MIG welders.

[MoleDoc]

SO here's a question for the old pros:

If you were going to get a new MIG welder for you garage/forge in the making, what features would you look for and do you recommend any specific brands or models?
My limitations: 110V outlets and no talent whatsoever:D

Suggestions?

Ted
Escondido, CA

[Thomas Dean]

Go the extra $$ and buy a Miller (Hobart or Lincoln in that order) Miller and Hobart are more user friendly. You will be extremely limited on what you can weld tho. I would buy an Oxy/gas rig and learn to gas weld, more versital given all you have is 110v. If you have no votech school or such in your area check with your local High School and see if they have such and 'bribe' the teacher to teach you to use the torch for cutting and welding. You can pick up a torch set for little $$ compared to a MIG welder and all you can do with the welder is weld...

[Flaming S Forge]

I have been using a Lincoln welder for over 10 years. The model is SP-100. It can use either flux core wire or if I choose to hook up the gas and change some wires around it will use the solid mig wire. If you plan to weld thin stuff like sheet metal, the shielding gas is necessary. I have only ever used flux core wire with it. Most of the welding I do is under 1/4". Migs have two main controls. Wire speed and amps. Look for one that has more than just a high and low amp setting. My Lincoln has settings from letter A to J. It gives you more control depending on the heat you need for different thickness metals. My back up welder is a Century brand which was made for Lincoln in Poland. Cost was about half of the Lincoln. It only has a high and low heat setting and doesn't have the rugged features as the true Lincoln. It works okay for what it is but the true Lincoln is my every day unit. Miller is another top of the line brand. They market the Hobart brand which I never owned but it is supposed to be a good choice also. Hope this gives you some usefull info.

[moya034]

Miller is just about to come out with a new model, the Millermatic 211 with auto set. It seems like quite the machine, it works on both 110v and 220v circuits and is spool gun ready (which means you can get the accessories needed for welding aluminum.)

In any event, I highly encourage you to try and get a good 220v circuit ran. The most important tool any welder has is good electricity. Even if you have to spend a few hundred dollars on an electrician, it's well worth it in the long run.

[tompdw]

If you are dead set on 110 Hobart has one or two. It's not that much if you have an electrician set you up with a 220v if you have the box space. That way down the line you could save up for a ac/dc stick.

[frogvalley]

I use a Millermatic 135, that model is now a 140. Can weld 1/4'' in one pass, thicker in several passes. 3 year warranty, never had any trouble and its totally abused all the time. Infinite control on feed and juice. Its 110 only, but there is an upsize that will do 110 or 220 and will weld thicker stock.

I also have a great Maxstar 150 STL Tig/Stick by Miller. Its one of the little inverter styles, 150 amps and works magic from 110 or 220. Switches automatically. Only weighs 14 lbs and i can strap it across my shoulder and work from a ladder or use it with its remote control torch and long leads.

Don't knock the 110 machines, you can't drag a big Lincoln buzz box into a clients home to weld a delicate railing job together. I can plug my box into any normal outlet and weld away.

I almost never need the extra umph that 220 will get me. 110 tig or stick or mig is great to start and fine for the long term.

[Ten Hammers]

My first experience with MIG was on a Lincoln weld pac100. 115VAC. This was in I guess 1994. Farm store setup, cored wire in 1# rolls.

Stick was used to build welda-hub units as needed for mostly AG applications along with other other needs. The mig was there but virtually nobody used it. Everybody seemed to thing it was for "sheet metal stuff " only. While the welder had limitations it really did a good job inside the envelope so to speak. I built a headache/bed rail rack for my 63 pickup with this welder. 1 x 3 tubing ( capped ends ) for the bed rails and 1 1/4 tubing for the uprights and crossbars on top ( all 11 ga ). Still on the truck today. I have hauled ( overloaded ) more than the truck or unit should haul. Good strong welds. I would NOT buy such a unit today due to the expereince I have gained in MIG over the years. Electronics make a big difference. The newer units of this brand and size are perhaps better.

I bought a Miller 172 wire welder in 1998. 10 lb roll capacity serves my needs here at home. Infinite wire and infinite voltage controls make a major difference. This welder was the low end of the Miller 230 VAC choices at the time. Should have bought a 251 unit BUT I have learned many things on this unit.

I have welded with Lincoln ( and Miller and ESAB) larger units in industrial settings. CA/CV and pulse. these units give you the blessing of power and very large capacities. Stack welding ( root/gouge/grind/cap passes) makes for interesting learning curve. Pulse stack welding with perhaps a needle scaler between passes is very nice.

