Rainbows Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Got this I beam free from local steel supplier, I think its thanks for buying beer for them at christmas. Would it make a good anvil? It weighs ~40kg (~100lb) and measures by 622mm long, 200mm wide and 215mm high (24.5x8.125x8.5"). Failing being an anvil if anyone has other suggestions for what to make with it feel free to suggest them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njanvilman Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 What you have looks to be a H beam, usually used for vertical columns. Lacking anything else, it could be used on the flat, but would do better if you stood it up, buried part of it in the ground, and were able to put a thick steel top plate on it. Better yet, if you can find a piece of railroad track to attach to the steel plate. You will find that if you use it as it sits, it will be very noisy and the rebound will not be too good. But others have begun with a lot less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmccustomknives Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Like he said, better to use is as a base for something better. If you did work on it as an anvil we could probably hear you across the pond. :unsure: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainbows Posted January 17, 2015 Author Share Posted January 17, 2015 I doesn't work as well in this font, I,looks better. I do have a wrought iron anvil of similar weight, the thing is the heel is still on it but is cracking off. If I could turn the I/H beam into cutlers anvil of sort, no horn but pritchel and hardie holes, it might save the heel falling off entirely on my current anvil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njanvilman Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 If your anvil is about to fail anyway, why don't you try to V out the crack with a grinder, and weld it up. It might save it for a while. The crack would probably eventually propagate through the weld, but it could probably buy you a few years of use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JNewman Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 I started with something similar but probably about 50% the weight. Go ahead and start with it, it will get you started but look for a solid block, The overhanging sides of the beam will be springy and you will lose a lot of energy to them. For most of your forging you don't need that big a surface so even a smaller weight with all the weight under your hammer will give you better rebound. That being said hang onto your I beam. When I moved 20 years ago I scrapped my I beam because I was using a London Pattern anvil by then. I found I missed having the I beam because occasionally it was the perfect tool. The large flat face handy for flattening things like scrolls and the edge makes a great bridge tool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaughnT Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Even with the heel about to come off, your anvil is a far better anvil than this h-beam will ever be. Most folks have a rough time with an anvil only because they don't have the anvil solidly mounted to the earth. As NJanvilman noted, a broken anvil is only broken so long as you don't attempt a repair. I would clean out the notch and have a pro weld it up securely. The small amount invested in repairing the anvil would be worth it. Any hardy tools can be mounted in a sturdy vise. You do have a stout vise, don't you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainbows Posted January 17, 2015 Author Share Posted January 17, 2015 Don't trust myself to be able to weld it well with my minimal skill and budget welder, local professional fabricator says he wouldn't know how to weld genuine wrought iron. My current plan without the I beam is to have tools with an L shaped handle. The handle goes into the hardie as usual for keeping it in place but then the business end is offset to be above the centre of the anvil so that no stress it put on the heel. Dunno how well that would work as a tool or as a way to prolong heel life but I might try to make one. I can't double check now but I think the I beam is too small to mount my current anvil on, would probably be a better material than the current stand if it did fit. The large, flat surface might be good for straightening long stuff out as jnewman mentioned, its a fair bit bigger than the face of my current anvil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGGUNDOCTOR Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Weld thick plates to both ends. Then you can just flip it so it best suits the work being done. On end for heavy blows, on it side for lighter ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 If you stayed over the center web it wouldn't be too bad, loud though. Stood on end and working on the small bit where the two plates join would get a lot of mass under your work too. Also started off with a section of I beam, about 75 lbs with really thick webs. Drilled a pritchel and ground out a notch for bending. Clamped a jackhammer bit to it once for a horn as well, and worked like that for a year till I found a Peter Wright Nice idea with the offset hardy shanks. There's times I'd rather have a bottom swage over the anvil's waist rather than at the heel. That I beam is holding my slack tub at a convenient height now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njanvilman Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 You could do the end plates, and also weld vertical stock connecting the webs, making it more of a box. This would help the deflection that will happen , and deaden the noise a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainbows Posted January 17, 2015 Author Share Posted January 17, 2015 Would pouring lead into the cavity between the plates and the beam work to give it better rebound? I got one of those lead workers ladles sitting around somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Lots of experience speaking out here, I think most of us have used a piece of structural steel as an anvil at one tie or another, sometimes the situation determines what we have to use. I'll try not to get pedantic but you have