Rockram Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 I've been searching different anvil bases and trying to decide which is better. Steel or Wood? I've seen some real nice 3 leg and a few 4 leg steel. Some tree stumps and some laminated 2x12's. Is one any better than the other or is it more personal preference. I have the ability to fabricate out of wood or steel. Just wondering if one is superior to the other and for what reason. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arftist Posted April 6, 2014 Share Posted April 6, 2014 The ultimate is a section of elm cut at a crotch to give the widest possible base, six feet long and buried upside down on a bed of gravel. To this the anvil should be firmly attached. Next best is a stout round of white oak (or even better elm) cut to the correct height to have the top of your anvil at about knuckle height with your arm hanging down relaxed. Higher for light work, lower for heavy work. This last statement is now debatable but it has worked for me these 35 years. Avoid red oak, it splits too easily. I mount my hardwood rounds to a chunk of thick plate to make them more immobile but I have not seen anyone else do this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 "better" depends on your needs NOT OURS. I generally stump on wood except for a travel set up as the steel anvil stand is much more portable. So steel is definitely better than wood and wood is definitely better than steel depending on information you have not provided. Finally using it is better than talking about it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Blythin Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 I just love an elm stump. I'd like to have a larger stump thats set into the ground, but for the time being a shorter (movable) stump works very well. I've tried a steel stand, and didn't like it. But a lot of that is personal preference. If possible, try both (in other peoples shops) and decide for yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockram Posted April 7, 2014 Author Share Posted April 7, 2014 6' Elm I don't think that will be too easy to move around. I guess I better place it right the first time. ;) Is the thick plate bolted to the round on top or bottom? I have some old oak bridge planks that are 3x12 I was thinking to plane down so the surfaces are even. Glue and drill hole through all of them and run all thread with counter sunk nuts in the ends to keep from snagging a knee on them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockram Posted April 7, 2014 Author Share Posted April 7, 2014 Would thorny locust work? It is a real hard wood burns hot and for a long time. I have one in the back yard that's been a real thorn in my side. (pun intended) This would give me a reason to get the chainsaw out. Does it matter if the stump is green or dead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockram Posted April 7, 2014 Author Share Posted April 7, 2014 "better" depends on your needs NOT OURS. I generally stump on wood except for a travel set up as the steel anvil stand is much more portable. So steel is definitely better than wood and wood is definitely better than steel depending on information you have not provided. Finally using it is better than talking about it! I am just getting started and for now it will be in my shop. I will be moving it in and out depending on weather. Started with the idea to make a couple knives but the more I have read on this and other forums. Not sure if I'll have the time to get to knives as I am finding other interesting things to do as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigred1o1 Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 my thought is if you have a flat floor then you can go with stump or any base you want if you have a dirt sand or gravel floor stumps are fantastic as you can settle them into the ground a bit its perfect on the other hand if you are like me and have a slightly uneven concrete floor a three footed steel stand is nice as its self leveling and wont rock around as no matter where i put it in the shop if you plan on putting it in one spot and bolting it down then your options are what ever makes you happy any of them will work well if you have the anvil well attached to the base Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Blythin Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 I just love an elm stump. I'd like to have a larger stump thats set into the ground, but for the time being a shorter (movable) stump works very well. I've tried a steel stand, and didn't like it. But a lot of that is personal preference. If possible, try both (in other peoples shops) and decide for yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matto Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 locust will do very well. cut away. keep some of the branches to use for handles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 I LOVE it every time this subject comes up, folk speak with such conviction you'd almost think there actually was a best stand. I like green elm best, the cambium layer is sweet but the dry elm is just too chewy. If you bury a log do it in a moveable shop as that's how you'll rearrange things. Okay, so I'm making a little joke. Being new it's natural to want to be let in on the "secret" knowledge all of us know. Blacksmithing especially by hand is an art, not a science so there are NO perfect anythings. Be it anvil, stand, hammer, fuel, forge, stack, oh whatEVER. The human touch is what does everything and we're all different so what's perfect for Tinkum Hammerall is the absolute worst possible for Swingum Hardy. Just don't do anything too permanent till you've spent some time on your own and if you come up with something we haven't suggested before the end of this thread please let us know what and how it works for you. Oh yeah, I like my steel stands, it's the only thing I've found that quietens my Soderfors to less than permanent hearing damage loud. And yeah, I used several different stands on that one and other anvils. I can go into the why it quiets an anvil down but what fun would that be. <wink> Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferrous Beuler Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 IMHO no matter what you settle on as a base the single most important factor is that when you are hammering on it that it is absolutely rock solid and does not move or wiggle in even the slightest way. Completely immobile is what you want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arftist Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 6' Elm I don't think that will be too easy to move around. I guess I better place it right the first time. ;) Is the thick plate bolted to the round on top or bottom? I have some old oak bridge planks that are 3x12 I was thinking to plane down so the surfaces are even. Glue and drill hole through all of them and run all thread with counter sunk nuts in the ends to keep from snagging a knee on them. The plate is added to the bottom to add stability and weight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfudd Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 I always appreciate Frosty's responses, they clearly come from much experience. If you have a concrete floor a wood stump will work if you can