All this is very nice but does not answer the original question. I lost a set of points in my Miller here at home a few years ago. Borrowed one of my son in law's Hobart Handler 175 ( also 230 vac unit) while my unit was at service center. Some difference ( plastic feed rollers vs my steel rollers on the Miller, different gun and consumables ) but I was really tickled to have it available. Served my needs for the time.

Yes I would definitely look into updating my shop to 230vac. If you live in a residential area the codes may frown on you starting a welding shop. YMMV. As suggested I would look into training. A fab shop drop bin and/or scrap bin will give you plenty of 16-14-12-10-1/4 pieces to make corner and butt joints for practice. Running flat welds on steel for practice is limited but does work. You can only read so much on the internet. Some books will tell you that you should NEVER use more than 11-12 volts due to the crystaline structure ( yada yada ). THere will be some truth in all books but if you have no experience you don't know where to go. This of course includes smithing.

I started welding with stick as a young man. I was later trained with oxyfuel ( acetelyne). Knowing what you are looking at when you see the puddle is the key regardless of process or technique. This is where to start in my opinion. I make mistakes most every day and try to learn from them. There are so many variables they can not all be addressed ( from farm applications to Boyd Coddington ). also, spelling has never been my strongest suit. :)

Edited January 2, 2009 by Ten Hammers

[unkle spike]

I have a Hobart 180 220V machine, with the gas and hard wire.

I would have no problem recommending the Hobart brand.

Go the extra mile whatever you choose and get the bottle of 75/25 and run with gas and ERS70S-6 wire for mild steel, you won't be sorry. The flux has it's place, but is very dirty, and harder to weld with. I buy the Hobart wire also at Tractor Supply, it is worth the extra money over Harbour Freight wire. I am one of the cheapest people in the world, but welding is one place I won't skimp.

[markb]

Miller,Hobart, Lincoln not in any order.
Good product support, been around a long time, good resale value.

Read to get the basics-weld-observe-read-weld observe
There are many variables-speed,angles, distance,and welder settings, wire type, gas type etc..

Make one change at a time and observe and weld, weld weld weld weld weld and weld some more.
It's fun.

You'll know when you need a better (bigger) welder then sell or keep the 110v.
Mark

[ChrisB]

I love my Hobart 210 its a 220v machine. I suggest you get a Hobart. They have their own forum that is well watched by Hobart techs. When I got my machine I had a simple question about setup. I picked up the phone dialed the 1800 number and was talking to a real live human in less than 30 seconds.

[otto]

I have the lincoln sp-100 and love it any of the big three will serve you well.......stay away from the china cheapos they suck. I have used a few of the cheap H.F. ones and did not like them one bit

[MoleDoc]

Gentlemen, and all you other guys too:D

Thank you so much for the weath of advice. I may just look into getting a 220 outlet run to my garage.

Any one have any thoughts about the Northern Tool complany's welders? The prices seem reasonable but are they the cheep communist stuff too?

Ted

[unkle spike]

I would avoid HF or NT welders, buy yourself a name brand, Hobart, Lincoln, or Miller.

The investment you make will pay off in ease of use and the quality you can achieve with it. Welders are not like drill bits, you don't throw them away. Eventually you would want to upgrade, save your shillings on the first go around and get a good machine.

[cataulpa_forge1]

SO here's a question for the old pros:

If you were going to get a new MIG welder for you garage/forge in the making, what features would you look for and do you recommend any specific brands or models?
My limitations: 110V outlets and no talent whatsoever:D

Suggestions?

Ted
Escondido, CA

Hi, There are alot of good suggestions here. I would agree with setting up a 220v line. I have a Miller 185A/220V and I really like it. The "duty Cycle" for my welder 60% = I can weld for 6mins straight out of every 10. AND, the penetration depth for mine 3/8". The largest stock I have is 3/4". If I can hit the joint from both sides, I get a 3/4" thick weld. And yes, set yourself up so that if you need to, you can do more that one type of welding. That miller 211 sounds real good...
I hope this helps..... I am a self taught welder. Don't become part of the circut...

Take Care n good luck,
ED/CAT NJ 08088

[cataulpa_forge1]

Gentlemen, and all you other guys too:D

Thank you so much for the weath of advice. I may just look into getting a 220 outlet run to my garage.

Any one have any thoughts about the Northern Tool complany's welders? The prices seem reasonable but are they the cheep communist stuff too?

Ted

Yes, one word, -->> MILLER <<--

"I have never had any trouble with mine."

