elimsprint Posted October 17, 2022 Share Posted October 17, 2022 I just built a 3/4" Frosty T burner and so far I am happily impressed. I did it slightly differently than the instructions as I welded a piece of 1" shaft to the top of the T so I would have more meat to tap. I also turned and soldered a plug in the 1/4" nipple and drilled and tapped that for the .035" mig tip to screw into. Here's a link to a vid of it burning https://imgur.com/a/VxVTLcB In the middle of the video I turn it down to almost off and then up to max which on the regulator I am using is 20psi I also used an 8" nipple I had laying around instead of the 6" recommended. I'm going to pick up a 6" nipple and a 3/4" coupler to make a better flare and see if that helps. Turn the coupler to 1:12 taper or just turn out the threads and call it good? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 18, 2022 Author Share Posted October 18, 2022 Looks good to me, possibly a hair rich but nice flame shape. Leave the threads in the coupler, I cut them out of a thread protector and it didn't perform as well as with threads. Ask at the local plumbing supply if you can have or buy a thread protector, the guys up the road from me made me take a whole bucket of them last time I asked. They're threaded on the ends of pipe for shipment to protect the threads. They can't be used as couplers and can't be sold in case. They aren't worth saving and shipping back to the pipe manufacturer and aren't worth enough as scrap to save. Or so say the guys up the road. Couplers cost a bunch just to make the flame better and make it easy to mount the burner. Especially if there's a cheaper alternative. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elimsprint Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 I asked at a couple of places after reading your previous posts on the subject and they both said they only get plastic protectors. I had to put the reducer on to make it burn, I couldn't light it without it. Maybe the 6" nipple will help with that. I want to get the burner working well to dry out the ridgidizer and I don't care if it needs a flare on it right now but eventually I want to run a straight pipe set back in a refractory formed flare, I think, maybe???????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 18, 2022 Author Share Posted October 18, 2022 Yeah, I concur, plastic thread protectors are out. You do what you have to do to get what you need/want. Oh yeah, forming the refractory in the burner port to make the flare is the way to go. It gets the flame away from the burner mixing tube entirely so your burner not only performs well it won't burn up. A 6" nipple might improve the burn but it's looking pretty good from here. A little sand paper trim to the mig tip will lean it out easily enough. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elimsprint Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 I can turn the whole supply tube in and out about 1/8" before it gets too wobbly and even out all the way it doesn't seem to affect the burn very much. I was just confused as to why I needed the flare to make it light at all. With the flare I can light it with a bic but without I can't even get it lit with a propane torch unless I turn it almost off and then it lights in the plenum and blows out as I turn it up. I can turn little bits of the mig tip off in the lathe but haven't wanted to adjust much till I actually get it in a forge. I just found your NARB post and am thinking I may go that route before I build the forge. I have a 20# tank cut and sitting on my workbench till I figure out my path forward. Decisions, decisions, decisions! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 19, 2022 Author Share Posted October 19, 2022 Plenum? You mean it burns back to the T I assume. I have to open the 1/4 turn shut off valve gradually to light the burners, always have. If I just open the valve it literally blows the ball of burning paper I light it with out of the forge before the propane gets there. Having to adjust the psi to light sounds like you goofed in the build and are using the propane tank valve as the working shut off valve. Install a propane approved 1/4 turn ball valve between the regulator and the hose to the burner. With the shut off valve closed open the tank valve and give it a couple seconds for everything to pressurize, thenn with your ignition source burning SLOWLY open the 1/4 turn valve I take more than a second opening it. Any faster and it doesn't light, even with a propane torch. That last makes me wonder but it is what it is. Where are you lighting the burner? At the burner nozzle, NOT the end of the jet I HOPE. Too many people think you light a burner at the air intake. Don't worry, we'll get it working, you're close enough it's just a little tweaking. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 On 4/25/2016 at 12:35 AM, oldshove said: I also use a Acetylene regulator on my on my propane tank I can regulate it down to 7 lbs from there I use 1/4 ball valve to control flow. The classic warning is not to use an acetylene regulator with any other fuel gas; especially not with propane; the reason for this is that ;propane can ruin its seals. I listened to two torch rebuilding experts argue the point with each other, as to the chance that the seals in a modern acetylene regulator would be dissolved by propane. The conclusion was that they certainly would on an old regulator, and were far less likely to be in a modern regulator--depending on source. This argument took place around 1986. Nevertheless, how unlikely the problem is to turn up in modern equipment is cold comfort, if it happens to you...just a thought Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 19, 2022 Author Share Posted October 19, 2022 That's a 6+ year old post Mike unless you're bringing it up again to get ahead of the idea? It's a good warning. Propane is a chemically aggressive gas and even recent multifuel regulators recommend not using a regulator or hose used with propane for another fuel gas. With recent supply issues I wouldn't be terribly surprised if an unscrupulous supplier relabeled old unsellable regulators. