Hard Fire Brick Forges

[Mikey98118]

I couldn't remember where I originally saw the data, but ran across it again on another site:  http://www.traditionaloven.com/building/refractory/k26-ifb/convert-cu-ft-lite-brick-k26-to-pound-lb-of-lite-brick-k26.html

I have also hefted my bricks, and they are very lite. SWMBO has never allowed a scale in our home, so that's the best I can do

[Frosty]

On ‎8‎/‎21‎/‎2017 at 2:44 AM, MonkeyForge said:

Using bentone 4 % seems to be the sweet spot (4 grams on 96 grams of zirconium silicate) Fired at 1350 degrees Celsius. Next sep is to see what happens when I plaster a 5 mm thick layer over rigidised ceramic wool.

Excellent Maarten thanks for doing the experiments, 4% is an easy number to get right. How long did it take to dry enough to fire? 

Thanks for the link Mike those are less expensive than even hard fire brick here. If they stand up to forge temps with a bentonite or Veegum / zirconium flame face I'm in! Talk about THE stuff to reline a commercial forge with. Seriously you might be able make an insulating backer with fiberglass insulation. 

This would sure beat trying to make Kaowool behave.

Thanks. Frosty The Lucky.

 

[MonkeyForge]

Jerry, a small tile takes 2 to 3 days to dry. This is without using a plaster mould. So I mix the dry powder, add water mix some more until I get a sticky substance clay-like but not exactly clay and trowel then press in to a cardboard mould. waited 3 days.  After that the tile is dry enough to put in the oven at 140 degrees (as low as my oven goes) for half an hour. Now I could fire.

[Frosty]

That sounds about like my experience with bentonite clays. I don't know of a good way to make mixing the water easier. 24 hrs. to temper really helps even the moisture content. You can save yourself a LOT of work mixing by sealing it in an airtight container and just letting it sit overnight. You can push the temperature in the oven to 170f. safely and after a few hours 230f. to drive out the hygroscopic moisture. 

I'm sure looking forward to your results with coating the ceramic wool.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Reeltree]

A little bentonite tid bit,, the John Wayne movie McLintock,, scene of the big brawl where everyone was being knocked down the hill into a watery pit... that was a bentonite quarry

[wpearson]

On ‎8‎/‎21‎/‎2017 at 2:11 AM, Frosty said:

Bentonite is a clay group and refined to the degree needed for the use as a ceramic additive it's more refined than drilling mud. Veegum is in a different but similar clay group. Bentone is in the bentonite clay group and more highly refined than say drill mud, kitty litter or animal feed additive. I imagine the more refined the more it costs.

http://www.axner.com/bentonites.aspx

[GrumpyBiker]

So how much (lbs) would you guys suggest that I would need ?

How thick of a layer?

 

[Mikey98118]

The smallest amount of zircopax you can buy, and one- half pound of benotinte clay will be more than enough.

[GrumpyBiker]

It's all done ready for testing the burner inside the forge.

Man does this thing put off the heat.

I've got some "tuning" to do but so far so good.

I cracked the brass nut on the cheap hose so I ordered a 16' braided stainless hose & everything is sealed. No bubbles.

[Mikey98118]

An orange interior, without using a heat reflective coating in the forge, is pretty good.

[eseemann]

On 8/20/2017 at 11:37 AM, Frosty said:

That's where I used to get it when I was drilling, I'll have to call around and see what's available locally. I can't imagine needing much more than a few cups to wash a pretty good sized forge but I'm sure MIke will have the straight poop for us soon.

Thanks Mike I was wondering how I'd missed high temp insulating bricks. I'll check Morgan out.

Frosty The Lucky.

Frosty,

I got the wife a new blender/food processor and will be trying to use the old food processor to turn the cheapest cat litter around (that should be bentonite in to a powder. I have also seen people do it in an old blender. Sadly the old blender pitcher was broken so I cannot try that right away. I wonder about using the blender to make a bentonite slushy (for lack of a better word) and then letter the extra water seep out by straining the slurry out using an old t-shirt stretched over a bucket. I have read that once you use a blender for this the blades will look like Hagar the Horrible's sword.

Biker,

Please let us know if you how hot you think it gets. I would not mind know if you can get it up to forge welding heat. I wonder about putting another brick (not in the wall) on the floor so you cut the cubic inches down. I love the look of the thing. It has a "Temple of Doom" kind of aesthetic with the sliding door.

[Frosty]

6 hours ago, eseemann said:

Frosty,

I got the wife a new blender/food processor and will be trying to use the old food processor to turn the cheapest cat litter around (that should be bentonite in to a powder. I have also seen people do it in an old blender. Sadly the old blender pitcher was broken so I cannot try that right away. I wonder about using the blender to make a bentonite slushy (for lack of a better word) and then letter the extra water seep out by straining the slurry out using an old t-shirt stretched over a bucket. I have read that once you use a blender for this the blades will look like Hagar the Horrible's sword.

 

I know you've told us your name but my dented memory lost it. Anyway, forget the blender the idea sounds better than it works, I've killed a couple trying similar. First was turning sawdust into fine dust to make my own insulating fire brick. The other was trying to reduce clay to dust, both burned up the blender, they aren't very tough.

No need to powder bentonite, just figure what % water you want to try and put it in a jar or tupperware container with the bentonite. It WILL distribute itself through the water evenly in a day or two. Your patience will be rewarded so practice some. 

In the Soils lab the guys spent a week trying to mix it to test. Burned up two cement mixers, made us techs sweat over a cement trough and hoe. I finally gave up and called a drilling company who told me to just put it in a tub with water and give it time. Works a charm. However if you're in a hurry a vane shear cavitation mixer works a treat. A paint mixer is a poor cousin for mixing mud. The cavitation mixer is as simple as welding or threading a flat piece of steel on a shaft. It needs to cut NOT paddle and you don't want the vanes sharp. The cavitation behind the vanes is what causes a shock that pulverizes the bentonite and because it's in water it has no choice but to mix.

Save your blender I don't think one would be strong enough to drive a vane for long.

Frosty The Lucky.

[eseemann]

Frosty,

Thanks for saving me the trouble. I thought just letting the clay turn to goo on its own and then mixing in everything else might work but seemed too easy.

Thanks again

Ernest