Jasent

Hot cut hand shear hardy?

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Not sure what this tool is called but I want to make one.  My question is should I use leaf spring or abrasion resistance steel.  I have a long section from a snow plow blade (the replaceable edge) or a pile of large leaf springs. Or would you recommend a different steel 

I can imagine that AR steels are a pain to forge.  

Any input would be appreciated. 

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ISTR a variant of that in a book, for hot cutting steel of a substantial thickness,    Perhaps Charles McRaven's "Country Blacksmithing" ?   As I recall they used grader blade wear plate; but that was a number of decades ago and I don't know of possible changes to the alloys used.

I'll also check in "Practical Blacksmithing" Richardson; as they were more on unpowered stuff back 130 years ago and that book is full of DIY tools.

I can look this weekend but won't be back on line till Monday---I get all day in the scrapyard and forge tomorrow and all day Sunday involved in Christmas stuff. (And eating my chocolate amaretto pie!)   With luck I can move the coal stove from my wife's studio to my shop; I managed to clear a path to it last weekend and saw it for the first time in a decade.

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Leaf spring! Grader edges are crazy difficult to grind. We ran Vascowear or the equivalent depending on who won the bid that year, on our graders and various snow plows. I still have a few feet out by the shop, we had to trim a couple feet to fit a couple of our older graders. Anyway, I think every blacksmith who's run across grader/plow edges have tried making something with it. Good luck with that!

Just to give you an idea of the difficulty of working with the stuff it's generally: 200+pts of carbon, high alloy as the matrix to hold approx 5% tungsten carbide particles. Just for giggles I've torch heated it to incandescent yellow and it barely responded to the hammer. The only luck I've had grinding it was at medium red heat with a 36 grit, cup stone. You might get away with a worn edge, they get ground against pavement and can be sharp. You'll need to torch it to shape and if you can't incorporate the blade bolt holes you'll need to torch the holes.

It CAN be done but it's a LOT of work.

A leaf spring can be normalized and drilled with HS bits, cut with a hack saw and sharpened with virtually any grinder, wheel, disk, belt, piece of sand stone by hand.

Frosty The Lucky.

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Thank you sir. Sounds like a great weekend ahead

i figured it would be tough to forge. Thank you frosty for sharing your experience with it.  It is worn to a sharp edge but would still need dressed.   

I’ll move along with leaf spring plans unless someone has a better plan.  With stock on hand that’s probably the better option.  

 

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Vasco wear knives require diamond hones to sharpen if properly heat treated. Very high alloy, very tough!  (Heat treat is extremely difficult!!!)

May I commend to your attention an oldie but a goody, (My, I look younger in those posts!)

 

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Thank you Thomas.  Good read. Sounds like it would be a great alloy for the job but not worth the effort to get it too shape

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Ah, yes; I saw the video that's in (making cleavers in Asia) and thought it might be a fun project.

The great thing about toolmaking is that it gives me plausible deniability about the actual finished pieces that I haven't yet made.

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Anybody know what it’s called?   Gotta have a name.  I know Thomas is going to look in his books after his fun this weekend but I’d bet some one has one somewhere.  

I got an extension cord running to the shop right now so any time I can not use power the better. Plus I’ve been blessed with the power of leverage so body powered tools are great. Especially if I can lean into them. Lol 

looking forward to this build

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:D

thanks jhcc

i seen it in a compilation video on fb. Was mostly tongs, all production work. Guys making the same thing over and over.  I’ll look up the video you mentioned 

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Concerning graderblade, Frosty and I had a discuss about this a while back and concluded that there are different kinds of grader blade. The kind commonly found in colorado has no tunsgton carbide in it. This type makes great tools and is forgable and there is no problem doing cold work. I make all my scrolling wrenches and bending forks from it and have made some very satisfactory draw knives from it.

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That’s interesting. I guess I have some testing todo.  This section came off a snow plow.  

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Mine too. It is a bolt on replaceable piece with square holes,,, I think,,  ;) . I can't find the pic of a length of mine, but if you want I can run out to the shop and post a pic.

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Mine has square holes aswell with a dished side for carriage bolts and look like they were  drop forged in. 

I went out and cut a peace off with my 7” grinder and cut off wheel.  Stared ok but as I got past the carriage blot section it got much tougher to cut and spark got shorter.  Sparks were quite orange with lots of sprigs close and almost none on the ends.    I’ll see how it works at forge temps

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Forged ok at orange heat.  Water quench made it super hard.  Will try oil next

tempered to past blue and I was flexing the jaws on my 5” post vice  could not break it with 24” cheater    

 

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20 hours ago, JHCC said:

Shears.

 

Shearly if you're on a first name basis.

About leverage and direction. You can typically generate 3x as much force lifting with your legs as leaning.

 

2 hours ago, Jasent said:

Forged ok at orange heat.

It's not Vascowear nor a grader edge.

Frosty The Lucky.

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If lifting though it would need to be vice mounted otherwise it may tend to pop up out of the hardy.  Vice mount might be nice as it leaves the anvil open.   Probably be easier to make too not having to make it fit the hardy

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9 minutes ago, Jasent said:

If lifting though it would need to be vice mounted otherwise it may tend to pop up out of the hardy.

Nah, lifting from the end of the handle can't lift the shank straight up it'll cock it in the hardy hole. What you'd have to be careful, REALLY :o CAREFUL about is tipping the anvil and stand over. 

I have a bar shear I saved from a dumpster that fits my Trenton and you have to use it with the handle aimed full length of the anvil so you're standing in front of the horn or it just tips the anvil off the stand. I haven't had it fall, I was paying THAT much attention but it was a concern, I have young guys over sometimes.

Were I to build one for the anvil I'd make the bottom blade lay on the anvil's face along one edge and plan the lever to run full length. Building it to stick up that high over the anvil is just adding leverage against the anvil for no good reason. 

Frosty The Lucky.

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8 hours ago, Jasent said:

Mine has square holes aswell with a dished side for carriage bolts and look like they were  drop forged in.

Yup, that's it. 

Easily found at the scrap yard or from most dirt guys.

I also bought it new from my steel supplier by asking for grader blade. It comes in different dimensions.

I just normalize my bending forks and scrolling wrenches

I oil quenched my draw knives and drew them to a straw. It held a good edge until somebody "borrowed" it to peel some  cedar(I'm in the southwest and the bark is full of wind blown sand) and, alas, I got some chipping on the edge.

I'm not saying it's a good blade steel because it's designed for toughness, but I was a bit lazy and the bevel is already there for my big draw knives.  :)

It works great for my benders and I have bent some pretty heavy stock with their larger handles and a cheater with no breaking.

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Gerald with the south fork craftsmen has a nail header made out of the stuff, Lazy Ass Forge made it for him with there power hammer.

I have to much of the stuff in my scrap pile, as some one used it as rebar in the roof of my storm hole.  

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23 hours ago, Frosty said:

Shearly if you're on a first name basis.

William, if you’re on a first-name basis; Billy, if you’re friends  

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That good cause I want to re do my nail header.  I was having trouble getting them to release and then I noticed the problem  causing the issue. 

Must have gotten distorted after I finished forging it.  First few nails dropped easy 

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Yup it was in "Country Blacksmithing" Charles McRaven, (I believe it was updated/reprinted under a different name?)   His had a long blade; as that is what he had to work with I bet and the end handle was fastened on.  Mentions using it by hammering on the back of the blade too.

I'm willing to conjecture that the alloys used for such things changed over time and perhaps in location as well; just as implements may change alloys for use in rocky vs sandy soils.

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