David Gaddis Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 I needed a butcher guillotine so I decided to use some spring stock from a truck. 1/2x 2-1/2 presummed to be 5160. in the end it will be mounted through the hardee hole. A framework was welded from preheated stock of the same material. Allowances were made so that the swingarm could be raised to accomodate thicker material. a square stem was welded to allow to positioning into a hardee hole. Then tried out to make sure of usability. Before this project is finished I plan to have butchers, hot-cuts, several fullers, and a beading tool. Perhaps I should have purchased the "smithin' magician!" Please excuse the untidy shop...but that is the way it is. Some of the pictures do not show that the top piece has been ground for a matching angle of the butcher. Should I have dropped the camera angle then the ground edge would been visible. Carry on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 The tool, and the name, "Smithin Magician" is both copyrighted by Jerry Hoffman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Trez Cole Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 that looks like it will work just fine. When I made mine I rounded the edges rather than the angle cut you made on the bottom the style you made and the smithin magician both have there place and there limitations. it will serve you well for many years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trinculo Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 The tool, and the name, "Smithin Magician" is both copyrighted by Jerry Hoffman How do you copyright a tool? Patent maybe, but copyright? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thingmaker3 Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Can't copyright a name either. Those get a trademark. I think Glen was trying to make sure Jerry Hoffman got due credit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 As long as Jerry Hoffman gets due credit. I chased this down a while back and ended up talking with Jerry on the issue. He was kind enough to thank me for giving me credit at that time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastRonin Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 That is inspiring me to go ahead and try to make a similar tool I have had bouncing around in my head for a while now. Thanks for posting the pics and all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judson Yaggy Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Tools get patented if original enough and economically advantageous to the inventor. Songs, stories, instructive texts and explanations of the verbal or written variety (inc. computer programs) get copyrighted. Ads, logos, touchmarks get trademarked. This is a simplification and definitions are constantly being stretched. There is a lifetime of study in the details and legality of the above. I really liked Jerry Hoffman's Blacksmith's Journal, I started subscribing back in the mid 1990's and learned more from his magazine than perhaps any other source outside of ABANA. To get back on topic, David, I like the wide working length of your dies, you could grind 2 or even 3 shapes into one set of dies. You could work your stock progressively along the die. Put the final shape closest to the pivot because the stock will be at it's coldest and you will need the mechanical advantage of the lever and because the final refinement of the shape should need less movement of the die. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Gaddis Posted January 11, 2013 Author Share Posted January 11, 2013 Thanks all. This was my "prototype" as the great carpenter from up North would say. In the beginning while the idea was on drawing board (soapstone and concrete floor) plans were to for multiple events along the knife edge. So things get out of hand and proportions get stretched. And this was not to "machinist's specs" either, but at home at the smithy specs with a whole lot of "T.L.A.R.", or that looks about right. In the end it seems appropriate that the "smithin magician" would be a lot more economical than first thought, despite to whomever owns the rights, I do not care. Certainly I am not going to steal from the fellow while I wish him well. My attempt here is not to belittle him in any way at all. Heck, I would enjoy meeting him and visiting with him if he is still alive. I hope he is. For others: If you are going to construct one similar to the one I built then consider the thickness of the knife edges. !/2 inch may be a little thin unless making a hotcut. And fullers may need to have an additional surface welded at the knife edge position...so that the proper fullering diameter to be carried out. If welding 5150 then remember it likes to be preheated generously prior to welding. Good luck with your projects and Carry on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuge Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 Nice one. Yup, would be nice if it the dies were a tad wider so you can get in there later w/o shunts but I would use this one a ton as well. I always thought the "smithin magician" term had gained notoriety kinda like kleenex. Heck, Hoffman (love love his drawings) didn't even come up with the moniker. Check the story here- http://www.metalsmith.org/pub/mtlsmith/V16.4/magi.html Some really great usage ideas there as well. And man I wish I could render drawings like that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 From the above link a tool guide that used top and bottom tools made from bar stock. Don Asbee (one of our founding fathers) nicknamed it the "Smithin' Magician"; a take off from a spot on local television for a product called the Kitchen Magician. Giving credit to Don Asbee, where it is due Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryM Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 This is a picture that I found online years ago. I can't tell you where but it looks pretty easy to build. The thing I like about it, is the replaceable blades. If anyone knows who's picture this is please chime in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 Looks good David, you'll come to love it given time. I do have one suggestion someone made to me after he used mine. If the blade can be aligned near the anvil's edge it opens up another whole dimension you can approach the die from. Say you want to cut part of a piece that's bent at a 90* angle with other bends before and after the cut. Doing it over the anvil face limits how much you can tilt the work. Having all the room off the anvil allows much more flexibility in positioning the work. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Gaddis Posted January 12, 2013 Author Share Posted January 12, 2013 At first I had no idea what you were talking about....but then I studied your idea. well I like that a bunch. Of course it is not nearly as good as the one you posted about previously....however I am a little short on some "good" building metal. This is my first one of these things I have built and already see many required improvements. And straightening out the spring steel from its original arch is a subtle problem that makes pivoting difficult. Thanks to all that comment. Carry on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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