a piece of "Wide flange" sometimes called "H" if it's a piling. The wide sections are the "Flanges" the section connecting them is the "Web". I'm not being a member of the semantics police but it does help if we're all using the same names so we know what we're saying. Laid flat the only effective place to forge will be over the web. The wide heal like unsupported space of the flanges can be handy for clamping. You can also make clips that can be driven onto the edge of the flanges to hold stock, think horizontal hold fasts. Standing it on edge will serve a whole lot better and boxing the flanges in will help a lot, on the flat or end. If all you can find is a piece of plate that only partially covers the end, that's okay. The exposed ends of the web or flanges make for really handy bottom tools. first off would be a hardy, then a butcher, fullers of various radii and whatever your imagination comes up with. Just some grinder work and you can have all kinds of goodies you don't need a hardy hole for. If you saddle your bottom tools you can use them on your cracked anvil without threatening it. A saddle is nothing more than little flanges on the bottom of your bottom tools to keep them from sliding off the anvil's face or twisting in use. They're really effective for bending forks and cutting plates. I have no experience to offer welding wrought iron but I can't help but offer my departure point were it my anvil. I'd grind the crack out completely, to the bottom and beyond. I'd then use a low hydrogen, low carbon rod and run it hot. Overheating isn't going to damage the wrought so the heat effect zone isn't there. Extra heat will let the rod and base metal allow a chance to cool slowly and have a lower chance of embrittlement. Preheating the anvil can't hurt and might help so I'd bring it to 350-400f, just because. Please bear in mind I've never welded wrought though I HAVE burned a LOT of rod. I have read a number of posts here and elsewhere by folk who have and do and that's the basis of my ideas. I'd for sure be picking the brains of folk who have or even claim to have welded wrought. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njanvilman Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Lead would not help what you are doing. First, it would take a LOT of lead. If you have that much lead laying around, scrap it for $$ and buy a good anvil. Secondly, it would make your lead filled beam VERY heavy. And the lead would probably not help support the beam any, just make it quieter. Boxing it in would help, if you can get some good welding done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everything Mac Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Where abouts in the North West are you? I have some RR track you could have. The real anvil is way better even with its defects. All the best Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainbows Posted January 17, 2015 Author Share Posted January 17, 2015 Thanks for the offer but making a railroad anvil would probably be more effort than repairing the heel of the anvil and most railroad anvils I have seen don't have a good hardie which is what I need most. Boxing it in and welding plate to the end seems to be a common idea so I will be sure to do that as soon as convenient. I like frostys idea of bottom tooling with the end of it, gonna give that a try. Dunno how long a mild steel hardy that thin will last but the fun of it being free is it can be an experiment. Frosty do you have any images of those clips/ horizontal hold fasts? I think I know you mean like but it never hurt to clarify. Maybe I could cut a hole in the middle of the web and flog it on ebay as a antique vintage rare bridge anvil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 You'd be surprised how long hardies ground in webs and flanges last, a proper hardy isn't really hard steel. HOT hardy that is for a cold cut I'd recommend a good cold chisel till you find a cold hardy. Just weld a piece of square steel tubing into the angle of the web and flange for a hardy hole. No I don't have images of the clips I mentioned. I was writing and remembered clips an old welder used to bend up out of rd. stock to hold various shapes to plate and flanges to weld. I'd have to sit, draw and model the things and it's been more than 30 years. However, if you visualize a large hair pin made from 1/2" (to choose a size) round. The gap between the legs is just less than the thickness of the flange or maybe has a large semi circular bend like a hitch pin. A hitch pin itself would hold some stuff that wasn't too thick or. . . If the upper part of the hold fast version were tall with a foot like a pritchel type hold fast. Hmmmm? It'd need something to prevent it from rolling over but a T bar on the under side ought to do? I popped off a mental picture of a tool based on a tool I'd seen decades ago. I have no idea if or how well it'd work on structural steel anvil but it might be worth a try. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CKillgore Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Well my shop is a bit of a mess right now as I'm doing some re-organizing, but... A couple things I use I-beams for... 1. I dropped my gas forge down in one. It's a pretty decent platform for building attachments to your forge off of. You can see a simple work rest that slides back and forth on the beam that I made. Sorry about the blurry image. Just realized it. 2. They make nice horizontal quench tanks for heat treating tools or knives. I just welded some plates on the end and filled em up with oil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptree Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I have arc welded some wrought. When welded with either stick or MIG the slag inclusions melt and run out so you end up adding lots of extra filler metal. The Trenton anvils were arc welded late in the later models. They welded the at the center of the waiste to join the top and the cast bottom. I would Vee out the crack, preheat to about 400F or so and start welding. A mig will work. Even better is oxy/fuel using what else as filler? Wrought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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