having an eye for design is what separates RR spike knives and zombie choppers from the big leagues. Casting of guards and pommels is its own art form. Welding, even just to build shop fixtures, is always useful. I used to put my entire demo kit in the back of a Honda Accord station wagon, with room for passengers. 100lb anvil & stand, small table, tabletop rivet forge & blower, vise, slack tub (ice cream maker bucket), and drywall bucket of essential tools. I went out of my way to get portable tools just for a demo kit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LibrariaNPC Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 I've been able to put my entire setup, with stock, in my 2013 Veloster, which only has a bit more space than my old 96 Civic. I also used said Civic for moving, and you'd be surprised with just how much you can put in there weight wise without causing an issue; as long as you aren't off-roading with a couple thousand pounds, you should be okay! Also, as I previously noted in my post: I also rent and cannot make modifications to my apartment. Everything I use for smithing (forge, anvil, tools, etc) is hauled in and out every day I plan on working. As long as you have an empty space to work with, whether it's a yard, driveway, etc, you'll be able to set up shop. As for "picking things up" to act as the anvil and forge, you've gotten a good bit of that information here in this thread. An anvil is nothing more than a solid, hardened material that you can do your work on. I've read about people using heavy chunks of granite as an anvil with some success. If you don't want to buy an actual anvil, go out and try to find something that could still fulfill the same purpose; check out shops that make headstones and ask for junked stone that is large/heavy enough for your needs, or you can hit a scrapyard and find some railroad track or an I-beam, but you'll need to do some work to get that to work out for you. As for a forge, it's not something you can just "pick up" at a local store (at least not around me). If you're trying to do it "on the cheap," you can either take the advice of those that gave input on making a viking forge (if you can work with coal), or considering making your own gas forge. In your situation, I'd for with the gasser, but that's just my opinion. There are MANY instructions out there for making a One Brick Forge, which is nothing more than a single refractory brick, some refractory cement/clay, and a torch (about $40-$60 depending on your suppliers). I went with a Two Brick Forge (I can send you a link for the design) with a Bernzomatic TS8000 (totaled around $100 without fuel or attachments). I was able to make an 8 inch knife out of it, but doing more than a basic heat treat of the blade was out of the question; if I made something smaller blade-wise, though, it would have been perfect. Also, as Frosty mentioned, you'll probably want to start with something different if you don't have instruction. I lucked out and had a good teacher that focuses on bladesmithing, so I started by working with him for a class before even trying to forge a blade on my own. Shaping can get dicey, and heat treating is a challenge when you aren't certain of the process. If you're really adamant about it, be prepared for a lot of reading, but it's doable! One of the best suggestions for someone in your position that wants to learn how to make knives: Wayne Goddard's $50 Knife Shop. It's severely dated in some areas, but it has a lot of tips and tricks for getting started out with only a few tools and a very small space. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouaChan Posted February 9, 2015 Author Share Posted February 9, 2015 Sweet thanks everyone I'll run off and go talk around and hopefully I'll be forging by summertime this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 First, an iron/vicking age forge burn charcoal, not coal. A solid fuel forge desends from those "holes in the ground" The trick is to think of a simple and mobile setup, so you can take it some where you can forge. The idea behind the viking/iron age forge is that they are simple and the anvils are relitively small as are the forges Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caintuckrifle Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 I highly recommend Wayne Goodards "50 Dollar Knife Shop" he talks a lot about how to get started on the cheap in a small space. I think you would really enjoy and learn a lot from it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 I don't know if the pic attached edits or not. Anyway, just on the chance it does, this is me repairing a bent log tong. It's a wood fire with a Coleman Inflate all, 12v mattress, boat, etc. inflater. (The bright yellow thing in the sun behind me) a piece of 1"+/- pipe maybe 18" long for the blast. The "anvil" is a birch log. My goal originally was to just straighten the bent tong but when I got it where it was supposed to be I discovered the set was off and it needed a little smooshing to get it right. So, I not only did some hot bending on a wooden anvil I actually did some forging on a green wood block. If I'd realized it needed forging I would've walk a little ways and grabbed a boulder. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSW Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Frosty as a real Alaskan, when you got done with this you wrestled a few grizzly bears to work the kinks out, before catching a beaver and using it to gnaw down a few cords of wood, while your wife chased down a caribou on foot and brought it back to camp to help you drag all that wood home.... Or maybe I've been watching too much of the Discovery Channel.... LOL :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Frosty illistrates the fact that a very simple setup will work, and it ilistrates you dont neet the facy shop setups that you see on youtube. The "hole" in the ground can easaly be a popcorn can set on an old barstool or a wooden box with folding legs. Depending on your skill at scrounging and your budget you can go to walmart or lowes and score most everything you need for a $100. If you scrounge around much less. (Pallets make more than coffee tables for poor colage kids) a small self contained forge can set on a picknick table at the park, and a stand that holds a sledgehamer head will work to get you an anvil. Some places you can score 2" bridge bolts, dandy little anvil. Just file the markings off and file diferent radie on the 6 edges. But if you keet thinking either the big forges, london patern anvils or shops your stuck, think taigate party. Small forge (swords were/are forged 6" at a time) small "anvil" (yes a granit coble will work, but lets go with a lump of steel, say 10# as an abselute min, 40# is good to keep it easy to cary in said 5 gallon bucket. Many third world smiths use 10-20# slege hamer heads, for years pakistane exported handforged forceps, hemistats and scalpels, and many imported kurkeries are still forged on such simple setups) a 2 1/2# crosspein (aproperatly dressesd) and a 2# ball pein will get you started with hammers. Tongs are a good progrect for a beginer. So now, scout around for places you can forge, city parks? Vacant lots? A friends drive way? In public portable fence posts with cattion tape is a real good idea. So a compleat kit that ways less than I do is not hard (or expesive) to come buy. This isnt rocket sceince, we have been at this for a few thousand years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouaChan Posted February 10, 2015 Author Share Posted February 10, 2015 Nice frosty I knew you could really use anything as an anvil but for some reason I forgot about tree stumps and logs... thanks I think I found my anvil now aha. I was thinking of buying a metal bucket and then just cutting a hole for a bellow of some sort and putting in fire bricks? would that work? I would square out the bucket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MouaChan Posted February 10, 2015 Author Share Posted February 10, 2015 Oh another thing is I would prefer to stay away from gas forges because I feel like having to pay for a torch and all isnt the way I wanna go about it Id prefer a bellow and coal or charcoal or wood kind of forge unless you guys can find me a cheap way or give me price range on refilling gas and how long they last ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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