[Golden_arm]

Well, I'm not an "old pro," but I'd like to chime in if'n it's okay. I think what's been said so far is right.... stick with the higher quality machines like Hobart, Lincoln, and Miller. I've no experience with Hobart, but I've had plenty of time with lincoln and miller. My experience says that Lincoln has a smoother arc and tends to be more forgiving, and miller, when ya get used to them (they're HOT) they are a great welder. When I first began to weld I liked the lincolns a lot, but since I've had some time using a Miller, I'd prefer to stick with the Miller. If you're anything like me you want all you can get out of a tool you're gonna be spending good money on. Sometimes I go overboard and want the pulse mig features and the aluminum capabilities, but if you do just general welding ya won't need that stuff unless you find out you really like doing all sorts of stuff. I'd look into a welder that will weld at least 1/4" inch, but for the budget and the power you need to use you may not find that in a 110 machine. Most of the 110's will run a flux core wire which is good for the heavier stuff...

[MLMartin]

if you have a house built buy a common contractor its almost a sure thing that your waster and dryer have 220 outlets, if there in your garage then your all set, im in college now so am always moving house to house, i simply make many different outlet plugs that fit all the different 220 outlets and have the same female my welder has, so i just go to any new house and unplug the dryer and start welding away. but i dont use a mig, i carry the little miller diynesty with me, wonderful tig welder, great stick, only about 50lbs so not huge but not so small that it would limit my welding. i have a old millermatic 175 but have never used it other than the 5 minuets at my buddy's shop just to see if it worked when i bought it from him. have used smaller millermatic at old job when we were on the road, was desent but took a fair amount of skill to get a good bead, had a few millermatic 200's and a 300 at the workshop, there absolutly wonderful, some of them were pushing 15 years old and they all welded like champs, the millermatic mig welders have always been great welders in my opinion.

[horseshoe182]

In my experience cheap mig welders are a waste of time and money, I,m talkin about the back yard handyman stuff, were every thing is plastic and cheap and nasty. And poor setting serlectons.

Do yourself a faverour and buy a secoundhand good brand name until, if you are restricted by cash. Where you will always have access to spare parts and can keep things rollin along.

I brought and old brand name welder, with more amps than I need, that way I,m not loading up an old machine, and runs like a gem.

Mick

[Finnr]

I have a cheap wirefeed (Clarke) and as soon as I am able it will be replaced. It has been a pain to use.
Finnr

[Dragons lair]

Hey Jeff, try running the flux core with gas. Welds hotter and cleaner.

[1aretea]

I know you are interested in a wire feed welder and they are easy to use but, I would recomend a Stick welder like a Lincoln 225. I had one and ran it of my dryer plug ( 30 amps 220volts) The reason I like a stick welder if you only can have one, this does a lot more that a wire feed machine. For example weld aluminum, cast iron, steel, stainless steel. You can even cut metal, gouge and pierce holes. Just by changing the rods.

[iron giant]

I'm new around these parts but am slowly turning my auto geared Fabrication shop into a more versatile iron working shop. (creative bug finally got me again). I'll echo what has been said and hopefully add a bit more.

1. Definitely Stick to the big three companies. Consumables and product support are everywhere. They are great, reliable machines, and can be found used at an excellent bargain. See if you can't try one first. Also, check on the warranty as the Miller's may have a longer warranty??

2. If you can wire it go 220. A 220 machine is much more versatile and can penetrate much deeper on a single pass. This is really important if you're using a thick material and only want one clean pass.

3. Personally, I would look around for a used Millermatic 175. Usually they can be had with a cart and bottle for around $600-800. Another option that many have great success with are the refurbished Hobarts.

4. I always try and weld with solid wire and gas as I find it makes a much nicer looking weld. Flux core has its place, but if you're working with clean metals in a closed environment, gas will turn better results.

5. Take a class at a JC. They are cheap and full of information. A good friend once said you can't call yourself a welder until you've put down a mile of bead... practice, practice, practice.

[Dodge]

I know you are interested in a wire feed welder and they are easy to use but, I would recomend a Stick welder like a Lincoln 225. I had one and ran it of my dryer plug ( 30 amps 220volts) The reason I like a stick welder if you only can have one, this does a lot more that a wire feed machine. For example weld aluminum, cast iron, steel, stainless steel. You can even cut metal, gouge and pierce holes. Just by changing the rods.

I've never tried, it but the people I have talked to that tried aluminum with stick would find another alternative next time. I.E. TIG or MIG. One job I was on, wouldn't allow anything but TIG on aluminum. Stainless works nice with the correct rod and cast using the proper preheating and nickle rod is passable too, but if I planned plan on doing much aluminum that really counted, I'd go wire or TIG imho. YMMV Also, another advantage of wire over stick; tacking small peices in tight places is much easier with wire. "Point and Zap!" ;) Edited April 9, 2009 by Dodge