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elimsprint Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 Yes, the T and I'm lighting it at the nozzle:-) I don't have the ball valve installed yet, I forgot to pick up a 1/4" T and a gauge last time I was in town and I wanted to try this thing out! I am using the 20# regulator that I took from the chinese banjo burner on my still to start it (not the right way, I know but.....) and the tank valve to shut it down till I head down the hill. I will get a good regulator but the other one was here so I'm using it for now. Thanks for the help so far, I'm sure I'll have a million more questions before I start to heat some metal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 19, 2022 Author Share Posted October 19, 2022 Don't make any major changes until you install the 1/4 turn valve and give it a try. Discovering issues during tests are what tests are for. Remember, bench testing T burners doesn't mean much once you put it in a forge, a number of things change and you'll have to tune for them. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 44 minutes ago, Frosty said: unless you're bringing it up again to get ahead of the idea? Yes; that's it exactly. IFI readers are constantly foraging through old posts, whether they are in permanent threads, or old threads. Sooner or later someone will argue that their acetylene regulator does just fine on propane, and thus muddy the waters; perhaps this will serve to keep the record straight--or not. We can only do our best Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 19, 2022 Author Share Posted October 19, 2022 Agreed Mike. Folks tend to read the beginning or recent end of threads and it's unrealistic to expect them to read the whole thing before trying things out. Some mistakes and myths aren't a big deal but some can be extremely dangerous and should be brought up every now and then. Keep the warnings fresh so to speak. Good call. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elimsprint Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 2 hours ago, Mikey98118 said: Yes; that's it exactly. IFI readers are constantly foraging through old posts, whether they are in permanent threads, or old threads. Sooner or later someone will argue that their acetylene regulator does just fine on propane, and thus muddy the waters; perhaps this will serve to keep the record straight--or not. We can only do our best I have 2 old acetylene regulators laying around that I was planning on using till I found IFI and your warnings in a 101 thread, thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 Yes, again exactly so. During the years that I worked steel in minor shipyards (after the big yard shut down) and directly for fishing vessel owners, there were more than a few fires started, and just one narrowly averted, when guys thought that safe procedures around torch hose didn't apply to them. 5 minutes ago, elimsprint said: I have 2 old acetylene regulators laying around that I was planning on using till I found IFI and your warnings in a 101 thread, thank you! 4 minutes ago, elimsprint said: You're welcome. And "old regulators laying around" is the main reason we keep on repeating the warning. Would I trust a new regulator? No; but that may be a personal failing On the other hand, having burned my garage down once, I don't want to test my insurance company's patience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted October 21, 2022 Share Posted October 21, 2022 On 10/17/2022 at 11:59 PM, Frosty said: Oh yeah, forming the refractory in the burner port to make the flare is the way to go. It gets the flame away from the burner mixing tube entirely so your burner not only performs well it won't burn up. It also allows the maker to cut the burner's mixing tube at the best length for a burner's size, rather than choosing between too long and too short; this is usually the choice that screwing a flame retention nozzlele on the end of a pipe nipple gives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 24, 2022 Author Share Posted October 24, 2022 In addition it allows you to fine tune the flame by moving the burner in and out a little. The one downside to building the flare into the forge liner is if a person wants to use the burner in something else. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted October 24, 2022 Share Posted October 24, 2022 There is usually a downside to every decision. Less with burner design than in forge design; I just think of them as trade-offs; they're less aggravating that way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 24, 2022 Author Share Posted October 24, 2022 It's a good way to look at negotiating with reality, it helps. Sometimes a little lipstick can make a pig look okay enough to keep me calm . . ish. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 I'm not even going to touch that line Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 25, 2022 Author Share Posted October 25, 2022 Bok, bok bok, Bok. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 Discretion is the better part of valor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 25, 2022 Author Share Posted October 25, 2022 Yeah, so is avoiding metaphor. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elimsprint Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 I'm building a 1/2" T for a brick pile foundry I'm trying to build but I can't seem to find a consensus on mig tip size, .023, .025 or .030. I have some .023 which I will try but if I need another size I can pick some up when I am in town this evening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 25, 2022 Author Share Posted October 25, 2022 0.023 or 0.025 works with minimal tuning problems. I don't know anybody running 0.030. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elimsprint Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 Perfect, thanks, I have a bunch of .023 I don't use! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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