fashion a method of securing it to the floor or it's just huge. If you do have a concrete floor you'll want to make sure the top and bottom of the stump/wood base are flat and parallel otherwise you will be chasing the anvil around. I have a concrete floor and fought with the stump for a while my 240lb anvil was on. I finally gave up and welded a 3 legged metal base and put it on one of those cheapy rubber floor pads. That worked a lot better. I now have my 3 shop anvils (400lb, 240lb and 190lb) on 3 legged stands. They will move very slightly when I'm really smacking on them, but not enough to cause me issues. Like Thomas said it will really depends on the variables you have to deal with and what you want. This picture will shows some of my earlier stands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Blythin Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 Can you please explain the addition of the foam mats Fatfudd? I thought the idea was to have a base that's solid/rigid. You're not the only one I've seen add rubber or foam into the mix, but I don't understand why. I would think it would add an element spongy/springiness...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 When I made the last 3 stands out here in stump poor desert I had been given the old oak floorboards from a horse trailer that was junked at the scrap yard. The better boards I used as shelves in my shop. The worse boards---crumbly surface and eroded in places I used for stumps. I cut them to length and stood them on the side of an I-beam to have them level. Then clamped them with bar clamps and used an electricians "stud" drill bit to drill through the stack in 2-3 places and used the bolts they use around here for guardrails to bolt them all together. There is a slight bit of play in these stumps so when I am on an uneven hard surface I can "set" the stump down and have it conform. Not nearly as pretty as planing and glueing on the other hand I made 3 of them one saturday afternoon so at last all my anvils are stumped! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everything Mac Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 Those rubber matts are tough as old boots, they use them out on the rigs to put shipping containers on so I can't imagine there's much give. I've used logs and a metal stand, both have distinct benefits but it's a trade off. I like the three legged metal stands for being able to get your feet under the anvil, and thus being able to stand that bit closer. They're also pretty easy to move around compared to a heavy log. I have my anvil mounted on one right now and it works very well. I'd bolt it to the floor if you have concrete personally. Mine is on a wooden floor and will wobble about, it's not the stand it's the wood flexing. But I've always felt there was a benefit to having a really heavy log under the anvil and having it secured tightly. I reckon they absorb the impacts better when you have a solid mass directly under the sweet spot of the anvil. The other option if course is a sand box base. They don't seem to be all that common but I've only heard good things. I'll build one one day. All the best Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfudd Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 I have found that the rubber mats sort of hold the stand in place while pounding but make ironically make it easy to slide the anvil/stand around when I need to move them. The anvil/stand combination will gradually sink/compress into the mat leaving the mat very thin under the stand's feet. The mat may actually be compressed into the concrete imperfections slightly which is why it seems to hold it in place. I haven't tried these on a polished concrete floor but I would bet they would not work on that kind of surface. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Blythin Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 Neat. I wouldn't have thought of that - will have to give it a try myself. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 No one has mentioned the wood borers, powder post beetles, termites, and a host of other wood loving bugs that can take up residence in the wooden post. No one mentioned strapping the post so it resists splitting. No one suggested any preservatives for the wooden post. Wooden posts have their place (pun intended) when you bury a 6 or 8 foot section of log into the dirt of a smithy, then maybe add a floor around it. Steel stands can be built so there is a wooden plank between the anvil and stand, or a container (box) large enough to hold the anvil and 3-4 inches of sand. A shelf can be added below the anvil that can hold several hundred pounds of metal for additional weight (or tools). The feet can be bolted to the floor is needed. The only bug that will chew on a metal stand is rust. Use the same anvil, for 30 days each, on both a wooden base and a metal base. Please report b back to us with your findings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 I have used wooden stumps and because of the bug infestation, switched to a metal stand with a piece of sheeting between the anvil and the stand. Used a 30 gallon grease drum full of sand as a base for a 100 pound anvil. The sand was packed into the drum and a piece of wood added to keep the sand from settling. Next came an inch of sand (to bring the anvil up to proper height) and the anvil. More sand was added to bring the sand level with the top of the drum. Heavy beast, did not walk about, and killed the ring of the anvil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 Note that Borax is also rated as a wood treatment against a lot of stuff---and smiths often have some around... Probably my two oddest anvil supports were 1: a hollow log for a travel anvil where I wanted a lighter more compact but still "traditional" looking set up and a large old bridge baulk consisting of 3 large pieces of creosoted wood bolted together, about 8' long and 2' wide and a good height for my large anvils---found it floating in a creek by my house at that time during a flood. I rode it and paddled it to where a friend could pull it out with his 4wd and have moved it twice so far. It's now the main tool space in the armouring part of the shop: 410# Trenton, 250# bridge anvil, whitney punch, 100# ball on a stand, stake plate,... When I get my forge extension finally arranged I have another old mine timber---creosoted---to bury for the 515# main shop anvil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Mullins Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 My base is a hollow 2X wood box filled with crushed brick. It was made with the materials had on hand, but works quite well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stash Posted April 7, 2014 Share Posted April 7, 2014 I tend to use whatever I have on hand at the time. I've used 4x4 cribbing spiked together. Currently I have 2 anvils on walnut stumps, 1 on black locust and my bick anvil is in a nice chunk of holly. The anvils are bolted down (Fisher) or chained in place, and all are set on a layer or 2 of 45mil rubber roofing scraps. They are all leveled off top and bottom and are nice and heavy and wiggle free. Works for me- I'm happy. Your milage may vary. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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