kizzer Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 I was visiting the Smoky Mountain Knifeworks On Sevierville, TN. They have (or had) a resident Knifemaker available to help you make your own knife from either a horseshoe or a RR spike. I chose to make on from a RR spike. After heating and beating the basic shape, before going inside to grind it, the knifemaker sprinkled some powder, looked like powdered graphite on the blade and heated it once more and then quenched it. I have tried to contact him (James "Cody" Weaver, King James Knives) but he has dropped off the map. Can anyone tell me what that powder might have been? Was it supposed to increase the carbon on the surface of the blade maybe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogsoldat Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 I wonder if it would have been casenite or some other case hardening compound. Though if treated before grinding there will be little if any hard surface left after grinding as the case hardening is quite thin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odblacksmith Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 It would have likely been casenite/cherry red or some sort of "hardening compound" i use cherry red for certain items.what effect it would have on a knife i have no idea.maybe if the blade was forged very thin it may help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quenchcrack Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 For the carbon added through a surface application to have any effect, you must allow time for it to diffuse through the steel. Carbon will move through the steel at about .010" per hour at 1650F. As others have said, this is a pretty thin case at best and would likely be ground off if you did any grinding on the blade after hardening. RR spike knives are great projects and can yield an interesting knife but they are not generally good carry knives because they are heavy and do not hold a good edge. Buy some O1 or W1 and make a real knife. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kizzer Posted March 4, 2016 Author Share Posted March 4, 2016 Quenchcrack, Thank you for your response and the information. Since you said that the carbon moves at a rate per hour at 1650F, could I increase the amount of Carbon in the RR spike ( I have a 5 gal bucket of them) by coating the spikes with CherryRed and letting the soak in the forge at 1650F for a few hours? If that would not work, can you give me any other ideas to increase the carbon in the spikes? Thank you for your help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted March 4, 2016 Share Posted March 4, 2016 Look into how blister steel was made; but it comes down to that it would be faster and cheaper to just forge weld on a High C piece for the blade. I've done some blister steel experimentation where I went from very low carbon wrought iron to essentially cast iron carbon levels using powdered charcoal in a piece of pipe with on end closed off and the other hammered together but some venting allowed. I stuck it along the side of my propane forge and turned the pipe every time I lit the forge. 20 hours was too much time at temp for my experiment desired outcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 Another option that'd be much less work with a much higher probability of success than trying to increase the C content of a RR spike would be to buy a piece of 5/8" sq. HC steel and forge a spike head on the end of the handle. It'd look just like a spike knife but it'd be a REAL knife. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 ahh a "forged" RR spike knife! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 Emphasis on KNIFE because it really is one. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WayneCoeArtistBlacksmith Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 I use SuperQuench for RR Spike and Horse Shoe knives and get a hardness in the 53 rc range. I have discussed this with Robb Gunter, who invented SuperQuench. In a demonstration Robb cut a piece from mild steel and made a chisel from it and hardened it in SuperQuench then cut the parent stock with the chisel. I have had RR Spike and Horse Shoe knives as my EDC and have had to sharpen my wife's Case knife more often than my EDC. Let me know if I can help you. www.WayneCoeArtistBlacksmith.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bo T Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 Wayne, Does it matter how many points of carbon in the spike (HC or standard)? I read a paper put out by some researchers in China who used SuperQuench on 1020 steel for farm implements and they were hardening to mid 40's. HRc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WayneCoeArtistBlacksmith Posted March 13, 2016 Share Posted March 13, 2016 The higher the carbon content (don't use SuperQuench above 40 points) the harder and more brittle it will get. Even with mild steel Robb recommends tempering to 450 degrees. It won't harden mild steel but will refine the grain structure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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