How to draw out steel?

[USANewbie]

In your own words could you please tell me how to draw out steel on the far side of the anvil? I have a video on it but I want to make sure I properly understand it. It creates nicks in the  bar that i have to pound out on the  face of the anvil. I would like to avoid that if I can. Thank you.

[arkie]

I don't believe a description will be as easy to follow as will a visual.  Try to view some YT videos by Technicus Joe (Joey van der Steeg) a member here, Brian Brazeal, or Black Bear Forge (John Switzer).  They have excellent videos on far side drawing out.  You will get dents and dimples, but they can show you how to work those out.

[Irondragon Forge ClayWorks]

Are the nicks caused by the anvil with sharp edges? If they haven't been radiused that may be part of your problem.

[Chad J.]

What Irondragon says.   I don't remember, do you have an anvil or an improvised anvil?  

I don't tend to work the far side of the anvil a much as I do the horn or using my diagonal peen hammer.  When I do it's half faced blows with my rounding hammer turned slightly toward the edge of the anvil to make use of the side radius.  I use the end of the heat, dull red to black, for planishing blows with my hammer.  Heat, beat, and repeat.  When I get close to finishing I lighten up the blows and try to even it out more. 

[USANewbie]

Thanks Arkie, i watched the video by Joey van der Steeg, Blackbear forge and another person. That's where i learned it from.

IronDragon. The edges are not sharp but maybe they are not as round as they should be, but I'm not sure

Chad J. I have a shop built anvil

[Daswulf]

Pretty sure Technicus Joe explains this in one of his videos. One I think of is on making tongs from rr spikes and drawing out the reins. 

As is mentioned, you'll likely want radiused edges on the anvil. Yes you'd have to flatten out the bar on the face. Same with using the horn. The depth of the nicks in the steel depend on the radius on the edge of your anvil or horn really. If you have a sharp edge it will obviously dig in more. 

One key is to stop before the size stock you want to end up with and flatten and or round accordingly. It is just a faster method. You could just lengthen on the flat of the face but it is slower. Its all in what you prefer. Gaining length on the far edge is efficient but more cleanup, on the flat it is slower but less cleanup after. Once efficient like Technicus Joe shows, you could do way more in one heat vs. many heats. No real wrong way as long as you get the metal moved the way you want it. 

[USANewbie]

Thanks  Daswulf.  I like the idea of drawing out steel quickly, but i do a cleaner job of it on the horn. I need a lot more practice with this far side of the anvil method.

I just had an idea, i could try this method out on my other anvil, its made from a rail track and has more rounded edges.  The face is very rough but it will work to help me understand if my other anvil has too sharp of corners.

[Daswulf]

Go for it. If you have the time to experiment its great in learning. 

[ThomasPowers]

When I have a long way to go with a taper I like to draw it on the horn using a hammer peen with a large radius and flip it with every heat to keep the top and bottom even and smoother; perhaps every now and then doing a cleanup run on the flat face of the anvil if it needs one.

[USANewbie]

Thanks Daswulf, ThomasPowers. I keep watching these taper/drawing out videos.  I just watched another one by Alec Steel. I'm determined to understand and learn how to use the far and near side of the anvil to make tapers and bars. If i can master this technique i will have accomplished something.

[BillyBones]

Look up "Black Metal Studio" on the youtube. Will Bastis (? spelling) presents it. He only has about 10 or so videos but the 1st set is him making a set of tongs. 8 hours of tong making total, cut into 8 or 9 videos. He does not edit the videos at all. If he makes a mistake you see it, no editing for time. Which i like becuase a lot of videos give me a false impression of how long something actually takes to do.  The lessons are arranged like the 1st set is 1.1, then 1.2, 1.3 etc. The second would be 2.1, 2.2 etc. I believe it is lesson 1.5.5 that he explains how he radiused the edges of his anvil. He gives some really in depth info on the why's and how's of smithing. I do not know much about him but from what i have gathered is a retired blacksmith teacher who has worked with some of the worlds greats. I have learned more from watching him make a single set of tongs than just about all the other youtubers out there. In my opinion it is maybe the closest you can get to one on one instruction. 

Always try and master a new technique, that is how we grow. However keep in mind that using the edge of the anvil is only 1 method of drawing out metal. So if you are like me and just end up no good at it there is always another way. 

As a final thought about radiusing the anvil, just becuase you see one person do it one way does not mean that is the correct way or the wrong way. That is how that person likes to use their tool. You will have to find your own way but again that is part of growing as a smith. 

Edit: I should have said a handful or a few videos, becuase obviously the first set is almost 10 alone. 

Edited October 27, 2021 by BillyBones
clarification

[ThomasPowers]

Using old anvils they tend to be radiused to differing profiles and I have been known to switch which anvil I'm using to make use of a profile that is better for a specific task. (I have 4 anvils lined up for loading for away classes that are alone one side of my forging area and so have the gift of choice.)

[USANewbie]

BillyBones, thanks i will check out his videos

ThomasPowers, thank you as well.

[Daswulf]

USA, watch the videos then take what you learned and try it out on the anvil a bit to get a physical feel for the info you watched. Then go back and watch them again to get a better understanding now that you've physically tried it.  

[USANewbie]

I will Daswulf, thanks.

[Hefty]

I found Alec Steele's video on his technique for drawing out stems for leaf key chains really useful for understanding how tapers on the near and far side of the anvil work. One of his earlier YouTube videos is a lesson specifically on forward and reverse tapers, as he calls them. I think the leaf keychain video is called "make 100 of these" or something like that. Alec learned under Brian Brazeal who also has good videos on drawing and tapering techniques. Search YouTube for "Blacksmith exercises for any level with Brian Brazeal"

Both also talk about "unicorn horn" tapering. I can't find the video I originally heard this term in, but the technique deals with the fact that you will get grooves like you mention off of the anvil but as you continue drawing the taper, you rotate the stock as you move along and the section with the groove ends up on top and the grooves are flattened by the hammer. Then you rotate again as you move further along the taper and the grooved section is then smoothed out further by the anvil face.

Hope that makes sense!

Cheers,

Jono.

[USANewbie]

Thanks Hefty. That's my problem, im not able to smooth out the lumps. Maybe I'm taking too big of a bite each time i rotate.